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+--- Thread: Rap music and private prisons (/thread-8010.html)
Rap music and private prisons - shitstorm - 05-20-2012
After more than 20 years, I’ve finally decided to tell the world what I witnessed in 1991, which I believe was one of the biggest turning point in popular music, and ultimately American society.
I have struggled for a long time weighing the pros and cons of making this story public as I was reluctant to implicate the individuals who were present that day. So I’ve simply decided to leave out names and all the details that may risk my personal well being and that of those who were, like me, dragged into something they weren’t ready for.
Between the late 80′s and early 90’s, I was what you may call a “decision maker” with one of the more established company in the music industry. I came from Europe in the early 80’s and quickly established myself in the business.
The industry was different back then. Since technology and media weren’t accessible to people like they are today, the industry had more control over the public and had the means to influence them anyway it wanted. This may explain why, in early 1991, I was invited to attend a closed door meeting with a small group of music business insiders to discuss rap music’s new direction. Little did I know that we would be asked to participate in one of the most unethical and destructive business practice I’ve ever seen.
The meeting was held at a private residence on the outskirts of Los Angeles. I remember about 25 to 30 people being there, most of them familiar faces. Speaking to those I knew, we joked about the theme of the meeting as many of us did not care for rap music and failed to see the purpose of being invited to a private gathering to discuss its future.
Among the attendees was a small group of unfamiliar faces who stayed to themselves and made no attempt to socialize beyond their circle. Based on their behavior and formal appearances, they didn’t seem to be in our industry.
Our casual chatter was interrupted when we were asked to sign a confidentiality agreement preventing us from publicly discussing the information presented during the meeting. Needless to say, this intrigued and in some cases disturbed many of us.
The agreement was only a page long but very clear on the matter and consequences which stated that violating the terms would result in job termination. We asked several people what this meeting was about and the reason for such secrecy but couldn’t find anyone who had answers for us. A few people refused to sign and walked out. No one stopped them. I was tempted to follow but curiosity got the best of me. A man who was part of the “unfamiliar” group collected the agreements from us.
Quickly after the meeting began, one of my industry colleagues (who shall remain nameless like everyone else) thanked us for attending. He then gave the floor to a man who only introduced himself by first name and gave no further details about his personal background. I think he was the owner of the residence but it was never confirmed.
He briefly praised all of us for the success we had achieved in our industry and congratulated us for being selected as part of this small group of “decision makers”. At this point I begin to feel slightly uncomfortable at the strangeness of this gathering.
The subject quickly changed as the speaker went on to tell us that the respective companies we represented had invested in a very profitable industry which could become even more rewarding with our active involvement. He explained that the companies we work for had invested millions into the building of privately owned prisons and that our positions of influence in the music industry would actually impact the profitability of these investments.
I remember many of us in the group immediately looking at each other in confusion. At the time, I didn’t know what a private prison was but I wasn’t the only one. Sure enough, someone asked what these prisons were and what any of this had to do with us. We were told that these prisons were built by privately owned companies who received funding from the government based on the number of inmates. The more inmates, the more money the government would pay these prisons.
It was also made clear to us that since these prisons are privately owned, as they become publicly traded, we’d be able to buy shares. Most of us were taken back by this. Again, a couple of people asked what this had to do with us. At this point, my industry colleague who had first opened the meeting took the floor again and answered our questions.
He told us that since our employers had become silent investors in this prison business, it was now in their interest to make sure that these prisons remained filled. Our job would be to help make this happen by marketing music which promotes criminal behavior, rap being the music of choice.
He assured us that this would be a great situation for us because rap music was becoming an increasingly profitable market for our companies, and as employee, we’d also be able to buy personal stocks in these prisons.
more: http://www.wariscrime.com/2012/05/15/news/the-rap-music-conspiracy/
This time period would have coincided with when the CIA flooded the streets with crack.
Oh, and I'm not absolving the dirtbags from their actions. However, I always knew that the explosion of this soul destroying 'music' was calculated social engineering.
There are some interesting comments following the article at the link.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - Donovan - 05-20-2012
horse shit.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - Cynical Ninja - 05-20-2012
What becomes crystal clear to me here is that shitstorm knows absolutely nothing about rap music.
Gangster rap created by a secret cabal to keep private prisons full?
Absolute unadulterated bullshit.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - HairOfTheDog - 05-20-2012
An anonymous writer coming out with this 20 years later. No names mentioned.
