Are you "fortunate" if you work hard?

[Duchess]

We are totally screwed.

Who could have ever dreamed that one would be punished for having a great work ethic & the drive to want it all.

[IMaDick]

If the government couldn't make ends meet on what we were paying, what the hell makes anyone think they will be able to make it with more?

That's like giving your teenage son a higher allowance because he doesn't know how to handle his money and spends more than he gets.

it's idiotic at it's core.

fuck higher taxes, it's not the answer, actually less money would be the answer and stop cutting the things we want and cut the shit we don't, government intrusion is everywhere, the feds need to pull the fuck out of about 20,000 things they have no business being involved in.

[Mohammed]

It's actually quite funny. I left Europe more than 20 years ago, and one of the good things about it is that you look at it from the outside. First there was no worry, but then after all these years you suddenly look at it and go "How on earth do they expect it to keep working?!"

Look at the fuel prices, the States are still lucky, but then again, you like to kill your troops to make sure you keep your prices at a level, so I guess your payments are just different. Look at labour costs. In Asia the manufacturing industry means a 100US$ per person. The manufacturing industry was the gravy and tradition of Europe. The "Handwerk" as it is called in Germany. Now? Who can afford it at an average salary of 2000 Euro per head?

Those times when the factories back home where running wild and production was at an all time high with the average Joe leading a comfortable and predictable life are over. It has moved. And there is no other choice at all I believe but it getting worse. Much worse! We just experienced the biggest global crash ever 2 years back.

So don't blame Obama, blame Bush, for after something like that it takes sometimes even longer to bring a small company back, forget about a country.

Soon the basic Asian salary and yours will meet in the middle. Then each side will learn how to live happily on 600US$ a month.

Well, at least the average Chin or Ming won't have any problem with that.

[Maggot]

Good I will need a few "servants" when I retire.

[Cynical Ninja]

Look at the fuel prices, the States are still lucky, but then again, you like to kill your troops to make sure you keep your prices at a level, so I guess your payments are just different.

That was a zinger and a half.

Don't let cracker hear you talk like that, her son is fighting the good fight and anyone that says different is liberal pussy coward pussy with no "honour".

[Maggot]

Look at the fuel prices, the States are still lucky, but then again, you like to kill your troops to make sure you keep your prices at a level, so I guess your payments are just different.

That was a zinger and a half.

Don't let cracker hear you talk like that, her son is fighting the good fight and anyone that says different is liberal pussy coward pussy with no "honour".

Her son is fighting a fight for his country. The government tells him where to go. It does not take away from his courage, that is real.

[IMaDick]

Look at the fuel prices, the States are still lucky, but then again, you like to kill your troops to make sure you keep your prices at a level, so I guess your payments are just different.

That was a zinger and a half.

Don't let cracker hear you talk like that, her son is fighting the good fight and anyone that says different is liberal pussy coward pussy with no "honour".

Her son is fighting a fight for his country. The government tells him where to go. It does not take away from his courage, that is real.

Maggot, there you go again, expecting OP to understand courage and honor.

I'm tellin ya buddy, you have got to ratchet down your expectations when you post to OP, his understanding is limited by his head full of shit.

[BlueTiki]

We just experienced the biggest global crash ever 2 years back.

So don't blame Obama, blame Bush . . .

Brooksley Born might disagree. She was appointed by Bill Clinton.

Many of the same folks (who shot her down in the 90's) are now in prominent and key positions, in the Obama administration.

They are the architects of the recovery and regulation.

Atlas Shrugged.

[Cynical Ninja]

Her son is fighting a fight for his country. The government tells him where to go. It does not take away from his courage, that is real.

Yes his courage is keeping your tank full, you should be appreciative of his efforts.

[Cynical Ninja]

Maggot, there you go again, expecting OP to understand courage and honor.

I'm tellin ya buddy, you have got to ratchet down your expectations when you post to OP, his understanding is limited by his head full of shit.

And there I go again expecting dick to one day learn how to trim down a fucking quote once in a while.

Maybe if you had drived to school a bit earlier when you were a kid you would learn to do so.

