Post: #29

I only taught in Japan (great professional teachers and awesome administration) and some graduate classes on the side here in the US years ago (not as a career).

I never got to know the other teachers here because I was contracted -- drove to the campus, taught the courses, drove off. But, we've got two high school teachers in the family now. Their assessment of the professional academic environment is the same as yours; so, they don't mingle with their colleagues much. They always have funny stories about their students and classroom adventures though (and love having the summers off).

Post: #30

That's not a poem, that's the lyrics to the next Love Parade anthem!

If they haven't done that already. I could actually here that running constantly in an elevator of a building full of "Live Male Nude Dancers" in Sydney. They would so love that shit!

Post: #31

(03-09-2015 07:10 AM)Mohammed Wrote:  That's not a poem, that's the lyrics to the next Love Parade anthem!

If they haven't done that already. I could actually here that running constantly in an elevator of a building full of "Live Male Nude Dancers" in Sydney. They would so love that shit!

Seriously, the man wrote a poem (it is a poem!, albeit unconventional) back in 1968 that could probably still raise a few penciled-in eyebrows at a love parade in San Francisco, Amsterdam or Sydney today -- 47 years later. It's difficult to elicit a strong reaction from most unsheltered Americans, Dutch, Australians, and Hungarian-Krauts in this day and age, much less in a community like Mock. But, there it is...

I think your elevator idea could be a winner Mo, but the Australian Nudist Union of Stair-elevatorists (ANUS) would have to put Mr. Ginsberg's "not obscene" (according to the US Supreme Court's ruling on "Howl", and I agree) words to music for the piece to really succeed, I imagine.

What do you think?: 'Please Master' in rap, heavy metal, pop, revival disco, techno, R&B? I say give it to Ian Anderson -- I seriously think that man could make it work.

Post: #32

I don't see it as a poem either. It's a graphic sex ode and I'd be equally bothered by it if the subject matter were heterosexual as opposed to gay sex. Again, sledgehammer hitting thumb tack. I'd personally prefer all the poems out there dealing with sexuality that aren't quite so in your face. I don't believe in censorship either so I'm not saying it should be banned reading but I do think that it's not appropriate in a high school class and even in a college course, the students might benefit from a lead up to a poem like that. I think it requires some explanation as to why it might be worth discussing.

Post: #33

Yeah, it's a poem, user. Sledgehammer or not. Inappropriate for high-school students and still offensive to many mature adults or not.

It's a poem titled "Please Master" by Allen Ginsberg written in 1968.

That's just a literary fact.

Post: #34

It's not appropriate in that setting. The thing is, there are strict rules surrounding curriculum and what is allowed in public education I would assume. It's not appropriate, could maybe explored at a University Level, but not high school. The kiddies are just not ready for it yet. Also, some of those kids would come from very conservative homes, and this type of language maybe very confronting and counter to what their families and culture believes/represent.

Ginsberg, represents something to this day that many parents may not consent to or wish their children to be influenced by. My answer is, the poem is probably a little to mature for the younger readers, and the teacher needs to get approval and permission from whoever before trailblazing in this area. That's what I think.

Post: #35

I had to ask myself if I would feel differently had that been a woman saying it to a man.

Post: #36

Well, then it would be slutty wouldn't it?

Post: #37

I don't know about that. If said to him privately it might be a turn on. Men don't seem to mind her acting slutty privately as long as she's a lady in public.

Post: #38

For the record, I like Ginsberg. I watched a documentary on his life, fascinating life.

Post: #39

I think all the progressiveness in Mock is getting to me. I think it should be read to grade school children to observe their reactions. Then read it to old people in a nursing home to see their reactions, then make a collage of all the faces and put it in the Smithsonian in Washington and watch all the reactions from the people there. Then we could have a true understanding of human nature and the future.
Its all about love people!!! LOVE!

Post: #40

Nobody in here, so far, thinks the poem is appropriate for high school or that it was wrong for Olio to get suspended.

A couple of us could see how it might be appropriate and worthy of analysis in a college setting, if it fit a particular topic of study well and was introduced properly.

What are you viewing as progressive here, Mags? The views in this thread are more conservative than progressive, in my opinion.

Post: #41

(03-10-2015 11:16 AM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:  What are you viewing as progressive here, Mags? The views in this thread are more conservative than progressive, in my opinion.

Its the closedmindlessness of it all man, we should all be groovy and accept who we are as children of the great spirit in the sky. I know its a far out scenario but give it a try, let peace be part of the process.

Post: #42

(03-10-2015 11:27 AM)Maggot Wrote:  

(03-10-2015 11:16 AM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:  What are you viewing as progressive here, Mags? The views in this thread are more conservative than progressive, in my opinion.

Its the closedmindlessness of it all man, we should all be groovy and accept who we are as children of the great spirit in the sky. I know its a far out scenario but give it a try, let peace be part of the process.

Yeah, okay.