Where are/were these private prisons located? Why would the government not want control of its own prisoners? With all of the money made on rap music (even back then), why would these investors be interested in the likes of government funding?
This is some straight up bullshit, imo; likely being dumped by the "rap music causes violence" crusaders.
No verification, no names = no validity, as far as I'm concerned.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - shitstorm - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 02:25 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: An anonymous writer coming out with this 20 years later. No names mentioned.
Where are/were these private prisons located? Why would the government not want control of its own prisoners? With all of the money made on rap music (even back then), why would these investors be interested in the likes of government funding?
This is some straight up bullshit, imo; likely being dumped by the "rap music causes violence" crusaders.
No verification, no names = no validity, as far as I'm concerned.
Are you kidding? You don't know about private prisons?! It's HUGE business. Governments want $$$ and this saves them big money as well as some probable kick backs. They buy and build prisons and jails and then contract their 'services,' to the state or county, to run the facilities. Jeez, didn't you hear about the Pennsylvania judges who were taking kickbacks to send juveniles to these places? One kid committed suicide and his mother was on the news screaming at the judge.
Here's just one company and their facilities:
http://www.cca.com/facilities/
RE: Rap music and private prisons - Cynical Ninja - 05-20-2012
Did you get this gangsta rap conspiracy theory from Stormfront the white supremacist site?
You seem to have been spending a lot of time there recently you idiot.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - HairOfTheDog - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 02:54 PM)shitstorm Wrote:(05-20-2012, 02:25 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: An anonymous writer coming out with this 20 years later. No names mentioned.
Where are/were these private prisons located? Why would the government not want control of its own prisoners? With all of the money made on rap music (even back then), why would these investors be interested in the likes of government funding?
This is some straight up bullshit, imo; likely being dumped by the "rap music causes violence" crusaders.
No verification, no names = no validity, as far as I'm concerned.
Are you kidding? You don't know about private prisons?! It's HUGE business. Governments want $$$ and this saves them big money as well as some probable kick backs. They buy and build prisons and jails and then contract their 'services,' to the state or county, to run the facilities. Jeez, didn't you hear about the Pennsylvania judges who were taking kickbacks to send juveniles to these places? One kid committed suicide and his mother was on the news screaming at the judge.
Here's just one company and their facilities:
http://www.cca.com/facilities/
Not buying it. I don't believe a group of unidentified music industry professionals was solicited to proliferate rap music as a means to fill any prisons, private or otherwise. Where are THESE private prisons mentioned in the anonymous article located? What "decision making" position within what "music industry company" did the writer hold? Why are there no names and not one detail that can be verified in the on-line article you posted?
Sorry shitstorm, I respect your right to consider this a believable account, but it smells like pure bullshit to me. I like facts and substantiation before I buy into something posted anonymously on-line.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - shitstorm - 05-20-2012
A Supreme Court case could determine whether thousands of inmates in privately run prisons have the same rights to sue in federal court as prisoners in facilities run by the U.S. government.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204505304577003552486568514.html
MIAMI—Florida's Senate is expected to vote Tuesday on a controversial plan to privatize state prison facilities in southern Florida, a move that would create one of the largest private prison operations in the nation.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204062704577221570635620102.html
Prison companies are preparing for a wave of new business as the economic downturn makes it increasingly difficult for federal and state government officials to build and operate their own jails.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122705334657739263.html
In recent years, the trend toward privatization, both among state governments and at the federal level has been part of an attempt to address serious budget troubles and crisis-level prison overcrowding by outsourcing more and more corrections operations to private companies.
The move has translated into big business for industry leaders like Corrections Corporation of America (CXW), The Geo Group (GEO) and Cornell Companies, Inc. (CRN) (just last week, The Geo Group and Cornell finalized a merger valued at $730 million).
According to research firm IBISWorld USA, private corrections is a $22.7 billion industry with an annual growth rate in the last half-decade of 4.7%. While growth slowed from 2009 to 2010, projections for the industry remain largely optimistic.
"The prison population continues to grow regardless of what the economic conditions are," says George Van Horn, senior analyst at IBISWorld.
http://money.cnn.com/2010/08/17/news/economy/private_prisons_economic_impact.fortune/index.htm?section=magazines_fortune&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fmagazines_fortune+%28Fortune+Magazine%29
DENVER (MarketWatch) — The more children judges locked away, the more money owners of a for-profit juvenile detention center could make slamming the bars.
