Personally, I don't see any rabbit hole, but I understand why you're not interested in the legal and constitutional factors, Duchess.

I don't assume you're supposed to care how it's no longer limited to 'emotional well-being' from the perspective of much of the medical community (which is what the courts across the country have to consider).

Anyway, I agree that it sucks prisoners often get better medical care than others and it also sucks that tax-payers have to foot the bill for re-assignment surgery. Moving along...

(01-08-2017, 01:51 AM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: I'm not following you.

It is society that is the source of the individuals dysphoria (a state of unease or generalized dissatisfaction). If society were more inclusive and accepting the pain experienced by the individual would not exist. So the desire to make changes would not exist either. The progress made in gay rights regarding societys' acceptance of our sexual orientation has spared a lot of gays the process of trying to "change" to meet external expectations.

http://roygbiv.jezebel.com/stop-confusin...1583049920

Let's put aside the possibly derailing argument of "there is no wrong way to look like a man and no wrong way to look like a woman" which we often try to advocate in both feminist theory and in trans-queer theory (especially when it comes to removing ourselves from the binary framework), because it isn't helpful here. We need to recognise that gender presentation standards do exist and they are strictly and harshly (sometimes violently) enforced. It's unfair to those with gender dysphoria, especially trans children who we should not expect to be engaged in gender deconstructive discourse at our level, to make this argument in response to claims of gender discomfort. We live in a world with two very strongly enforced boxes, and a great number of us fit into one of those two boxes at least tolerably well, even if the box we are in is not the one we were originally assigned. This is definitely something we need to deconstruct, but for the purposes of this discussion, we need to discuss what is not what we would like to be or we aren't being helpful in the immediate.

Thanks for the link, Ski. I read the article.

The transgender author appears to disagree with your theory -- she is not suggesting that if society ceases to hold people to binary gender stereotypes and expectations that gender dysphoria will be eradicated.

Instead, she advocates for sex reassignment surgery for people with severe gender dysphoria, which, she highlights, is different from body dysphoria. (When it come to body dysphoria, the author feels surgery is not generally as effective.)

Anyway, I don't care how people identify and present themselves, regardless of their genitalia. And, I have no problem with qualified adults getting sex reassignment surgery.

The idea of murderers getting tax-payer funded sex reassignment surgery and being moved to corrections facilities that match their post-surgical genders is not something I feel comfortable with, however. But, given the changes in societal views and medical diagnoses, I understand why prohibiting that is becoming a challenging legal issue for prison officials and courts.

HairOfTheDog. I know the author disagrees with my point of view. Did you see in the Q & A where she says...."I feel sex dysphoria is an aspect of gender dysphoria. Some people really don't have any issues with their bodies at all. Those that do, myself included, see our bodies as in conflict with the standards for our gender identity. Some people are perfectly okay saying "I'm a man with a vagina" or "I am a woman with a penis." I am not okay with leaving that as my end state. Make sense?"

I am simply stating society is the origin of gender and sex dysphoria and until society is more excepting it will continue to exist. She ventures to guess that even in a fully androgynous world it may still exist. I disagree. Who establishes these standards, she is referring above in her answer?

p.s. It is now an established tenet that you are born homosexual. That it is nature. I disagree with that too.
But it has afforded us Constitutional protections so who am I to argue?

Chicks with dicks.

(01-08-2017, 05:37 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: Chicks with dicks.

MWS, This thread welcomes all the erudite insights you can offer from your personal experiences.

Pretty funny!

I understand that that you consider nurture, not nature, responsible for homosexuality and gender dysphoria, Ski.

I'm not compelled to argue nature over nurture.....but many medical professionals, gay individuals, and trans individuals would probably enthusiastically debate you on both counts.

http://www.dcstatesman.com/trans-species-now-thing/

(01-09-2017, 12:55 PM)Blindgreed1 Wrote: http://www.dcstatesman.com/trans-species-now-thing/

I saw the Youtube a year ago; Norwegian Nano is kind of cute. But, trans-species is not a thing. It's not even 'apparently a thing', as the the linked tabloid article claims.

Nano and her boyfriend are either hilarious trolls or deranged young people. Her psychiatrist says she'll grow out of it; safe bet.



I'll give Nano this............she's got cat class and she's got cat class style.

...just your plain, everyday weirdo.

(01-09-2017, 01:16 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:

(01-09-2017, 12:55 PM)Blindgreed1 Wrote: http://www.dcstatesman.com/trans-species-now-thing/

I saw the Youtube a year ago; Norwegian Nano is kind of cute. But, trans-species is not a thing. It's not even 'apparently a thing', as the the linked tabloid article claims.

Nano and her boyfriend are either hilarious trolls or deranged young people. Her psychiatrist says she'll grow out of it; safe bet.



I'll give Nano this............she's got cat class and she's got cat class style.

No?

Those stories are posted way upthread, Gunnar.

There have always been delusional people who think they're non-human, want to be non-human, or just like to pretend so for attention.

But, there's no such thing as trans-species diagnosis or condition.

(01-09-2017, 02:26 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: Those stories are posted way upthread, Gunnar.

There have always been delusional people who think they're non-human, want to be non-human, or just like to pretend so for attention.

But, there's no such thing as trans-species diagnosis or condition.

Give it a few more years... Gender fluid wasn't a thing not so long ago.

(01-09-2017, 03:03 PM)Blindgreed1 Wrote: Gender fluid

Do people actually take that seriously?

(01-09-2017, 03:27 PM)Duchess Wrote:

(01-09-2017, 03:03 PM)Blindgreed1 Wrote: Gender fluid

Do people actually take that seriously?

I think it's just kids fucked in the head, but apparently it's... A thing now.

(01-09-2017, 02:26 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: Those stories are posted way upthread, Gunnar.

There have always been delusional people who think they're non-human, want to be non-human, or just like to pretend so for attention.

But, there's no such thing as trans-species diagnosis or condition.

What about trans-plant? I think I may be a ficus born in the wrong body.

(01-09-2017, 07:30 PM)Clang McFly Wrote: What about trans-plant? I think I may be a ficus born in the wrong body.

You stumped me with that question; had to do a little research.

Turns out, if you believe you were born to be a Ficus, that wood technically make you a sap, not a transplant.

Curiously, though, if you believe you were born to be an old radio and you're always catching static, you might technically qualify as a transistor.

(01-09-2017, 07:42 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:

(01-09-2017, 07:30 PM)Clang McFly Wrote: What about trans-plant? I think I may be a ficus born in the wrong body.

You stumped me with that question; had to do a little research.

Turns out, if you believe you were born to be a Ficus, that wood technically make you a sap, not a transplant.

Curiously, though, if you believe you were born to be an old radio and you're always catching static, you might technically qualify as a transistor.

So I was thinking if a transgender man wanted to marry a transgender woman it would be legal in all 52 states and any religious chuckle heads should be fine with it. Right?