(02-19-2011, 11:50 AM)truth be told Wrote: Am I the only that finds it very strange that a couple is murdered inside of the girlfriends parents home....and out of 6-billion people in the world, the people who actually find them dead just happens to be the boyfriend's parents...hmm. I find it hard to believe that they are so much smarter than trained officers. And as far as Maytee having special powers...please! She is as about clairvoyant as Oprah Winfrey is a Lounge singer.
Another thing: why did the parents convienently catch two separate rides over to the house instead of driving one of their vans. It is odd that Maytee had to call her cousin in the middle of the night to come and pick her up to drive her over to the house...instead of driving herself. And if you listen to the very first 9-11 call...Maytee is able to tell the operator the exact adress of the house, it is a four digit address. I'll bet that there aren't a lot of people who know the exact address of their own parents home...yet alone their son's girlfriends parents house. it is clear that Maytee knows more than what she is saying....I sure hope that investigators don't screw this up.

(02-19-2011, 08:35 AM)Momforlife Wrote: First time posting... So bear with me... I live in the area of these murders... And I am surprised how little news we are hearing. Word is there has been an arrest, but I am unable to verify that right now. I don't want to post anything that has not been substantiated. But, will as soon as I hear factual information, I will. I have an opinion on this, as you all do too... But am not comfortable posting it yet...

(02-19-2011, 11:20 AM)HeartBreaker Wrote:

(02-18-2011, 08:08 PM)Snoopy Wrote: You think much like I do LC! From the beginning I have strongly felt this was an intended robbery- and yes, the LE have not implied that it was "random!"
It is my opinion, that the phone call from the "friend" was intended to lure the victims from the home, so that it could be robbed, and that the victims crossed paths with the person (s), who were there to rob the home.

My guess is that, if they were leaving the home- and taking LS's car, which was parked in the garage, the perp(s) were probably in the garage, intending to enter the home through the interior door.

In my opinion, the victims were familiar with their attackers, and this is why they were killed.
The comments that the victim allegedly made, while speaking to their "friend" before the phone went dead, should be taken lightly, since this person would have a self serving reason, to not speak the truth- if they played any part in this crime.

While it is true that this is a horrible crime, and some have stated that the method of using trash bags to kill the victims, shows anger and hatred, the need to punish them, I am not sure I completely agree with this.
My thoughts are, that it could also be a coward way to kill, kind of a hands off approach, it would seem.
In crimes with extreme anger or hatred, you usually will find more violence, beaten beyond recognition- stabbed beyond what it would take to kill someone, overkill, so to speak.

The marks around the neck could indicate the killer(s) did attempt to strangle the victims first.
Strangulation takes a great deal of time, and strength- although it is not always portrayed this way, on t.v. and movies.
Using plastic bags, accomplishes two objectives, 1) left there long enough, the victims will die, and 2) if the killer does know the victims, he does not have to see them, or see the looks on their face.
If the plastic bags did not come from the home, but were brought there by the killers, it could of been to carry away stolen goods- and not necessarily for the purpose to kill.

The fact that not much was taken from the home, may be due to the panic of things getting out of hand, as well as police being sent to the home for a well check- interrupted?

The friend on the phone, did not contact anyone to say something may be wrong for several hours- which indeed lends to much suspicion.
The lapse in time between the events that took place, and the phone calls to alert someone, would have allowed for establishing alibis, getting stories straight, cleaning up potential evidence- then coming forward as a concerned friend, might be an effort to deflect suspicion as well... One could easily say, why would I be calling for help, and worried about them, if I were involved?

Of course, this is all just my take on things, and I do not pretend to be an expert, nor do I imply, there are no other options. It is just the feeling I get, from what information has been released thus far.
This "friend' may not be involved at all, and if I am wrong about that, I will be the first to say so, but something does not sit right with it all, in my opinion.

And I agree with you again LC, that I think the Police have a good idea of what took place and who is involved, and they are collecting evidence -awaiting results on evidence, before moving forward with an arrest.
That arrest, could not come a day too soon!

And its just a guess, but I think there are at least 2 people involved, probably 3, and one will roll on the others (thinking 2 involved in the break in, but at least 1 other, in setting it up- and this is just a guess!)

