American Indians and firewater

[Lady Cop]

talk about cliches~~

so why is it a chronic problem? poverty? genetics? white-eyes fault? boredom? hopelessness? what?
should they be suing the beer producers for their alcoholism?

The lawsuit says one in four children born on the reservation suffer from fetal alcohol syndrome or fetal alcohol spectrum disorder. The average life expectancy is estimated between 45 and 52 years



AP

LINCOLN, Neb. – An American Indian tribe sued some of the world's largest beer makers Thursday, claiming they knowingly contributed to devastating alcohol-related problems on South Dakota's Pine Ridge Indian Reservation.

The Oglala Sioux Tribe of South Dakota said it is demanding $500 million in damages for the cost of health care, social services and child rehabilitation caused by chronic alcoholism on the reservation, which encompasses some of the nation's most impoverished counties.

The lawsuit filed in U.S. District Court of Nebraska also targets four beer stores in Whiteclay, a Nebraska town near the reservation's border that, despite having only about a dozen residents, sold nearly 5 million cans of beer in 2010.

Tribal leaders and activists blame the Whiteclay businesses for chronic alcohol abuse and bootlegging on the Pine Ridge reservation, where all alcohol is banned. They say most of the stores' customers come from the reservation, which spans southwest South Dakota and dips into Nebraska.

"You cannot sell 4.9 million 12-ounce cans of beer and wash your hands like Pontius Pilate, and say we've got nothing to do with it being smuggled," said Tom White, the tribe's Omaha-based attorney.

Owners of the four beer stores in Whiteclay were unavailable or declined comment Thursday when contacted by The Associated Press. A spokeswoman for Anheuser-Busch InBev Worldwide said she was not yet aware of the lawsuit, and the other four companies being sued -- SAB Miller, Molson Coors Brewing Company, MIllerCoors LLC and Pabst Brewing Company -- did not immediately return messages.

The lawsuit alleges that the beer makers and stores sold to Pine Ridge residents knowing they would smuggle the alcohol into the reservation to drink or resell. The beer makers supplied the stores with "volumes of beer far in excess of an amount that could be sold in compliance with the laws of the state of Nebraska" and the tribe, tribal officials allege in the lawsuit.

The vast majority of Whiteclay's beer store customers have no legal place to consume alcohol since it's banned on Pine Ridge, which is just north, state law prohibits drinking outside the stores and the nearest town that allows alcohol is more than 20 miles south, explained Mark Vasina, president of the group Nebraskans for Peace.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/02/...z1lwYCvRra

[cladking]

Indians have a lot of problems with alcohol but the Irish and then Germans aren't so far behind. Some people in hopeless situations or with little to do will drink and the genes are one of the largest determinatives for whether they become alcoholics or not. Young adults are drawn to alcohol as a means of "letting their hair down" or to meet the opposite sex. Some use it to self medicate boredom or the ups and downs of life.

...Or to forget.

Almost anyone who drinks too much for too long can become an alcoholic. Some research suggests that it's a mild alergy to alcohol that makes it more likely and this alergy is common in Indians, Irish, etc.

Indians have a lower life expectancy even outside the influence of alcohol.

If they win then anyone with Irish blood should get a share as well.

Of course someone could just tell them to exercise some self control and don't drink to get rid of depression or hangovers since this is the fastest way to the DT's. It's just hard for some people and among indians it can be especially hard.

It's a hundred times harder for alcoholics than indians and some of them make it.

[aussiefriend]

Indians have a lot of problems with alcohol but the Irish and then Germans aren't so far behind.

That is ridiculous! How can you compare the Irish with the Indian Indigenous Population in the United States.

The Irish are a successful part of Europe with a rich history. As anglo-saxons we have generations of tolerance to alcohol as opposed to a culture that is clearly living in poverty and with all sorts of social inadequacies. I feel very sorry for those people and the children born with alcoholic fetal syndrome. Their life expectancy is probably way lower than any Irish population in Europe or in any other part of the world.

It's all very well to espouse these little bits of insight and wisdom but you need to back it up with a little thing called 'facts'.

The Irish are fine thank you very much.

[cladking]

I have no problem with Irish but I'd wager that if they were in the same sort of situation as the indians born on reservations their lives would be little better. There'd be nearly as much trouble with alcohol anyway.

Indians did pretty damn well before people came along and started pushing them into reservations. I have nothing against Indians either. Not having a written language doesn't mean they're barbaric. There's really just not much difference between any two "races" and individual differences generally outweigh any racial ones. Some indians don't drink and some drink responsibly.

The Irish played a critical role in the development of the US. The indians were largely excluded by the status quo. There's a lot of indian blood in the US population and it's extremely high in other parts of the Americas.

Perhaps a step in the right direction would be to allow indians to sell their share of their reservation and use the money to get established. Of course it's a complicated issue since many do not want to assimilate or live in the general population.

