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RUSSIAN INTERFERENCE IN 2016 US ELECTION & SPIN-OFF INVESTIGATIONS
(02-03-2018, 09:22 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: I've actually read some of D'Souza's stuff. It's much like Wolff's stuff, in my opinion.

Some facts, lots and lots of supposition without validation, and strongly catered to appeal to extremely partisan-biased readers.

It can be fascinating reading, but one would be foolish to regard it as serious journalism or an accurate historical account.


I view them both as writing National Enquirer type bullshit and I take them as seriously as I take Fox News.

Pappy always calls me (and others) derogatory names when I won't share his beliefs. He's another one that I take as seriously as I take Fox. I don't know why he gets so personally offended that he'd resort to name calling. I don't give a shit what he believes or who he chooses to read for reference. He's entitled to give credence wherever he wants. It's not like I'm trying to take his rights away from him and he has to fight for 'em.
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D'Souza actually used to be a credible conservative ideologue, in my opinion. He's quite sharp intellectually and a very good marketer and salesman.

But, years ago he went over the edge and became a highly partisan Republican hack, peddling conspiracy theories to the far right for profit. He may actually believe what he peddles, I don't know.

Anyway, considering his works pointing fingers at left-leaning politicians and groups for alleged money-related immorality and illegality without evidence, it was a prime example of extremist hypocrisy when he was convicted of violating federal campaign finance laws.

I think D'Souza is still on parole after having pleaded guilty. IIRC, he intentionally broke the law by donating over the federal limit to a female Republican senatorial candidate who was running against Democrat Kristen Gillibrand (Gillibrand won the election). D'Souza used 'straw donors' to disguise his crime and got busted.
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Republican congressman Trey Gowdy, former prosecutor and hero to some Republicans for driving the many Clinton Benghazi investigations which resulted in no charges, appeared on Face The Nation today.





He expressed his opinion that Carter Page, who Trump denies knowing but served as an advisor to the Trump campaign, would never have been under FISA surveillance without the Steele dossier.

However, soon-to-be-retired Gowdy, who is the only Republican on the House Intelligence Committee who has seen the actual FISA warrant applications, emphasized that The Memo does not discredit special counsel Robert Mueller's investigation into Russian election meddling and any ties to Trump associates.

When asked to clarify if he thought the dossier or The Memo discredits the Mueller investigation, Gowdy said, "not to me, it doesn't, and I was pretty integrally involved in the drafting of it (memo) -- there IS a Russia investigation without a dossier."

The dossier has "nothing to do" with the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting involving Donald Trump Jr., Trump son-in-law and senior adviser Jared Kushner, and a Russian lawyer, Gowdy noted. Gowdy also said the dossier did not form the basis for the case against George Papadopoulos, the former Trump campaign aid who has pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about foreign contacts.

The dossier has nothing to do with obstruction of justice, Gowdy noted. "So there's going to be a Russia probe, even without a dossier," he said.
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13 Russians Indicted by Mueller Grand Jury for Interfering in 2016 U.S. Presidential Election

A federal grand jury in Washington has indicted 13 Russian nationals and three Russian organizations, charging that they interfered with the 2016 U.S. presidential election in a way that benefited President Donald Trump.

The indictment says a Russian organization 'sought, in part, to conduct what it called "information warfare against the United States of America" through fictitious U.S. personas on social media platforms and other Internet-based media.'

'By in or around May 2014, the organization's strategy included interfering with the 2016 U.S. presidential election, with the stated goal of "spread[ing] distrust towards the candidates and the political system in general",' according to the indictment.

The indictment includes a list of social media ads that the Russians paid for – all containing anti-Clinton and pro-Trump messages.

Vladimir Putin was reportedly not notified in advance of the indictments and the legal action is seen as a major sign putting him and the Russian government on notice.

There are no allegations of collusion/conspiracy by any Americans, inside or outside of the Trump campaign, named in these interference indictments.