This was a senseless and terrible crime- May justice come soon!!!

snoopy... i went to bed thinking of your theory... i was completely convinced about it after a first read but then i let it stew a while. while i too find this to be a well thought out theory and agree with the possibility of many points to it (i.e. using plastic bags being a cowardly way to murder, the possibility about the pants)... there are a couple things in your theory that just don't add up for me.
i can't think of a reason that duct tape would be brought to the scene if it was indeed intended to just be a robbery. i can see how bags would be brought to carry away anything intended to take with them but duct tape just doesn't jive with a robbery. (unless we have been misinformed about the fact that these items were indeed brought to the scene rather than found there).
the other thing that doesn't make sense is that if this was intended to be robbery alone... i can't see them leaving with only a few dollars and a pocket full of change. your theory was that they may have panicked and not taken much but it sure seems like they stuck around for a decent amount of time if they were ransacking, punching holes in walls, taking the time to secure the victims, etc.
i agree that this was definitely a partial robbery (i, however, haven't decided whether it was secondary to the murder or not)... it seems they were looking for SOMETHING SPECIFIC (the rumored safe???). like i said earlier... this is going off the information we've heard from the media/family. could they be throwing out false information for some reason??? i don't know if that is a tactic that LE uses or for what reason they would.

(02-19-2011, 01:04 PM)Adub Wrote: I just want to say that I enjoy reading here. I like the freedom a lot. But speaking as a newbie, some of ya'll seem to read something, some comment or info, and then go with it as if it were fact. I tend to keep a more open mind realizing that some comments may have an agenda all their own. And some comments are just made up bullshit. But it's all good. I just wish I had a better understanding of how the gangs operate in Toledo. So whoever said that AP was one of Corrigan's buddies? Where did that come from? Because I am not seeing that.

(02-19-2011, 12:49 PM)Adub Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 12:30 PM)EastCoastKat Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 12:25 PM)Adub Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 12:09 PM)onefortheroad Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 11:30 AM)Adub Wrote: I'm just saying bloods don't use the letter c. Instead they use a 3. Just like crips don't use the letter b. Anything I know comes from gang education classes given by a Gang Task Force. I had to do the training for my job. Where I live the gangs are more defined. Toledo is all mixed up it seems. More tolerant of others maybe? Who knows.

If this is related to gangs then I would look to Johnny's neighborhood before he went to prison. Who was he hanging with then versus after he got out.

Gangs and drugs go together for sure. Such as selling them. And if you are not living the gang lifestyle and you're involved in selling drugs you can get in deep shit. Especially if you take business away for known drug dealing gangsters. The scales in the kitchen say something, imo. And the baggies. And it don't say Percocet.

So Johnny had just recently started hanging out with his childhood friends again. When was the Pro Bowl?

You make some good points, and the killings would have sent a sharp message to Johnny's gang, if he was in one. Tiffany's 'fallen soldier' was a Blood, and so is her current BF (AG, I think, though I gather she gets it on with ZB too). That would make her a Blood too or at least show where her loyalties lie.

I know I'm fixated on TW, but there's no way it was just coincidence that she was there on the night of the murders.

Does anyone know if John Clarke Sr was part of a gang?

No I don't. But he has a facebook with pictures. So if Johnny was trying to get his life straight, why hang out with Tiffany? What did she have to offer in the way of making positive changes in one's life? I look toward Tiffany for answers also. Enjoyed reading her comments on mock. And I do not think she set Johnny and Lisa up. I more or less accept her at face value. For whatever that is worth. And there are, understandably, somethings she ain't saying.

TW met them through the minor, ZB, who allegedly was into percocets heavily. JC was friends with the minor. I believe TW said that was how she met them, she met JC first and then met LS through, ZB and JC, at ZB's house.

I think the relationship runs deeper than ZB. I may be wrong. But one of Corrigans best buddies who has a RIP Corrigan pic as his fb photo (R.i.p. Donald 50 ckal) is closely tied in with Johnny's neighborhood friend that Johnny watched the ProBowl with on the Jan 30^th. And the photo for R.i.p. ckal includes all the "bros" posing gangster style. All the "bros" includes Johnny's old neighborhood friend that he watched the Pro Bowl with. So I do not think Tiffany needed ZB to meet anyone. Tiffany has been around for awile. And imo, ZB is a minor player.

