(03-20-2015, 11:44 AM)Duchess Wrote:

Wow! I think if you abort a 7 month old fetus that's murder! If it can live outside the womb it's a baby at that point in my mind.

(03-20-2015, 01:02 PM)sally Wrote: And who are the doctors that are terminating 3^rd trimester pregnancies.

(03-20-2015, 10:40 AM)sally Wrote: Since when is it legal here to have late term abortions? As far as I know you're not allowed to abort a 7 month old fetus unless the mother's life is in jeopardy and even then I think at that stage of pregnancy it's too late. It's no longer a fetus, it's a viable baby.

(03-20-2015, 07:44 PM)QueenBee Wrote:

(03-20-2015, 10:40 AM)sally Wrote: Since when is it legal here to have late term abortions? As far as I know you're not allowed to abort a 7 month old fetus unless the mother's life is in jeopardy and even then I think at that stage of pregnancy it's too late. It's no longer a fetus, it's a viable baby.

I can sort of address this, maybe. back in the 80's my brother and sis in law were expecting. When she was scheduled for her 6 month check up, my brother at the last minute decided to take the afternoon off work and go with her, so he could hear the baby's heartbeat and see the ultrasound picture. During the ultrasound, the tech saw something "wrong" and called in a doc. The baby was laying splayed out, not in fetal position. So they sent her for an X ray. Turns out the baby was anacephalic...meaning no brain was developing. The baby would be either still born or die shortly after birth even if carried to term. The baby was "living" only through mom's cord
They decided to bring her in and induce labor, and she gave birth naturaly to a still born baby. It was never referred to as an abortion, but a still born birth.

That's a lovely letter.

(03-21-2015, 03:24 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: She callously discarded Michelle after removing the baby from her womb, leaving her for dead, and then, after discovering the baby wasn't a boy, basically killed her.

She shouldn't ever leave a prison again as long as she lives.

(03-21-2015, 01:24 PM)Duchess Wrote: That's a lovely letter.

(03-27-2015, 04:29 PM)Duchess Wrote:

Wow. Her actions caused that baby's death.

The state's highest court has thrown out the manslaughter conviction of a Sound Beach woman for the death of a baby she delivered after a car crash in which she did not wear her seat belt, ruling that the law does not hold women criminally responsible in such cases.

If it did, a pregnant woman who ignored doctor's orders to stay in bed, took prescription or illegal drugs, shoveled snow or carried groceries could be charged with manslaughter if those acts resulted in premature birth and death of the child, Judge Eugene Pigott Jr. wrote for the court's 5-1 majority.


The ruling came in the case of ^ Jennifer Jorgensen, 35, who was eight months pregnant when she crashed head-on into another car in May 2008 on Whiskey Road in Ridge. The crash killed the occupants of the other car, Robert Kelly, 74, and his wife Mary, 70, of Ridge. Jorgensen's daughter, born as a result of an emergency cesarean section, died six days later.

Suffolk prosecutors charged her with second-degree manslaughter in all three deaths, arguing that she was impaired by prescription drugs and alcohol and recklessly caused the three deaths. Her first trial ended with a hung jury. A second jury in March 2012 acquitted her of the Kellys' deaths, finding there wasn't proof that she was impaired after hearing of unconventional handling of blood evidence in the case.

But that second jury convicted Jorgensen in her baby's death because she wasn't wearing a seat belt. She was sentenced to 3 - 9 years.

After the court granted Jorgensen's appeal and overturned her conviction, Robert Clifford, spokesman for the district attorney's office, said in a statement, "We agree with the court that the state legislature must clarify the extent of the criminal liability of a pregnant woman, as the court put it, 'for acts committed against a fetus' that is later born, and subsequently dies, as a result of injuries suffered before birth."

Pigott wrote that the law as written permits homicide charges only for a victim "who has been born and is alive." Because any reckless act by Jorgensen took place before her child was born, the law doesn't allow her to be charged, he wrote. He added that if she had not given consent for an emergency C-section and the fetus was stillborn, prosecutors never would have charged her.

Allowing Suffolk prosecutors' interpretation of the law "would create a perverse incentive for a pregnant woman to refuse a Caesarean section out of fear that if the baby is born alive she would face criminal charges," Pigott wrote.

Judge Eugene Fahey dissented from the majority decision. "There is no pregnant mother exception from criminal liability for reckless acts that result in the death of a mother's baby postpartum," he wrote.

Jorgensen has a federal civil rights suit pending against Suffolk police, prosecutors and forensic scientists, said her fight is not over.

(10-23-2015, 06:04 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: This story is interesting legally and reminded me of the Dynel Lane case.


The state's highest court has thrown out the manslaughter conviction of a Sound Beach woman for the death of a baby she delivered after a car crash in which she did not wear her seat belt, ruling that the law does not hold women criminally responsible in such cases.

If it did, a pregnant woman who ignored doctor's orders to stay in bed, took prescription or illegal drugs, shoveled snow or carried groceries could be charged with manslaughter if those acts resulted in premature birth and death of the child, Judge Eugene Pigott Jr. wrote for the court's 5-1 majority.


The ruling came in the case of ^ Jennifer Jorgensen, 35, who was eight months pregnant when she crashed head-on into another car in May 2008 on Whiskey Road in Ridge. The crash killed the occupants of the other car, Robert Kelly, 74, and his wife Mary, 70, of Ridge. Jorgensen's daughter, born as a result of an emergency cesarean section, died six days later.

Suffolk prosecutors charged her with second-degree manslaughter in all three deaths, arguing that she was impaired by prescription drugs and alcohol and recklessly caused the three deaths. Her first trial ended with a hung jury. A second jury in March 2012 acquitted her of the Kellys' deaths, finding there wasn't proof that she was impaired after hearing of unconventional handling of blood evidence in the case.

But that second jury convicted Jorgensen in her baby's death because she wasn't wearing a seat belt. She was sentenced to 3 - 9 years.

After the court granted Jorgensens appeal and overturned her conviction, Robert Clifford, spokesman for the district attorney's office, said in a statement, "We agree with the court that the state legislature must clarify the extent of the criminal liability of a pregnant woman, as the court put it, 'for acts committed against a fetus' that is later born, and subsequently dies, as a result of injuries suffered before birth."

Pigott wrote that the law as written permits homicide charges only for a victim "who has been born and is alive." Because any reckless act by Jorgensen took place before her child was born, the law doesn't allow her to be charged, he wrote. He added that if she had not given consent for an emergency C-section and the fetus was stillborn, prosecutors never would have charged her.

Allowing Suffolk prosecutors' interpretation of the law "would create a perverse incentive for a pregnant woman to refuse a Caesarean section out of fear that if the baby is born alive she would face criminal charges," Pigott wrote.

Judge Eugene Fahey dissented from the majority decision. "There is no pregnant mother exception from criminal liability for reckless acts that result in the death of a mother's baby postpartum," he wrote.

Jorgensen has a federal civil rights suit pending against Suffolk police, prosecutors and forensic scientists, said her fight is not over.

Full story: http://www.newsday.com/long-island/suffolk/new-york-s-highest-court-tosses-manslaughter-conviction-against-jennifer-jorgensen-of-sound-beach-in-2008-crash-1.10999277

(10-23-2015, 06:09 PM)Blindgreed1 Wrote: "unconventional handling of blood evidence?" Morons jacked up the blood work.

(10-24-2015, 03:51 PM)SIXFOOTERsez Wrote: Wow, what a clusterfuck