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I DON'T KNOW
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sally Away
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Post: #15
RE: I DON'T KNOW

(09-16-2015 03:19 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:  
(09-16-2015 02:55 PM)sally Wrote:  Maybe the school should check their policies in that case. If they don't want kids making things that beep and tick maybe they shouldn't have a robotics class.

I think the problem was showing it outside of the engineering lab because it could qualify as a "suspicious looking device" to a lay person. And, it did.

[Image: texas-muslim-student-clock.jpg]

Ahmed said he brought the clock, which he had fashioned with a digital face in an inexpensive box, to school on Monday to show to an engineering teacher, who said it was “nice” but then told him that he should not show the invention to other teachers.

But when it beeped during an English class, Ahmed revealed the device to his English teacher, according to an account in The Dallas Morning News. “She was like, it looks like a bomb,” he said. Ahmed reportedly told her, "it doesn't look like a bomb to me, it looks like a clock."


He's 14. This part bothers me most: He said he was fingerprinted, and mug shots were taken at a juvenile detention center. He was not allowed to call his parents but was released when they came to get him.

Full story: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/17/us/tex....html?_r=0

So the engineering teacher said it was nice but don't show it to other teachers? WTF was the kid supposed to do when it started beeping and the English teacher asked what that noise is? I see this as the school's failure to follow policy, not his. If it was going to cause a problem the engineer teacher should have said to keep the project in his classroom and pick it up after school.

I'm failing to see why the kid should be punished when a teacher at that school assigned the project and accepted the project.





09-16-2015 04:25 PM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #16
RE: I DON'T KNOW

^ Yeah, I thought the same thing, sal. If the Engineering teacher foresaw it being a potential problem, he should have asked Ahmed to store the device in the engineering lab or something (though I'm sure the Engineering teacher didn't imagine what would happen next).

As more information is being released, I get a sense there may be a little more to the incident than meets the eye.

Snip:
"I wanted to start clean with the teacher by showing him my inventions and stuff," Ahmed said. (HOTD: that just strikes me as a weird comment, like he knew he was gonna be causing a problem.)

Irving police released a report Tuesday that lists three MacArthur High teachers as complainants against the teen on the charge of “hoax bomb.” Irving Police Officer James McLellan said school officials simply thought the device was suspicious and acted out of caution.

"Clearly, there were disassembled clock parts in there, but he offered no more explanation than that," McLellan said. "A lot of these details that the family and he have provided to you were not shared with us yesterday. He was very much less than forthcoming." (HOTD: I hope those investigators taped that interrogation.) McLellan said the police investigation is not completed.

Irving Independent School District spokeswoman Lesley Weaver said Tuesday their main focus was student safety. "We are never going to take any chances for any of their safety," she said. "It doesn't matter what child would have brought a suspicious looking item. We still would have taken the same actions."

"If the family is willing to give us written permission, we would be happy to share with the public the other side of the story so they can understand the actions we took," she said.


Full story: http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Irving-...94401.html
-----------------------------------------

So far, the accounts of what happened at the school are coming from Ahmed and his family. They may be completely accurate and unbiased, but I would like to hear the Engineering teacher's account and the English teacher's account as well.

I don't personally suspect Ahmed of anything nefarious, but do suspect he might have invited more suspicion than necessary in how he responded to the English teacher and the cops.

I'd like to hear the full story from both sides.





09-16-2015 04:54 PM
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Love Child Offline
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Post: #17
RE: I DON'T KNOW

So this is the reason the President tweeted for the kid to bring the clock to the White House. I can always rely on Mock to get the news! : D

Would someone that is planning on blowing something up later bring in the device first for show and tell? Perhaps.

This is another reason I keep saying "Home school" in my mind if I ever did have children, which I don't so I am thankful I don't have to deal with these issues.

Schools decisions and over reactions leave me going "WTF" lately.





09-16-2015 07:16 PM
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Maggot Offline
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Post: #18
RE: I DON'T KNOW

You guys act like every teacher knows what the kids will be doing from one day to the next. Its not that easy. And the kid was just doing what he thought was the right thing. Shit happens in todays world that drives the caution flag. What if it was a bomb? I would rather see caution than see mayhem and this is the result of it.
I foresee the suspension being dropped. And WTF is Obama doing sticking his stupid nose in this? Its not like people aren't already questioning his motives in foreign policy. For the life of me I cannot imagine another thing that he should be staying away from.
That is unless some egghead thinks that after the fact cheerleading is warranted. And it has some crazy point other than sensationalism and plagiarism that fits some stupid agenda.

Something to take peoples minds off the real issues is what I see.






09-16-2015 07:21 PM
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SIXFOOTERsez Offline
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Post: #19
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A whole lot of stupid as far as I have seen. The teachers over reacted in a big way. Sure in today's environment dragging a home made clock looking gizmo around school might not be a good idea and the engineering teacher should have known that. But then on the other hand the kid never claimed it was a bomb. Did he leave it sitting around unattended so that it looked suspicious? He did in fact claim it was just a clock he made for class, and the engineering teacher backed that story. It should have stopped right there.
And No, I do not think it would have been blown into such a big deal if the kid would have been white and named Ricky Smith.
And the fucking president damn sure should not have had his nose in it, he is supposed to be running a fucking country





09-16-2015 08:05 PM
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aussiefriend Away
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I did see this on the news here. Look, the US has been through a lot. It is better to air on the side of caution. I would rather that they over reacted and everyone is safe, than do nothing and then you are talking about a whole lot of children who are unsafe.

Let's face it, how many muslim inventors do you know? They are certainly rare! They have to take responsibility for creating this hypervigiliance too. Carry on.