(02-19-2011, 01:11 PM)onefortheroad Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 01:04 PM)Adub Wrote: I just want to say that I enjoy reading here. I like the freedom a lot. But speaking as a newbie, some of ya'll seem to read something, some comment or info, and then go with it as if it were fact. I tend to keep a more open mind realizing that some comments may have an agenda all their own. And some comments are just made up bullshit. But it's all good. I just wish I had a better understanding of how the gangs operate in Toledo. So whoever said that AP was one of Corrigan's buddies? Where did that come from? Because I am not seeing that.

Do you mean AP (Aaron)? I get confused about what to call him. He and Corrigan were arrested together. If I can find a link, I'll PM you.

(02-19-2011, 01:04 PM)Adub Wrote: I just want to say that I enjoy reading here. I like the freedom a lot. But speaking as a newbie, some of ya'll seem to read something, some comment or info, and then go with it as if it were fact. I tend to keep a more open mind realizing that some comments may have an agenda all their own. And some comments are just made up bullshit. But it's all good. I just wish I had a better understanding of how the gangs operate in Toledo. So whoever said that AP was one of Corrigan's buddies? Where did that come from? Because I am not seeing that.

(02-19-2011, 01:14 PM)Adub Wrote: Here is the facebook for Johnny's dad. he has the wall set to private. Photos and friends and is all you get.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000773739904

(02-19-2011, 01:08 PM)catch22 Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 11:20 AM)HeartBreaker Wrote:

(02-18-2011, 08:08 PM)Snoopy Wrote: You think much like I do LC! From the beginning I have strongly felt this was an intended robbery- and yes, the LE have not implied that it was "random!"
It is my opinion, that the phone call from the "friend" was intended to lure the victims from the home, so that it could be robbed, and that the victims crossed paths with the person (s), who were there to rob the home.

My guess is that, if they were leaving the home- and taking LS's car, which was parked in the garage, the perp(s) were probably in the garage, intending to enter the home through the interior door.

In my opinion, the victims were familiar with their attackers, and this is why they were killed.
The comments that the victim allegedly made, while speaking to their "friend" before the phone went dead, should be taken lightly, since this person would have a self serving reason, to not speak the truth- if they played any part in this crime.

While it is true that this is a horrible crime, and some have stated that the method of using trash bags to kill the victims, shows anger and hatred, the need to punish them, I am not sure I completely agree with this.
My thoughts are, that it could also be a coward way to kill, kind of a hands off approach, it would seem.
In crimes with extreme anger or hatred, you usually will find more violence, beaten beyond recognition- stabbed beyond what it would take to kill someone, overkill, so to speak.

The marks around the neck could indicate the killer(s) did attempt to strangle the victims first.
Strangulation takes a great deal of time, and strength- although it is not always portrayed this way, on t.v. and movies.
Using plastic bags, accomplishes two objectives, 1) left there long enough, the victims will die, and 2) if the killer does know the victims, he does not have to see them, or see the looks on their face.
If the plastic bags did not come from the home, but were brought there by the killers, it could of been to carry away stolen goods- and not necessarily for the purpose to kill.

The fact that not much was taken from the home, may be due to the panic of things getting out of hand, as well as police being sent to the home for a well check- interrupted?

The friend on the phone, did not contact anyone to say something may be wrong for several hours- which indeed lends to much suspicion.
The lapse in time between the events that took place, and the phone calls to alert someone, would have allowed for establishing alibis, getting stories straight, cleaning up potential evidence- then coming forward as a concerned friend, might be an effort to deflect suspicion as well... One could easily say, why would I be calling for help, and worried about them, if I were involved?

Of course, this is all just my take on things, and I do not pretend to be an expert, nor do I imply, there are no other options. It is just the feeling I get, from what information has been released thus far.
This "friend' may not be involved at all, and if I am wrong about that, I will be the first to say so, but something does not sit right with it all, in my opinion.

And I agree with you again LC, that I think the Police have a good idea of what took place and who is involved, and they are collecting evidence -awaiting results on evidence, before moving forward with an arrest.
That arrest, could not come a day too soon!

And its just a guess, but I think there are at least 2 people involved, probably 3, and one will roll on the others (thinking 2 involved in the break in, but at least 1 other, in setting it up- and this is just a guess!)