More: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...z57J0B3qBb
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Yeah yeah, whatev.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/02/17/su...ag/*/index
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(02-18-2018, 08:36 PM)BigMark Wrote: Yeah yeah, whatev.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/02/17/su...ag/*/index

Smiley_emoticons_shocked
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(02-18-2018, 08:36 PM)BigMark Wrote: Yeah yeah, whatev.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/02/17/su...ag/*/index

The United States has meddled in the leadership of other countries for decades, attempting to boost democratic challengers to dictators, and going so far as to kill leaders that the U.S. and UN / NATO allies deemed a local or global threat to life. That's not a secret or new information or anything.

Here's another new article on the subject: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc...ap/553604/

In the case at hand -- the 2016 U.S. Presidential election -- Russian operatives are accused of going beyond an influence campaign.

The indictment charges the Russian defendants with a misinformation campaign designed to fool gullible Americans (a couple of whom believed and posted the fake Russian narratives as 'news' right here at Mock, Biggie).

The defendants are charged with conspiracy to defraud the U.S., conspiracy to commit wire fraud and bank fraud, and aggravated identity theft (of U.S. citizens).

Russia isn't going to extradite the defendants to the U.S. to stand trial, of course. But, the release of the indictment is good detailed information that U.S. citizens and people in other countries should be aware of ahead of the next elections.

And, if the Russians or anybody else has evidence that the U.S. has undertaken crimes on their soil in order to misinform their citizens and promote our own agenda, they can present their case and file charges.

Anyway, now that it's been established that specific laws were broken during the course of Russia's intervention into our election........if it turns out that some Americans, in or outside the Trump campaign/White House, knowingly participated in the Russian plot, they can be charged with conspiracy or accessories to conspiracy.
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Good. Bring them all down.

In a twisted sort of way that Trump did expose the worst of Washington. Too bad most of it was his allies. I just thank the stars he's too lazy and uninterested to really fuck over this country or we would be in a lot worse shape than even what's coming. This year, the year of Trumps policies in full effect, will be the year we all regret. And as far as Putin is concerned, just taking us off the world stage is a huge victory. We are gonna be busy cleaning up this mess for a while...
Thank god I am oblivious to the opinions of others while caught in the blinding splendor of my own cleverness.
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Half of us will regret and the smart ones will rejoice.
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You are mistaken.
Thank god I am oblivious to the opinions of others while caught in the blinding splendor of my own cleverness.
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(02-19-2018, 10:42 AM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:
(02-18-2018, 08:36 PM)BigMark Wrote: Yeah yeah, whatev.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/02/17/su...ag/*/index

The United States has meddled in the leadership of other countries for decades, attempting to boost democratic challengers to dictators, and going so far as to kill leaders that the U.S. and UN / NATO allies deemed a local or global threat to life. That's not a secret or new information or anything.

Here's another new article on the subject: https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc...ap/553604/

In the case at hand -- the 2016 U.S. Presidential election -- Russian operatives are accused of going beyond an influence campaign.

The indictment charges the Russian defendants with a misinformation campaign designed to fool gullible Americans (a couple of whom believed and posted the fake Russian narratives as 'news' right here at Mock, Biggie).

The defendants are charged with conspiracy to defraud the U.S., conspiracy to commit wire fraud and bank fraud, and aggravated identity theft (of U.S. citizens).

Russia isn't going to extradite the defendants to the U.S. to stand trial, of course. But, the release of the indictment is good detailed information that U.S. citizens and people in other countries should be aware of ahead of the next elections.

And, if the Russians or anybody else has evidence that the U.S. has undertaken crimes on their soil in order to misinform their citizens and promote our own agenda, they can present their case and file charges.

Anyway, now that it's been established that specific laws were broken during the course of Russia's intervention into our election........if it turns out that some Americans, in or outside the Trump campaign/White House, knowingly participated in the Russian plot, they can be charged with conspiracy or accessories to conspiracy.
The US also has a history of interfering based on personal interest and capitalism. Only most Americans don't like to look at it that way. It's much easier to swallow when it's white washed.
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(02-19-2018, 06:08 PM)Donovan Wrote: Good. Bring them all down.

It's being reported that Rick Gates is negotiating a plea deal with Mueller and will soon plead guilty in exchange for a light sentence.

