(02-22-2011, 10:52 PM)Adub Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 10:41 PM)wanttoknow Wrote: thank you

For what?

And really. Who says that the Straubs house has a basement?

(02-22-2011, 11:22 PM)ToledoNative Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 11:18 PM)Lady Cop Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 11:14 PM)ToledoNative Wrote: I agree with Lady Cop and whoever else said it on here...

Johnny and Lisa pulled the car into the garage and left the garage door open, since they figured they would be leaving soon.

Johnny and Lisa were on the phone with Tiffany when Johnny said he was walking out the kitchen door that connects to the garage, along come the intruders.

The altercation takes place immediately in the kitchen and they are killed. If this is what happened, then they were killed as soon as the intruders came in, which means this is not a "robbery gone bad".

they still could have been there seeking the "safe". but imagine...Johnny grabs a knife when he sees the danger and life or death struggle ensues.
i still don't believe murder was the intent. but it escalated. so they used what was at hand, household items.

i may well change my thinking when more details emerge from LE. but that was my initial reaction when it was first reported.

Ok, I got you LC, but was there not a news article that said that the Straub family said the tape was not from their home?

Correct me if I am wrong.

And like someone else on here said (sorry, can't remember the name that many posts back) why in the world would you bring tape to a robbery? To tape your bags shut? No.

(02-22-2011, 11:04 PM)LoserCity Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 10:56 PM)Jane Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 10:52 PM)Adub Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 10:41 PM)wanttoknow Wrote: thank you

For what?

And really. Who says that the Straubs house has a basement?

Maytee told the 911 dispatcher, her son was tied up in the basement. Also, another "local" poster said there was a basement, where the pool table is. That's all I've heard of a basement

Go here and type in Lisa's address (according to 911 call). There IS a basement. You can actually see a sketch of the entire property. http://maps.co.lucas.oh.us/areis/areis.asp
:O

(02-22-2011, 11:22 PM)TotallyCurious Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 10:40 PM)Jane Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 09:57 PM)Adub Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 09:48 PM)IMaDick Wrote: So does anyone want to speculate as to why they were murdered in the kitchen? you do know that the kitchen is an unusual room for a homicide to occur in in a home invasion crime of this nature. especially in a home that has a basement which by all accounts this home did have.

Where did you hear there was a basement? And don't say Maytee told you

lol, well Maytee DID tell the 911 dispatcher that Johnny was tied up, in the basement ?

Perhaps the perpetrator had been abused as a child in a kitchen.

(02-22-2011, 03:11 PM)RaisingAPrince Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 01:05 PM)shitstorm Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 07:13 AM)Jane Wrote: I put a pot of coffee on, & have been reading like crazy. Below is the Nancy Grace transcript, for the interview with Lisa Strub's Uncle (Mr Verbosky) As of this interview, he says the Straub's have been talking to local LE & FBI, daily. He also says he "believes the car was in the driveway"... And since there were no fresh footprints in the snow, anywhere around the home, that's how they figure the perps got in, via the garage door, that leads into the home. He says the driveway was clear, & so were the roads. He even states the garage door would have been up.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1102/04/ng.01.html

From that transcript, just so everyone is clear on the name:

I get a phone call about a half an hour ago from his friend [i]Sherita that some girl named Tiffany called her saying that Johnny and Lisa were supposed to pick her up at 11:00...[/i]

So, where is Sherita in all of the FB friends lists?

It keeps getting asked "Where is Sherita's FB". Obviously not EVERY PERSON has a facebook. IE: LadyCop! I know it's hard for people to believe, but perhaps she doesn't have one?

(02-22-2011, 11:41 PM)Lady Cop Wrote: Lady Cop,

How smart would it be to use tape at a crime scene?


dumb as a stump. i said that back at the very outset also. tape is just a wonderful medium to collect prints and DNA. and tough to work with tape with latex gloves. leather gloves maybe.

and we have no idea what Lisa would or would not have chosen to wear.