09-16-2015 08:20 PM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #21
RE: I DON'T KNOW

(09-16-2015 07:21 PM)Maggot Wrote:  You guys act like every teacher knows what the kids will be doing from one day to the next. Its not that easy. And the kid was just doing what he thought was the right thing. Shit happens in todays world that drives the caution flag. What if it was a bomb? I would rather see caution than see mayhem and this is the result of it.
I foresee the suspension being dropped. And WTF is Obama doing sticking his stupid nose in this? Its not like people aren't already questioning his motives in foreign policy. For the life of me I cannot imagine another thing that he should be staying away from.
That is unless some egghead thinks that after the fact cheerleading is warranted. And it has some crazy point other than sensationalism and plagiarism that fits some stupid agenda.

Something to take peoples minds off the real issues is what I see.

I think that Ahmed's parents should have been called and they should have been present for questioning, in any event. I don't think Ahmed should have been booked and detained. But, I don't blame the school for being very cautious, nor the cops for checking it out thoroughly.

I wish authorities would have been so thorough when they got a tip of suspicious activity related to Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold, but authorities blew it off because they were just high school kids. Well, as we now know, they were in fact building bombs and planning an attack on the school, unfortunately.

I still would like to hear the school's version of what went down. It's odd to me that Ahmed wouldn't have just told the English teacher to check with the Engineering teacher about the clock (maybe he did?).

Ahmed says he was disappointed that his Engineering teacher only told him that the clock was "nice" and not to show it to other teachers. But, then he ended up taking it out of his backpack and showing it to another teacher anyway.

Maybe his family will allow the school to release their incident report (which is apparently covered by student privacy unless the family consents to its release).

I agree with you about Obama and Clinton jumping in to the media storm today. Unless they've heard the full story from both sides and have all the facts, I think it's premature to take a side publicly - though I do understand wanting to promote creativity and innovation in schools.

I'm not considering this is a Muslim discrimination issue unless something is confirmed to support that suspicion; non-Muslim kids get arrested and suspended too, sometimes for what I consider idiotic reasons or policies. I don't think Obama or Clinton mentioned anything related to religion in their statements?

Anyway, looks like Ahmed is going to the White House. And, he's maybe transferring schools. And, he's probably secured entry to MIT when he graduates. And he's got offers to meet the head of Facebook and other major tech companies.





09-16-2015 08:28 PM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #22
RE: I DON'T KNOW

(09-16-2015 08:20 PM)aussiefriend Wrote:  Let's face it, how many muslim inventors do you know? They are certainly rare!

Odd take on it, aussie.





09-16-2015 08:30 PM
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aussiefriend Away
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RE: I DON'T KNOW

When you are talking about children, security, safety, it's become a fact of life. Regarding inventors, I lived in the middle east, although I am not saying they haven't invented stuff, I am saying their whole ethos is completely different to ours. Put it this way, would you say they are the same as the Japanese for example? You can see the profile of different cultures, different perceptions and motives etc.

HoTD, it's a pity you part quoted me, because you then take what I say out of context. I don't mean it as a racist statement, more health and safety.





09-16-2015 08:37 PM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #24
RE: I DON'T KNOW

(09-16-2015 08:20 PM)aussiefriend Wrote:  I did see this on the news here. Look, the US has been through a lot. It is better to air on the side of caution. I would rather that they over reacted and everyone is safe, than do nothing and then you are talking about a whole lot of children who are unsafe.

Let's face it, how many muslim inventors do you know? They are certainly rare! They have to take responsibility for creating this hypervigiliance too. Carry on.

Nothing was taken out of context in my first reply to you; I only wanted to respond to one part of what you wrote.

But here you go, Take 2 according to your preference aussie:

1. As I posted way upthread, I too feel that erring on the side of caution is appropriate. I agree that keeping children safe shouldn't be compromised. I concur with your first paragraph.

2. As for your claim that Ahmed should be viewed suspiciously and be treated differently from the other kids because he's Muslim and Muslim inventors are rare, I think that's an odd response to this story. Your observations in those regards are discriminatory and bullshit, respectively, in my opinion.





09-16-2015 09:00 PM
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aussiefriend Away
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RE: I DON'T KNOW

HoTD, it's not just with inventions, but it's also in things like athletics, human rights on and on. It's just a different way of life and mindset and doing things. I know this first hand............unfortunately. Not itching for a fight on this one, because I have just been reading there are all those politically correct people who have started a hashtag for this 'discriminated' individual. He has also gotten an invitation from the white house. He is going to be fine.





09-16-2015 09:30 PM
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HairOfTheDog Offline
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Post: #26
RE: I DON'T KNOW

I don't know if the situation would have been handled any differently by the school if Ahmed had been Jewish, or Christian, or Hindi... Ahmed's father suspects so, but the school says otherwise.

Since I haven't heard the details of what occurred from the teachers' side or the officers' side, I'm not assuming that Ahmed was discriminated against due to religion.

I just don't agree with you that he should be discriminated against because he's (a) Muslim and (b) therefore presumed not to be inventive. I know for a fact that there are some very innovative Muslims now and have been throughout history -- your experience working in the Middle East and your negative feelings can't take that away from them.





09-16-2015 09:52 PM
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username Offline
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Post: #27
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This country is going to hell in a hand basket.






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09-16-2015 11:29 PM
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aussiefriend Away
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RE: I DON'T KNOW

HoTD it's not just my negative experiences, it's my knowledge, insight about this subject. Profiling is discriminatory. LE were doing their job protecting the innocent. I know it's politically incorrect and not fashionable or fear based to voice this, but it's the truth.





09-17-2015 12:22 AM
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