Federal prosecutors called it “Kids For Cash.”
An owner of a private detention center, Robert Powell, was sentenced to 1 1⁄2 years in prison Friday for allegedly paying kickbacks to two county judges in Pennsylvania. Powell got off relatively easy after cooperating with prosecutors.
Earlier this year, Luzerne County’s former president judge Michael Conahan was sentenced to 17 1⁄2 years, and Judge Mark Ciavarella, a.k.a. “Mr. Zero Tolerance,” was sentenced to 28 years.
The case is a testament to the effectiveness of economic incentives, getting county judges to incarcerate kids just for doing what kids sometimes do:
—A 10-year-old girl reportedly got a month in a detention center for accidentally setting her bedroom on fire.
—A 13-year-old boy reportedly got 48 days for throwing food at his mother’s boyfriend during an argument.
—A 16-year-old girl reportedly got a month in a boot camp for creating a Web page making fun of the assistant principal of her high school.
—A 17-year-old boy reportedly got five months for drug paraphernalia — not drugs themselves — and it was his first offense.
The Supreme Court of Pennsylvania had to dismiss 4,000 juvenile cases because of the compromising kickbacks.
http://articles.marketwatch.com/2011-11-09/commentary/30810260_1_private-prisons-detention-center-county-judges
RE: Rap music and private prisons - Cracker - 05-20-2012
Repost Bot,
Please stop.
Thanks,
Cracker
p.s. I didn't read it. I don't care. If I do get a sudden interest, I can go to one of the top secret websites.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - Cynical Ninja - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 03:17 PM)Cracker Wrote: p.s. I didn't read it. I don't care. If I do get a sudden interest, I can go to one of the top secret websites.
Abovetopsecret.com is where a lot of the conpsiracy tards hang out.
Some of the theories on there make shitstorm sound almost sane.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - shitstorm - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 03:08 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:(05-20-2012, 02:54 PM)shitstorm Wrote:(05-20-2012, 02:25 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: An anonymous writer coming out with this 20 years later. No names mentioned.
Where are/were these private prisons located? Why would the government not want control of its own prisoners? With all of the money made on rap music (even back then), why would these investors be interested in the likes of government funding?
This is some straight up bullshit, imo; likely being dumped by the "rap music causes violence" crusaders.
No verification, no names = no validity, as far as I'm concerned.
Are you kidding? You don't know about private prisons?! It's HUGE business. Governments want $$$ and this saves them big money as well as some probable kick backs. They buy and build prisons and jails and then contract their 'services,' to the state or county, to run the facilities. Jeez, didn't you hear about the Pennsylvania judges who were taking kickbacks to send juveniles to these places? One kid committed suicide and his mother was on the news screaming at the judge.
Here's just one company and their facilities:
http://www.cca.com/facilities/
Not buying it. I don't believe a group of unidentified music industry professionals was solicited to proliferate rap music as a means to fill any prisons, private or otherwise. Where are THESE private prisons mentioned in the anonymous article located? What "decision making" position within what "music industry company" did the writer hold? Why are there no names and not one detail that can be verified in the on-line article you posted?
Sorry shitstorm, I respect your right to consider this a believable account, but it smells like pure bullshit to me. I like facts and substantiation before I buy into something posted anonymously on-line.
I actually agree with you about there being nothing to verify the veracity of the music industry article. I could be as he wrote it, could be partially true, or not true. For years, though, I have observed what I consider an obvious social engineering agenda with the filthy trash that gets peddled by the music industry. At the very least, their product is intended to debase the kids who listen to it and makes the industry enormous money.
You may have never known about the CIA being the cause of the explosion of crack cocaine, either, but that's exactly what happened. Just because you're unfamiliar with something doesn't mean it doesn't exist. When you hear something so outrageous, something that has such a big impact on the society that you live in, it benefits you to find out for yourself. Anything less is willful ignorance.
Why in the hell do you ask me where these private prisons are when I just gave you a fucking link, from one company, with the locations of their facilities? Open the link and look, ffs.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - Cynical Ninja - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 03:24 PM)shitstorm Wrote: I actually agree with you about there being nothing to verify the veracity of the music industry article. I could be as he wrote it, could be partially true, or not true. For years, though, I have observed what I consider an obvious social engineering agenda with the filthy trash that gets peddled by the music industry. At the very least, their product is intended to debase the kids who listen to it and makes the industry enormous money.
The older generation ALWAYS thinks the music of the time is shit and is "debasing" their kids.