[Maggot]

Her son is fighting a fight for his country. The government tells him where to go. It does not take away from his courage, that is real.

Yes his courage is keeping your tank full, you should be appreciative of his efforts.

You can believe that or believe that the U.S. is not such a nanny state as England has become. Yet......................

[Maggot]

Here ya go limey...........But only because of the American bashing.

[username]

So don't blame Obama, blame Bush, for after something like that it takes sometimes even longer to bring a small company back, forget about a country.

It's pretty much a national past time to blame Bush for everything. Here are some thoughts/questions.

I know that there are some questions about how much of a surplus we came out with under the Clinton administration but as I understand it, there was some surplus. I've read that the Bush administration sort of decimated that by 1) instituting tax cuts, 2) defense spending on numerous war fronts (worthwhile or not) and 3) the burst in the housing bubble (and the subsequent bail outs) which in some ways can be blamed on the administration for a lack of regulation/foresight (although a quick google indicates about 75% of that bailout has been repaid).

So, should those tax cuts actually stand? People like to make it sound like Obama wants to raise taxes but he's actually proposing not extending the Bush tax cuts for the upper 2%. And while I can understand the logic that tax cuts stimulate the economy--there's still GOT to be a point where you reduce that revenue to a point where you simply don't have enough money to operate the government and services effectively.

And while the idea of a flat tax is appealing, wouldn't that mean that we would be forcing more lower and middle income households in to applying for social welfare programs?

I said before, I'm all for tighter immigration, a hard look at defense spending and unions, a look at subsidies and corporate taxes, maybe slightly raising the age for social security (although damn, if I were 60 and looking forward to retirement soon and counting on that income, I might not feel the same).

Thoughts?

[Cracker]

And while the idea of a flat tax is appealing, wouldn't that mean that we would be forcing more lower and middle income households in to applying for social welfare programs?

Why would it harm anyone to pay their fair share of services they use? Poor people don't use roads and schools? (OK, they don't use schools as much, but they use the roads more because they aren't in school all day.)

Pay for what you use. That is a simple concept and keeps people honest. Stop putting your fucking hand out for charity, put it out with a tool in it and work for what you get.

That can only raise the level of this society and has no downside. We are brainwashed into thinking people can't contribute and take care of themselves. People CAN and we should expect it from ALL people.

[username]

And while the idea of a flat tax is appealing, wouldn't that mean that we would be forcing more lower and middle income households in to applying for social welfare programs?

Why would it harm anyone to pay their fair share of services they use? Poor people don't use roads and schools? (OK, they don't use schools as much, but they use the roads more because they aren't in school all day.)

Pay for what you use. That is a simple concept and keeps people honest. Stop putting your fucking hand out for charity, put it out with a tool in it and work for what you get.

That can only raise the level of this society and has no downside. We are brainwashed into thinking people can't contribute and take care of themselves. People CAN and we should expect it from ALL people.

I agree. But how do you actually implement that?

And again, if you increase taxes on the poor, won't they then tax our welfare system that just more?

[Cracker]

You make everybody pay 7-10% of their earnings as income tax and you limit Welfare to five years. That will allow you to get one "mistake" into school and not do that shit again.

[Cynical Ninja]

Here ya go limey...........But only because of the American bashing.

You use as many foreign products as we do fucknut, in fact more so, you can't buy Chinese milk in the UK dipshit.

Saying the troops are in Afghanistan and Iraq because of oil isn't "anti-American" you retard, it's the fucking truth.

No blood for oil!

[Cynical Ninja]

You can believe that or believe that the U.S. is not such a nanny state as England has become. Yet......................

361 British troops have given their lives to keep your prices down at the pumps douchebag, show a little bit more respect.

[Maggot]

I do not believe the U.S. is in the middle east because of oil. I believe we are there to divide the middle east and keep them from becoming one big pile of shit.

[Cynical Ninja]

I believe we are there to divide the middle east and keep them from becoming one big pile of shit.

Too late!

Have you not read any world news headlines for the last 2 or 3 months?