(02-23-2011, 12:16 AM)jenjen Wrote: Wondering if this has ever been addressed, if so please forgive.....

According to the Sheriff's Department the first crews responded to the residence at 1:21 a.m. and stayed for approx. 7 minutes....1:28 a.m.

The second call was dispatched at 2:08 a.m. and they stayed approx. 36 minutes, which would make it 2:44 a.m.

The third call, when the bodies were found, was at 3:50 a.m.

WHAT were the Clarke's and the cousin doing from
2:44 until 3:50 when the bodies were discovered.

As I see it, 1 hour and 6 minutes is unaccounted for.
Am I missing something??

(02-22-2011, 03:53 AM)shitstorm Wrote:

(02-21-2011, 06:45 PM)Duchess Wrote:

I've been reading some transcripts. How does the male caller know this was planned & "they" went to the house with tape & bags?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whoever did do this...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Needs to pay!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... they planned it. They planned it because they went to that house with tape and bags. I hope and pray the cops find them before I do!

I remember that. Johnny's dad. Can't recall what it was on (news clip, I guess). I can see why he would say that because finding Johnny & Lisa in that condition, it would seem, would look so DELIBERATE. It's been my feeling all along that this was premeditated murder and I think the perps brought the tape.

(02-22-2011, 03:59 AM)Jane Wrote:

(02-21-2011, 06:16 PM)toledoarea Wrote: Gangs have money. They have computers. Gangs love so show success by showing money guns clothes. Facebook is huge. What better way to flaunt your valuables. cars, money, guns, girls.

never thought of that, hmmm

(02-23-2011, 12:43 AM)Miss Conspiracy Wrote: Well I had written up my theory but I lost it somehow! my luck, of course! lol Anyway, I think the post by "Grieving Friend" held A LOT of information and the two common denominators in all of this - Mr. Z and Ms T. According to GF (Grieving Friend), earlier that very night, Mr. Z was calling around trying to illicit money from GF's mom. Now let's go back a little bit to what Tiff said here.

She had been to LS house twice before - with Mr. Z. She seemed to be hanging out A LOT with Mr. Z lately, so much that Mr. Z's mom thought the two were dating. Also, according to Mr. Z's mom, he was in very bad shape, in withdrawal from percocets. This is something I have been thinking:

Tiffany was at Mr. Z's house on this night. According to Tiff (she said this here at Mock), hanging out with JC/LS was not planned in advance, it was a spontaneous invite from JC/LS that night while they were talking on the phone. My question is, why was Tiff talking to LS on the phone in the first place (my opinion: the drugs/percs)? During the conversation is when JC/LS supposedly invited Tiff over. However, what about Mr. Z, who invited him? By Tiff's own words she was going to go with Mr.Z, but this was a spontaneous invite, so when did she have a chance to talk to Mr. Z about going over to LS house? And what was his mode of transportation to get there? - this leads me to believe Tiff and Mr. Z were together - at his house. At the time of this call.

The mom, who is mentioned in Grieving Friend's post, is the very mom that Tiff talked about here, her words she "woke my friend's (Z's) mom up, and used her car" to get to the residence.I believe they weren't waiting for a ride, they just went ahead and took Z's mom's car and went to the house.

Tiffany and Z go over to the house, however, the police state there were NO footprints. that's because, they did go through the garage, since they know very well how to get into the house through the garage. Could Mr.Z have gone in through the garage at that point, and THIS is when everything went down. REMEMBER, Tiff's cell phone records will STILL SHOW that she talked to JC/LS earlier that night, and I believe she made the "who are you, what are you doing here" story to cover herself, however, that conversation never took place. It was just the regular convo about drugs, and being invited to the house, and possibly told by JC that he had drugs at the house to do/sell. At this point, Z is broke and needs money, wants money and/or drugs, and knows just where to get it (JC/LS house - he knows how nice the house is, that the parents are out, and that JC has drugs/money). Remember, he ~allegedly~ tried to illicit money from someone else earlier that night, and also supposedly stole a cell phone and laptop afterward - this kid was desperate.