Elvis, The Beatles, Heavy Metal, Punk all met with howls of derision by the older generation and it stills goes on now with the music of the day.
You are talking shit again.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - HairOfTheDog - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 03:12 PM)shitstorm Wrote: A Supreme Court case could determine whether thousands of inmates in privately run prisons have the same rights to sue in federal court as prisoners in facilities run by the U.S. government.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204505304577003552486568514.html
MIAMI—Florida's Senate is expected to vote Tuesday on a controversial plan to privatize state prison facilities in southern Florida, a move that would create one of the largest private prison operations in the nation.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204062704577221570635620102.html
Prison companies are preparing for a wave of new business as the economic downturn makes it increasingly difficult for federal and state government officials to build and operate their own jails.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122705334657739263.html
In recent years, the trend toward privatization, both among state governments and at the federal level has been part of an attempt to address serious budget troubles and crisis-level prison overcrowding by outsourcing more and more corrections operations to private companies.
The move has translated into big business for industry leaders like Corrections Corporation of America (CXW), The Geo Group (GEO) and Cornell Companies, Inc. (CRN) (just last week, The Geo Group and Cornell finalized a merger valued at $730 million).
According to research firm IBISWorld USA, private corrections is a $22.7 billion industry with an annual growth rate in the last half-decade of 4.7%. While growth slowed from 2009 to 2010, projections for the industry remain largely optimistic.
"The prison population continues to grow regardless of what the economic conditions are," says George Van Horn, senior analyst at IBISWorld.
http://money.cnn.com/2010/08/17/news/economy/private_prisons_economic_impact.fortune/index.htm?section=magazines_fortune&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+rss%2Fmagazines_fortune+%28Fortune+Magazine%29
DENVER (MarketWatch) — The more children judges locked away, the more money owners of a for-profit juvenile detention center could make slamming the bars.
Federal prosecutors called it “Kids For Cash.”
An owner of a private detention center, Robert Powell, was sentenced to 1 1⁄2 years in prison Friday for allegedly paying kickbacks to two county judges in Pennsylvania. Powell got off relatively easy after cooperating with prosecutors.
Earlier this year, Luzerne County’s former president judge Michael Conahan was sentenced to 17 1⁄2 years, and Judge Mark Ciavarella, a.k.a. “Mr. Zero Tolerance,” was sentenced to 28 years.
The case is a testament to the effectiveness of economic incentives, getting county judges to incarcerate kids just for doing what kids sometimes do:
—A 10-year-old girl reportedly got a month in a detention center for accidentally setting her bedroom on fire.
—A 13-year-old boy reportedly got 48 days for throwing food at his mother’s boyfriend during an argument.
—A 16-year-old girl reportedly got a month in a boot camp for creating a Web page making fun of the assistant principal of her high school.
—A 17-year-old boy reportedly got five months for drug paraphernalia — not drugs themselves — and it was his first offense.
The Supreme Court of Pennsylvania had to dismiss 4,000 juvenile cases because of the compromising kickbacks.
http://articles.marketwatch.com/2011-11-09/commentary/30810260_1_private-prisons-detention-center-county-judges
I'm not arguing with you about the existence of private prisons and kick backs. I'm saying that I don't believe any music industry decision makers were solicited to proliferate rap music as a means to increase crime in order to fill prisons, any kinds of prisons. I don't think anyone organizing such a conspiracy would approach a bunch of music industry strangers and brag about getting government funding to fill prisons as a result of inciting crime; that's a crock and would be a sure way to fuck their (imaginary) governmental partners and funding. Shout it from the rooftops - not believable.
The story is bullshit, imo. You can post articles about private prisons and kick backs, but the story is still bullshit, imo. Completely unrelated.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - HairOfTheDog - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 03:24 PM)shitstorm Wrote: Why in the hell do you ask me where these private prisons are when I just gave you a fucking link, from one company, with the locations of their facilities? Open the link and look, ffs.
Unless you are saying that there's verification that these prisons are prisons that were filled with people who found themselves there as a result of rap music enciting them to commit crimes, IT IS IRRELEVANT FFS.
