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KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION
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Blindgreed1 Offline
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Post: #29
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

(10-17-2017 03:44 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:  You can't read minds to tell us what the people engaged are thinking and feeling Gunnar.

You 'think' those participating in the silent protest are 'unpatriotic' even when they've explained that they love this country, but object to what they consider social injustice and police brutality in the United States. You get to have your opinion and put words in their mouths, as does Trump. But, you're wrong in insisting that your opinions equate to facts.

And, I never said Trump getting immersed in it didn't call further attention to the controversy/issue. I think that's precisely why he did it and don't think Trump has likely helped or hurt the cause in so doing. I think it's more likely that he's only reinforced the views of people who already agreed with what he's saying and hasn't changed the minds of anyone who disagreed with him.

That's my opinion which isn't affected by the fact that you think it's ignorant, contrived or whatever else you want to toss out there.
The act by definition is unpatriotic. Fact. They are doing it to draw attention to their cause. Fact. Trump commenting on it brought MUCH more attention to their cause. Fact. There are no opinions there dippy. Just facts. Go ahead, try to argue against facts citing your precious little opinion as an alternative to facts. See how far that gets you. hah





10-17-2017 05:45 PM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #30
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

The act is not unpatriotic by definition just because you insist that it is Gunnar. You consider it unpatriotic because you're projecting your own thoughts and emotions onto the protestors. It's your opinion, to which you're entitled. It's not a fact.

A lot of veterans who fought for our country and a lot of everyday citizens, including me, disagree with you and believe that a patriotic American can exercise his 1st amendment right to protest against things he doesn't like about this country, via taking a knee or any other number of means. A lot of other veterans and everyday citizens agree with you that taking a knee is unpatriotic, period. Differences of OPINION.

The rest of your post is just you arguing with yourself for some inexplicable reason -- which would be strange from a rational person, but is simply mildly amusing from you.

Read back; slowly and out-loud if it helps. You'll see that neither I, nor anyone else here, ever contended that the act hasn't garnered attention. Neither I, nor anyone else here, ever contended that Trump's many comments didn't draw more attention to the issue/controversy. But, please, don't let that reality keep you from going round three with yourself. Knock yourself out.





10-17-2017 07:48 PM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #31
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

(10-16-2017 04:59 AM)Duchess Wrote:  
(10-15-2017 09:07 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:  What do you think, does he have a solid case?


I think he has some information that confirms his belief, emails, memos, recordings, things of that nature. He has something that is going to prove his case and I think he's probably had it for quite awhile.

This could be an interesting evidentiary twist to the case.

The influence and power of President Donald Trump will be a central element in Colin Kaepernick's collusion grievance against the NFL, according to a source with knowledge of the situation, identifying the culture fostered by the leader of the free world as a factor in teams failing to extend a contract offer for work-out invitation to the former Super Bowl quarterback since he became a free agent in March.

Kaepernick's case might focus on the tweets and other communications of the president, according to the source, noting numerous instances where Trump expressed his influence over owners in this manner.

Per the CBA language on collusion: "No Club, its employees or agents shall enter into any agreement, express or implied, with the NFL or any other Club, its employees or agents to restrict or limit individual Club decision-making ... "

In this instance, Kaepernick could argue, in addition to "express" collusion -- generally emails, text messages or written/oral arrangements among clubs or the league office -- that some or all NFL clubs/owners also had an "implied" agreement with the league and/or each other based on messages received from President Trump, which the president publicly discussed on Twitter and in speeches to restrict decision-making regarding signing Kaepernick.

Trump has Tweeted and commented about speaking to owners directly on matters of protesting players‎ and boasted of his sway over them when it comes to protesting players. He has mentioned ownership fear of drawing his wrath on social media and urged teams publicly to fire protesting players, referring to kneeling players as "sons of bitches" at a recent rally in Alabama.


Full piece: https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/colin...influence/





10-17-2017 09:13 PM
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Carsman Offline
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Post: #32
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

Ya know, after reading all this hullabaloo about taking a knee vs standing for the anthem this thought kinda came to me. It changed my way of thinking, and I consider myself a patriot!

I think that people "kneel" when they are revering and or worshiping and or praying to their God, Savior, Maker, whatever they believe in.

So in essence, people taking a knee is tantamount to people praying (in this case) for "social injustice" to be rectified.

As long as people don't just "sit on their ass" during the anthem, some sort of respect is still being shown, just not the conventional manner all are accustomed to.

(BTW, the Trumpateer just added gas on an open fire. He should have stayed out of it)

And right or wrong, that's just my opinion.






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10-17-2017 10:40 PM
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BigMark Offline
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Post: #33
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

I could give two shits what some guy who can run fast thinks. What a bunch of malarkey, now football has turned into the days of our lives. This bizzarro world shit is why trump got elected in the first place.





10-18-2017 12:32 AM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #34
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

(10-17-2017 10:40 PM)Carsman Wrote:  I think that people "kneel" when they are revering and or worshiping and or praying to their God, Savior, Maker, whatever they believe in.