SOMETHING went down at the house between Z and JC. that's what I believe. I'm not entirely sure Tiff was involved physically. She might have been present, she might not have even entered the home. Perhaps it all started friendly, with them all hanging out, but at this point it sounds like Z was a little out of control (coming off withdrawal). He had no money to buy the percs. JC had the percs, but he was not willing to share without getting payment. This is when I think a confrontation/fight/struggle broke out. Because Z wanted the percs, but had no money, he went after JC for it. I don't believe Lisa was present at the time, but was probably upstairs about to change, when she hears the struggle and comes down. At this time, Z has already overpowered JC. Yes, you may be thinking JC is a big guy and how can Z overpower him? I'm certain JC had NO idea his friend would attack him, and I believe it was a suprise attack. By then he has already subdued JC when Lisa enters. She freaks, so Z immediately hits LS with an object (causing the bleeding to her head) so that she doesn't get away so quickly. She's next to get tied up, and get the bag.

NONE of this was planned! Things escalated, a fight broke out for one reason or another, things just got out of control (i blame The First 48 for me thinking this too lol! many murders involving drugs are unexpected/escalated/unplanned!). The reason it took soo long for them to contact someone, anyone, else.. was because they were THERE and the struggle took quiet a while. So you might ask, why didn't they just take off and act like nothing ever happened instead of calling attention to themselves? Because the PHONE records would SHOW that a) Tiff talked to JC/LS and b) the pings would put them at the house. They had to explain that, right? The story of Tiff calling and hearing the struggle is FALSE! This was, as LC said, a red herring, to both cover the phone call as well as point LE into thinking the assailants were UNKNOWN to the victims.

They called Sharita FROM LS house, as all reports show. Because again, they had BEEN there all along. Tiff's story about how she got worried after an hour of not hearing back from JC is FALSE! she had to explain that time (the time of the struggle) away, and that's the story she is using. If her story was true about her going to the house to check up on them after not hearing from them, where were her footprints? She went up to the front door, according to her, not the garage, so wouldn't she have left footprints?

I believe when they originally went to the house, the garage door was open, they parked inside and closed the garage door. They also exited the garage and closed it, Which explains when the cops go there they saw nothing (no footprints because T/Z went in thru the garage).

From then on, I believe the stories in the news are true. Tiff goes and picks up the dad and we all know the rest. I want to know though, was Mr.Z also there when she went to pick up the father? That would say A LOT. If he was there too, that would back up my theory that they both went to the home originally and never left.

If anyone can find any holes in my scenario above PLEASE let me know! This all came to me in one night, after reading 300+ pages here on this case. What really set my flag off was, what was the COMMON denominator throughout this whole things? That is Mr. Z (who hasn't been talked about as much) and Ms. T. I could be TOTALLY wrong and OFF BASE and I have not thought of any loopholes that there can be yet.

The only thing I can think of us Tiff's claims that she called JC back right away and texted LS a few times right after she supposedly heard the struggle. That would be hard for me to explain away as to why she would be sending concerned texts to Lisa. I would really want to see if there is proof of these calls/texts from Tiff right after the inital phone call.

Again just wanted to reiterate that this was a totally unexpected event, and because Tiff is a DOWN ASS BITCH, she is not going to snitch on Mr. Z, regardless of if it was intentional or not. Plus of course the fact that she was involved (again, I honestly don't think she expect what happened, to happen)

(02-23-2011, 12:53 AM)toledoarea Wrote: I'm not sure if you've seen this Mr. Z or not, but looking at him in the infamous picture and then looking at some of Johnny's pictures, even with Johnny's hands duct taped behind his back, I think Johnny would destroy this Mr. Z guy. No matter how strung out or desperate for drugs he was. Let's face it, Johnny had did jail time and was a fairly large young man. Some 135lbs minor is not gonna overpower Johnny. Now if you're saying Tiff, Mr. Z, and maybe two other guys that fit in the toyota carrola drove over to the house and overpowered Johnny and Lisa, that I'd believe. Mind you, although Tiffany is a capital E for Ediot, she is pregnant. A mother with even a little bit of common sense would avoid a physical confrontation with the thought of a miscarriage. One would hope anyway