Your OP was about a specific story/contention. It doesn't relate at all to the CIA and cocaine.. which you mentioned in the response that I trimmed. I don't believe the story you posted to be true and am respectfully not interested in going down the rabbithole into a bunch of other conspiracy theories or incidents of true/alleged governmental corrupution.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - Maggot - 05-20-2012
Rap and music should never be in the same sentence. Rap should be catagorized as "the spoken word"
RE: Rap music and private prisons - FAHQTOO - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 04:15 PM)Maggot Wrote: Rap and music should never be in the same sentence. Rap should be catagorized as "the spoken word"
I agree. I can't connect it at all with what the older generations of the past have complained about.
The first time I ever heard it, I was in my early thirties...hardly an old bat with nothing better to do except complain about my kids music.
Gangsta Rap is by far THE worst music to ever come along. I feel like I want to get violent when I hear that shit. It was not allowed in my house for any reason whatsoever!!!
Look at the people who listen to it (other than the wiggers) and tell me I'm wrong. Hip-hop sucks a big donkey dick too, but it's not offensive and criminal in nature like g-rap is.
How many "rappers" have been killed, put up on murder charges (in the news this week), or are in jail for their lifestyle. It's hate personified. You don't see that with ANY other type of music.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - shitstorm - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 03:35 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: I'm not arguing with you about the existence of private prisons a
Uh, actually you were. Here's what you said:
Where are/were these private prisons located? Why would the government not want control of its own prisoners? With all of the money made on rap music (even back then), why would these investors be interested in the likes of government funding?
You very clear. You didn't believe there were private prisons and you couldn't figure out the money angle or why the govt would give up control. THAT'S WHAT YOU FUCKING SAID. That would be fine if you would own what you said instead of trying to walk it back. Just admit what you said.
I'll repeat that I agree with about not being able to know if the music industry story is true. I just thought it was an interesting account to ponder. A couple of the comments seemed to affirm that shit like that goes on, but I'm not in that industry so I can't say. I do know that music and media is very powerful and is an important contributor to shaping culture and our culture has gone into the toilet. It isn't just the thugs who listen to that shit, anymore. Middle class, nice kids are getting their minds poisoned with it and it has an impact. The question is is that premeditated by forces who intend harm. Never mind this anonymous article. That just raises the question.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - HairOfTheDog - 05-20-2012
(05-20-2012, 06:28 PM)shitstorm Wrote:(05-20-2012, 03:35 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: I'm not arguing with you about the existence of private prisons a
Uh, actually you were. Here's what you said:
Where are/were these private prisons located? Why would the government not want control of its own prisoners? With all of the money made on rap music (even back then), why would these investors be interested in the likes of government funding?
You very clear. You didn't believe there were private prisons and you couldn't figure out the money angle or why the govt would give up control. THAT'S WHAT YOU FUCKING SAID. That would be fine if you would own what you said instead of trying to walk it back. Just admit what you said.
I'll repeat that I agree with about not being able to know if the music industry story is true. I just thought it was an interesting account to ponder. A couple of the comments seemed to affirm that shit like that goes on, but I'm not in that industry so I can't say. I do know that music and media is very powerful and is an important contributor to shaping culture and our culture has gone into the toilet. It isn't just the thugs who listen to that shit, anymore. Middle class, nice kids are getting their minds poisoned with it and it has an impact. The question is is that premeditated by forces who intend harm. Never mind this anonymous article. That just raises the question.
Yes, shitstorm, I admit that I misunderstood at first and was wrong. I'm not backpedaling. I originally thought the article was claiming that the rap music industry executives were in it for government funding of prisoners. Why government would turn control of prisoners to them and why rap music executives would even be interested made no sense. I understood after your first post that the writer was alleging that private investors of some other sort (with ties to prison/govt) were soliciting music industry executives to use rap to fill their prisons in order to obtain funding. Still unbelievable, to me.
Sorry for the confusion. I'm indeed not arguing about private prisons and kick backs; you made your point. I don't think it relates to the OP story because I don't believe that the story in the article actually occured. I also don't believe that rap music is responsible for filling prison cells, of any sort. JMO.
RE: Rap music and private prisons - shitstorm - 05-20-2012
The story is far out but I can't discount the possibility that it's true. Stranger conspiracies have occurred, like the CIA flooding the inner cities with crack. On that second one, one has to ask what the end game was. Was it just government drug dealing to make money for black projects (and themselves) or was de-stablization of the target population (i.e., addiction and crime as social control) also the goal? I also agree that rap music can't fill prisons. Music and entertainment is a contributing factor to manipulating people, though. Of course, that's why any parent with half a brain wants to keep their kid away from those influences. Sadly, I don't think a lot of parents have half a brain.