So in essence, people taking a knee is tantamount to people praying (in this case) for "social injustice" to be rectified.

That's along the same lines as what Eric Reid, the first to join Kaepernick in silent protest, has explained over the last year Cars.

Reid, the son of a minister, said his decision was fueled by his faith and his drive to take peaceful action following the death of Alton Sterling in his hometown.

He and Kaepernick consulted Nate Boyer, a retired Green Beret and ex-NFL player, about how to peacefully protest racial injustice and police brutality. They decided that kneeling was more respectful than sitting and Reid felt that the posture resembled a flag at half mast marking a tragedy.

Everything Reid and his father have expressed is the exact opposite of what President Trump claims is the 'son of a bitch's' motivation. I have no reason to doubt Eric Reid's account and believe that he obviously knows better than anyone else his own motivation and feelings.

Here are the Reids' statements, if you're interested.
Eric Reid op-ed: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/25/opini...tests.html
Eric Reid Sr. interview: http://www.sfchronicle.com/49ers/article...227791.php





10-18-2017 01:23 AM
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BigMark Offline
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Post: #35
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

Yeah, bastard would have been a bit more accurate in most cases.





10-18-2017 01:33 AM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #36
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

SB Nation compiled a good summary and pictorial of the movement's progression, with the athletes explaining their motivations in their own words.

https://www.sbnation.com/2016/9/11/12869...rshall-nfl





10-18-2017 01:44 AM
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Duchess Away
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Post: #37
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION



The only vets I ever come across who have a problem with them taking a knee are people online who profess to be former soldiers or in some way attached to the military. Offline I know several, including some in my own family who don't have an issue with this.

There are a lot of people who try to make this be about what they want it to be rather than what the reality is. Many of them feel as trump does, as in, those sonsofbitches should stand up and shut up. I don't agree with that and I support the black community much in the same way I support the gay community when they fight for equal rights.






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10-18-2017 04:52 AM
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Maggot Offline
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Post: #38
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

That and the people in the stands that are booing them as loud as possible. They don't show that on television though. Reality is not for the faint of heart and is not good for public consumption.






10-18-2017 10:43 AM
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Blindgreed1 Offline
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Post: #39
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

(10-17-2017 07:48 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:  Read back; slowly and out-loud if it helps. You'll see that neither I, nor anyone else here, ever contended that the act hasn't garnered attention. Neither I, nor anyone else here, ever contended that Trump's many comments didn't draw more attention to the issue/controversy. But, please, don't let that reality keep you from going round three with yourself. Knock yourself out.
Then you agree with me. See?... That wasn't so hard for you now was it? And yes, you did say that what Trump did bothered you the most. I pointed out that it brought more attention to their cause, which you disagreed with. Nice try, but a swing and a miss.





10-18-2017 10:45 AM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #40
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

(10-18-2017 04:52 AM)Duchess Wrote:  

The only vets I ever come across who have a problem with them taking a knee are people online who profess to be former soldiers or in some way attached to the military. Offline I know several, including some in my own family who don't have an issue with this.

There are a lot of people who try to make this be about what they want it to be rather than what the reality is. Many of them feel as trump does, as in, those sonsofbitches should stand up and shut up. I don't agree with that and I support the black community much in the same way I support the gay community when they fight for equal rights.

I haven't talked to any vets about it personally. But, there have been lots of interviews with veterans and some open letters from veterans groups.

Most I've seen are in support of Kaepernick, many resent the President for inaccurately speaking for them and using them as a political pawn, some applaud Kaepernick and the cause, others don't like the kneeling but support the athletes' constitutional rights to freedom of expression and don't think the outrage and attempt to thwart peaceful demonstration is justified, and there are some who think taking a knee is unpatriotic and want everyone to be forced to stand during the anthem.

This compilation of interviews with veterans reflects what I've seen and heard across the board: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_p..._prop.html





10-18-2017 11:46 AM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #41
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION

Sorry Duchess, this is the link to the compilation of interviews with veterans: http://www.businessinsider.com/veterans-...ick-2016-9





10-18-2017 12:16 PM
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Duchess Away
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Post: #42
RE: KAEPERNICK SUES FOR COLLUSION



Thanks, HotD. Very good article. I appreciate being able to read their opinions. I especially liked this -

"I can tell you, speaking for three generations of my family, it is PRECISELY for men like Kaepernick, and his right to peacefully protest injustice, that we were willing to serve," said Michael Sands, a Green Beret who is the son of a World War II veteran and father of an Army officer who served in Afghanistan. "Want to respect the American flag? Then respect the ideals for which it stands. Bullying language and calling peaceful protesters 'sons of bitches' who should be fired aren't among them."

I liked the guy's 97 yr. old grandpa who had served in WWII and wanted to join those who take a knee too.






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10-18-2017 12:31 PM
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