(02-23-2011, 01:40 AM)Miss Conspiracy Wrote:

(02-23-2011, 01:30 AM)Spalding Wrote:

(02-23-2011, 01:24 AM)Miss Conspiracy Wrote:

(02-23-2011, 01:16 AM)Spalding Wrote:

(02-23-2011, 01:10 AM)Miss Conspiracy Wrote: also to add to this.. I doubt they went to the house with weapons. First because they didn't anticipate the attack, and I don't think someone as young and broke as Z could get a gun. He could have perhaps had a pocket knife

Then how would he have subdued a bigger man without leaving any other signs of significant trauma (as disseminated by LE)?

I don't think it's impossible. And there's always the chance that there was a 2^nd man there

I don't mean to be argumentative, but it's some serious shit to tie up and torture-kill two people in their own house when one of them is a weight-lifter who spent time in prison. If the perps end up being a 17-year-old weakling and a pregnant lady, I would be shocked.

I take no issue to it at all.. I invite debate, ideas and finding loopholes in my theory. I agree it would be shocking, but not as shocking as the mother being involved. To that, I have to say no chance in hell the mother is at all involved.

this story is just so compelling because of the amount of people that can be in the suspect pool.

- the mother (no way in hell! IMO)
- tiffany
- mr. z
- any other of their shady friends
- Lisa's stalking ex (I highly doubt this one)
- JC's fellow co-robber who JC allegedly snitched on (his name escapes me at the moment)
- or any friend of the co-robber
- tiffany's dead ex's gang ties (I believe a connection was made here w/JC being friends with the guy that killed Donald)
-Cuban mafia or gang (mafia, unlikely. Could be gang related though)
- the one guy that sells the Snitch shirts, who expressed that 2 people had pain, suffering and death coming to them
- or of course, could be totally RANDOM robbery, with perfect strangers.

did I leave anyone off? lol

(02-23-2011, 01:58 AM)toledoarea Wrote: The word around town is that Maytee has family in cuba with deep ties to drugs and drug cartels. Years ago John Sr was busted with alot of heroin. He is out of jail a little early considering his criminal history along with the amount of drugs he was busted with. Maybe he snitched, who knows? These drug cartels don't play. They may not do something to you, but they might hurt your most valuable possesion(johnny jr.) for revenge. Maybe John Sr worked for Maytee's family in the drug profession. Anyway, the murders were so professional that the FBI is involved. Why? Because the fish is too big to fry for local LE. Think about it. It's been almost a month with no word of any suspects. Do you really think that these low life chumps that hangs with Tiffany could commit such a murder that the FBI is involved and they still have no clues. This was a professional hit, period. Maybe Maytee knew she owed money and told these hit men where money could be found (lisas house). Maybe Maytee said "okay, I know we owe money. We don't have it, but we know where money is" Lisas house with a safe. Maybe Maytee told these hitmen to go to lisas while Johnny was picking up lisa from work. Being that these guys are from Cuba, maybe they didn't know where longacre ln was and was still there robbing the place when Johnny and lisa came back home. Maybe Maytee set it up so that Johnny would go pick up Tiffany with Lisa after Lisa got off work to make sure the house was robbed first. Maybe Lisa told Johnny she wanted to change out of her stinky restaurant clothes first before they went anywhere. Who knows? Regardless, this was a professional hit, we'll never know who did it, and the people that do know don't want bags over their heads.