Gates (along with his previous boss Manafort) is facing some very serious financial / laundering charges. Unlike Manafort, Gates was not only a key part of the transition team, but also stayed on and served as an advisor in the White House. So, he presumably has valuable information to help connect the dots for investigators.

Yesterday, it was announced that Manafort was hit with more bank fraud charges. Today, a lawyer for Gates (one from a prominent law firm) was indicted for lying to investigators. https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/20/politics/...index.html
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(02-20-2018, 09:31 AM)Blindgreed1 Wrote: The US also has a history of interfering based on personal interest and capitalism. Only most Americans don't like to look at it that way. It's much easier to swallow when it's white washed.

I don't know what most Americans think. But, I do know that plenty of Americans acknowledge and openly object to forced regime change and U.S. intervention when there's no immediate threat to our security, no matter what the government releases as the official motivation or justification.
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I detest it when our government involves itself in the business of other countries. Who the hell are we to tell others how to live & conduct their lives. Such bullshit. Like we're the voice of moral authority for fuckssake. Pfft.
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(02-20-2018, 11:46 AM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:
(02-20-2018, 09:31 AM)Blindgreed1 Wrote: The US also has a history of interfering based on personal interest and capitalism. Only most Americans don't like to look at it that way. It's much easier to swallow when it's white washed.

I don't know what most Americans think. But, I do know that plenty of Americans acknowledge and openly object to forced regime change and U.S. intervention when there's no immediate threat to our security, no matter what the government releases as the official motivation or justification.
It's basic human nature. Nobody (with a conscience) wants to believe they are the bad guy.
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(02-20-2018, 12:23 PM)Duchess Wrote:

I detest it when our government involves itself in the business of other countries. Who the hell are we to tell others how to live & conduct their lives. Such bullshit. Like we're the voice of moral authority for fuckssake. Pfft.
Bin Ladden is a perfect example. We gave him money and weapons to fight off the evil communists. He returned the favor by declaring jihad on the West.
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Mueller's not fucking around.

Today, he secured his third guilty plea in the investigation (and Rick Gates is expected to become number four very soon).

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^ Alex van der Zwaan pleaded guilty at federal court in Washington D.C. in a plea deal with the special counsel.

The 33-year-old becomes the third to be convicted as a result of the Mueller investigation, coming after President Donald Trump's disgraced national security adviser Mike Flynn and campaign adviser George Papadopolous both cut deals with the special counsel.

Van der Zwaan is a Dutch citizen and London-based lawyer whose father-in-law, German Khan, is named in the dossier on Trump which was drawn up by British spy Christopher Steele.

Van der Zwaan's law firm assisted in efforts on behalf of Ukrainian former president Viktor Yanukovych - the Putin ally forced from office in the country's 'orange revolution'.

He worked as an associate for the law firm Skadden, Arps, Meagher, & Flom LLP on behalf of the project and admits to lying to Mueller's investigators about his communications with Gates and withholding evidence.

Charging documents show that he surreptitiously recorded Gates but lied to the FBI about it.

He also made false statements about his conversations with someone identified as 'Person A' who was on the call with him and Gates.

Refs:
https://talkingpointsmemo.com/muckraker/...ller-probe
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...-plea.html
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(02-20-2018, 05:38 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: Mueller's not fucking around.

Today, he secured his third guilty plea in the investigation (and Rick Gates is expected to become number four very soon).


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Yesterday, the NSA chief testified that he hasn't been granted the authority by trump to confront the Russian cyber threat. Russia is meddling with our democracy and this administration refuses to do anything about it. Admiral Mike Rogers said there is no reason for Russia to back off and that they have enjoyed success. How 'bout that shit. This comes after both parties have agreed upon sanctions yet the prez flatly refuses to enforce them.
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(02-28-2018, 06:36 AM)Duchess Wrote:

Russia is meddling with our democracy and this administration refuses to do anything about it.

First, we are a Constitutional Republic, not a Democracy, our founders explicitly ruled out Democracy as a viable form of government.

Secondly, if you were a responsible citizen of our Republic, you would have educated yourself about Aleksandr Dugin as I suggested. Then you would know exactly what Russia is doing, and it ain't good.
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