[Lady Cop]

most stereotypes have some foundation in truth. i think some nationalities/ethnic groups have a predilection for alcohol addiction/abuse.
the Aborigines in Australia seem to have a similar problem.
nature or circumstance?
but in this instance, should the beer producers be held liable?

[Cracker]

Are they suing the brewers or the distributors? Or both?

They live on a dry reservation. They really can't blame anyone selling beer outside of the reservation.

The Fetal Alcohol stats are terrible. That is totally preventable. Makes me so mad.

[aussiefriend]

This is where your government needs to step in and do what we are doing over here. The rural communities and those particular reservations are completely 'alcohol free'. So if you are found with alcohol in those zones you will be arrested or removed.

it is really about protecting children from child abuse but many other issues as well. There is so much, too much in fact to mention, for example, domestic violence, child sexual abuse, poor nutrition, vandalism, extreme poverty, rape, violence, extreme health issues, kidney failure, diabetes, all sorts of issues.

They might have a no alcohol policy on those reserves but clearly that is not being enforced.

[IMaDick]

This is where your government needs to step in and do what we are doing over here. The rural communities and those particular reservations are completely 'alcohol free'. So if you are found with alcohol in those zones you will be arrested or removed.

That's fucked up.

[aussiefriend]

This is where your government needs to step in and do what we are doing over here. The rural communities and those particular reservations are completely 'alcohol free'. So if you are found with alcohol in those zones you will be arrested or removed.

That's fucked up.

What? I am not telling you how to run your country. Far from it. This is how we do it here. Crime up in those rural communities is at an epidemic level. Somewhere you would never catch me. I have a friend who works in one of the clinics, you make big $$$$$ because no one wants to go and work there!

Dick are you hitting the bottle? Again? Still?

[Lady Cop]

i always wondered what they were smoking in their beautiful pipes.
probably better for the tribes than booze.

[IMaDick]

This is where your government needs to step in and do what we are doing over here. The rural communities and those particular reservations are completely 'alcohol free'. So if you are found with alcohol in those zones you will be arrested or removed.

That's fucked up.

What? I am not telling you how to run your country. Far from it. This is how we do it here. Crime up in those rural communities is at an epidemic level. Somewhere you would never catch me. I have a friend who works in one of the clinics, you make big $$$$$ because no one wants to go and work there!

Dick are you hitting the bottle? Again? Still?

Ya why should any natives in australia have human rights.

you're right aussie, treat them like shit it's your right as part of the commonwealth.

[Duchess]

Did you just try to turn prohibited alcohol into a human rights issue?

[IMaDick]

Prohibitions on individual choice should all be viewed as human rights violations in this case more so because it is on tribal lands only.

Do you understand why we have reservations in the first place? they are lands given to the indians because of the human rights violations when the whites came to the land in the first place, they are supposed to be able to govern themselves on their lands as they see fit, whites implementing laws on a reservation is a a fucked up thing.

[aussiefriend]

Did you just try to turn prohibited alcohol into a human rights issue?

He can be quite manipulative old Dick. He has been twisting comments to fit his warped mindset.

The government has a duty of care to it's people. Alcohol restrictions are based on research, facts and history of adverse situations and health complications that is costing the government and taxpayer.

[IMaDick]

Did you just try to turn prohibited alcohol into a human rights issue?

He can be quite manipulative old Dick. He has been twisting comments to fit his warped mindset.

The government has a duty of care to it's people. Alcohol restrictions are based on research, facts and history of adverse situations and health complications that is costing the government and taxpayer.

Then why is it only restricted on tribal lands?

Those same studies would also apply to those outside of the reservation wouldn't they?

so a native that lives off the reservation can drink himself to death, but on the reservation he can't drink at all.

that's fucked up.

[aussiefriend]

Careful Dick you are sounding awfully liberal. Extreme left.

Poor Dick doesn't understand that these 'tribal lands' are not their own little independent countries that get to make up their own rules and laws. It is still a part of the country winner. It is a 'reservation', or 'rural community' or 'tribal land', whatever you want to call it. It is not however, a country within a country. Capiche?

[IMaDick]

Careful Dick you are sounding awfully liberal. Extreme left.

Poor Dick doesn't understand that these 'tribal lands' are not their own little independent countries that get to make up their own rules and laws. It is still a part of the country winner. It is a 'reservation', or 'rural community' or 'tribal land', whatever you want to call it. It is not however, a country within a country. Capiche?

actually they are their own little country, with presidents and councils.

[Cracker]

This is a racist thread about Native Americans.

[IMaDick]

This is a racist thread about Native Americans.

It's actually about the aboriginals and their mistreatment by the commonwealth.

I'm tempted to call you aussie jr but I won't.

[aussiefriend]

actually they are their own little country, with presidents and councils.

why don't you set up your own little country? Population 1.

Just because they have leaders within their community (like their do here) that does not make them a country or an independent state. Are you really that stupid? It's the United States of America right? Or are their other countries hiding in there that I don't know about? Really? Are they part of the United Nations? I haven't seem them at the Olympics lately.