(02-23-2011, 02:25 AM)imsuchawildflower Wrote:

(02-23-2011, 02:13 AM)shitstorm Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 08:51 PM)ZEROSPHERES Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 07:54 PM)JustSayin... Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 07:51 PM)HeartBreaker Wrote: zero... that thought has crossed my mind a few times. i know that the uncle reported that there was not a safe in the house and he is seemingly a reliable source. the only reason i can think for him to announce there wasn't a safe if there really was is maybe to get someone to open their big mouth... you know
"naw man... those bytches be lian. we busted the shyt out that safe."

i don't know... i guess always a possibility... maybe far fetched though.

p.s. how was my first attempt at ghetto talk?

yo!! Justsayin..
u got da talk down..lol....

Here is that video where Maytee explains with her hands the way the tape was on her son and the remnants left in a bag near the body. Can you give me an opinion why there are no tears streaming down from her eyes. I have lost someone dear to me and the last thing I could hide were my tears.

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvg/story?section=news/local&id=7938127

That was the video that a few of us found rather unsettling. There are no tears. She seems distraught but no tears. Really strange. And at the end she says, "There is no apologizing for what you have done to my son." That's the understatement of the century. Apologizing??? Does anyone find that a super weird choice of words?

Regarding the bags: Anyone violently attacks and duct tapes two people up and puts plastic bags over their heads, THEY MEAN TO KILL, PERIOD. To even entertain any other idea is not right, to put it mildly. Whoever did this is/are psychopaths. I still stand by premeditated murder, too. This was not an afterthought.

Havent you ever cried so much that the tears quit coming but your body, so to speak is still crying? Its happened to me...
Plus, what about a mother wanting justice, and knowing that she has to pull herself together enough to be able to get this out to the public.
I see her in this video as a mom fighting for her son, and justice.

(02-22-2011, 11:31 PM)ToledoNative Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 11:26 PM)kfran Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 11:18 PM)ToledoNative Wrote:

(02-22-2011, 11:14 PM)ToledoNative Wrote: I agree with Lady Cop and whoever else said it on here...

Johnny and Lisa pulled the car into the garage and left the garage door open, since they figured they would be leaving soon.

Johnny and Lisa were on the phone with Tiffany when Johnny said he was walking out the kitchen door that connects to the garage, along come the intruders.

The altercation takes place immediately in the kitchen and they are killed. If this is what happened, then they were killed as soon as the intruders came in, which means this is not a "robbery gone bad".

Here's where you all got me thinking...

Tiffany said she did not hear Lisa's voice in the background when Johnny was arguing and hanging up the phone.

Was she, in fact, upstairs changing out of her work clothes? This would make sense. Did she start to change, hear Johnny downstairs and come running down with these pink and black pants that were found under her?

Would she wear pink and black interband pants?? And what are they anyway?

Interband pants are pants/leggings that alternate colors in stipe form i.e.; black-pink-black-pink

I doubt Lisa would wear something like that, judging from all the pics I've seen of her. Her "gangsta" friends wouldn't be caught dead in that, no pun intended.

So many just weird things collected from the crime scene. Like the pants, the key (leaving a key behind could be damning evidence), PIECES of white bags, tape. HELLO! TAPE! That stuff grabs all DNA, hair fibers, clothing fibers. You'd have to be an idiot gangsta wannabe to use tape at a crime scene.

(02-23-2011, 12:02 AM)ToledoNative Wrote: THIS GOES OUT TO TIFFANY'S CREW AND ANYONE INVOLVED:

CALL CRIMESTOPPERS OR YOUR LOCAL POLICE, GET THAT $$$ CHECK $$$, CASH IT, PUT THE MONEY IN AN ACCOUNT OF ONE OF YOUR RELATIVES (INCASE YOU END UP HAVING TO DO A LITTLE TIME), AND DO ALL THIS BEFORE THE DNA RESULTS COME BACK AND THE ARREST IS MADE.

YA'LL ARE GOING TO MISS OUT ON THAT MONEY, HOMIES!!

(02-22-2011, 11:31 PM)ToledoNative Wrote: You'd have to be an idiot gangsta wannabe to use tape at a crime scene.

(02-22-2011, 11:34 PM)ToledoNative Wrote: How smart would it be to use tape at a crime scene?