This was a senseless and terrible crime- May justice come soon!!!

snoopy... i went to bed thinking of your theory... i was completely convinced about it after a first read but then i let it stew a while. while i too find this to be a well thought out theory and agree with the possibility of many points to it (i.e. using plastic bags being a cowardly way to murder, the possibility about the pants)... there are a couple things in your theory that just don't add up for me.
i can't think of a reason that duct tape would be brought to the scene if it was indeed intended to just be a robbery. i can see how bags would be brought to carry away anything intended to take with them but duct tape just doesn't jive with a robbery. (unless we have been misinformed about the fact that these items were indeed brought to the scene rather than found there).
the other thing that doesn't make sense is that if this was intended to be robbery alone... i can't see them leaving with only a few dollars and a pocket full of change. your theory was that they may have panicked and not taken much but it sure seems like they stuck around for a decent amount of time if they were ransacking, punching holes in walls, taking the time to secure the victims, etc.
i agree that this was definitely a partial robbery (i, however, haven't decided whether it was secondary to the murder or not)... it seems they were looking for SOMETHING SPECIFIC (the rumored safe???). like i said earlier... this is going off the information we've heard from the media/family. could they be throwing out false information for some reason??? i don't know if that is a tactic that LE uses or for what reason they would.

a few possible explanations:

first, with the duct tape, i believe it was brought to bind the victims. maybe the perps were planning on lisa telling them where/ opening the safe for them? could be why her feet/legs weren't bound if they ordered her to show them where it was?

i've also wondered if the whole "safe" story is something thrown out there by LE as some tactic to help them solve this case.

but taken at face value, it appears that the perps were there for the safe and/or alleged cash in it. i can totally understand why the perps wouldn't take anything else. anything they took would become great evidence as to who commited these crimes if they were caught possessing some of the straub's property. and they would be even more likely to get caught if they sold the stolen property and it eventually got traced back to them.

(02-19-2011, 01:14 PM)Adub Wrote: Here is the facebook for Johnny's dad. he has the wall set to private. Photos and friends and is all you get.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000773739904

(02-19-2011, 12:53 PM)sharit Wrote: i own a cleaning service and most all place that i clean have alarms. i have never seen 1 which uses a key, never. yes they do have logs and if wire were cut the security service would know this and send LE.once you enter building you have 45 seconds to disarm, or le will be on there way.

(02-19-2011, 01:19 PM)EastCoastKat Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 01:14 PM)Adub Wrote: Here is the facebook for Johnny's dad. he has the wall set to private. Photos and friends and is all you get.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000773739904

Yeah, I have seen that before. Looks like he may have been into that muscle building stuff that men take to get those huge muscles, I thought that about JS too, some pictures they are all pumped up and then in others it looks normal..so I wonder.

(02-19-2011, 01:23 PM)onefortheroad Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 01:14 PM)Adub Wrote: Here is the facebook for Johnny's dad. he has the wall set to private. Photos and friends and is all you get.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000773739904

Thanks! I can see from his page that Johnny must have been on FB at one time too....

(02-19-2011, 12:53 PM)sharit Wrote: i own a cleaning service and most all place that i clean have alarms. i have never seen 1 which uses a key, never. yes they do have logs and if wire were cut the security service would know this and send LE.once you enter building you have 45 seconds to disarm, or le will be on there way.

(02-19-2011, 01:27 PM)EastCoastKat Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 01:23 PM)onefortheroad Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 01:14 PM)Adub Wrote: Here is the facebook for Johnny's dad. he has the wall set to private. Photos and friends and is all you get.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000773739904

Thanks! I can see from his page that Johnny must have been on FB at one time too....

How can you see that? I'm curious....

(02-19-2011, 01:06 PM)Countryside_Belle Wrote: [quote='Momforlife' pid='130663' dateline='1298118930']
First time posting... So bear with me... I live in the area of these murders... And I am surprised how little news we are hearing. Word is there has been an arrest, but I am unable to verify that right now. I don't want to post anything that has not been substantiated. But, will as soon as I hear factual information, I will. I have an opinion on this, as you all do too... But am not comfortable posting it yet...

(02-19-2011, 01:19 PM)EastCoastKat Wrote:

(02-19-2011, 01:14 PM)Adub Wrote: Here is the facebook for Johnny's dad. he has the wall set to private. Photos and friends and is all you get.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000773739904

Yeah, I have seen that before. Looks like he may have been into that muscle building stuff that men take to get those huge muscles, I thought that about JS too, some pictures they are all pumped up and then in others it looks normal..so I wonder.