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+--- Thread: Happy Days Happy Dance / FAST & FURIOUS ARMS DEAL (/thread-8293.html)
Happy Days Happy Dance / FAST & FURIOUS ARMS DEAL - IMaDick - 06-20-2012
For the Justice department
President Obama is claiming executive privilege in refusing to give certain documents to Congress concerning the "Fast and Furious" operation.
The Justice Department requested that Obama assert the privilege regarding documents concerning the botched gun-smuggling operation.
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/theoval/post/2012/06/obama-team-fast-and-furious-documents-are-privileged/1
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - Maggot - 06-20-2012
They ALL use that at some point.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-20-2012
it means that the orders came from the executive, you understand that don't you?
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - Maggot - 06-20-2012
(06-20-2012, 02:21 PM)IMaDick Wrote: it means that the orders came from the executive, you understand that don't you?
And they said you would never learn.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-21-2012
(06-20-2012, 02:26 PM)Maggot Wrote:(06-20-2012, 02:21 PM)IMaDick Wrote: it means that the orders came from the executive, you understand that don't you?
And they said you would never learn.
I learned a long time ago not to try to impress a yankee retard with things like this.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - Maggot - 06-21-2012
Use this before speaking to me please.
![[Image: honest-product_1-hand-sanitizer_thumb.jpg]](http://www.weirduniverse.net/images/uploads/honest-product_1-hand-sanitizer_thumb.jpg)
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-21-2012
I'm glad you claimed the identy of the yankee retard, I wasn't sue if that was you or not until now.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - Ma Huang Sor - 06-21-2012
I like how gas prices are dropping. Do you suppose there's some 'executive privilege' involved there?
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-21-2012
(06-21-2012, 12:24 PM)Ma Huang Sor Wrote: I like how gas prices are dropping. Do you suppose there's some 'executive privilege' involved there?
What's involved is a slowing world economy and a drop in overall useage plus a spike in production.
That always equates to lower prices.
If you want to see something stupid do a historical search of prices when oil was at the same price over the years.
Gas should be about a buck 65 maybe a buck 70 a gallon right now.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - Maggot - 06-21-2012
Well at least the most common phrase in my house is not “someone go jiggle the handle.”
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-21-2012
(06-21-2012, 12:34 PM)Maggot Wrote: Well at least the most common phrase in my house is not “someone go jiggle the handle.”
When you flush the whole house I wouldn't expect to have to jiggle the handle on the toilet.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - HairOfTheDog - 06-21-2012
Hard to tell what the hell is really going on with Obama invoking Executive Privilege over the Fast and Furious investigation docs.
Issa and the Republicans want to see more of the documents and claim that Holder has been smokescreening in failing to respond to their subpoena. I too would like to know how those US tagged guns lost traceability in the botched cartel sting operation and wound up being involved in the deaths of Border Control Agent Terry and the hundreds of Mexican residents.
BUT, if turning over those docs would jeopardize the investigation/prosecution of gun runners, cartel affiliates or anyone else involved in criminal activity, those docs should not be made public (which Issa may want to do based on his other transpareny efforts in his postion), imo. Still, I'm not clear as to why the Congressional investigative committee can't see classified docs, unless Obama and/or Holder fear that they would be leaked or there are parts of the investigation that they indeed want to keep hidden.
I'm not confident that either side is being completely forthcoming in their reasoning and this looks like a major pissing contest to me. It's a disgrace how little cooperation and how much backstabbing there is between the parties in DC. I do hope the parents of Agent Terry get some answers somehow.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - Ma Huang Sor - 06-21-2012
Reminds me of Iran Contra.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-21-2012
(06-21-2012, 01:52 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: It's a disgrace how little cooperation and how much backstabbing there is between the parties in DC. I do hope the parents of Agent Terry get some answers somehow.
ya let's not hold the highest law enforcement officer in the country to task for his part in a crime.Let's not hold him accountable for lying.
Let's not hold his boss to task for the orders and fro lying about giving them.
"backstabbing" what a crock of shit that word is when used in this context.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - HairOfTheDog - 06-21-2012
(06-21-2012, 02:49 PM)IMaDick Wrote:(06-21-2012, 01:52 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote: It's a disgrace how little cooperation and how much backstabbing there is between the parties in DC. I do hope the parents of Agent Terry get some answers somehow.
Let's not hold him accountable for lying.
Let's not hold his boss to task for the orders and fro lying about giving them.
"backstabbing" what a crock of shit that word is when used in this context.
Good afternoon, Dick.
Let's not assume that the highest law enforcement official in the country is guilty of crimes, including perjury, without evidence. The reason there is an investigation underway is to find out what really went down, who was and wasn't involved, etc...
Unfortunately, my magic 8 ball doesn't seem to work as well yours and I don't happen to know everything. Since you apparently already know for certain what others in DC are trying to determine, maybe Issa should just give you a ring? In the meantime, I'll continue following the story according to what facts have been released and by weighing the statements (across media outlets) made by the parties involved in the investigation and contempt proceedings.
"Backstabbing" is a hobby between parties in DC, IMHO. However, my statement was a general one regarding feuds and lack of cooperation between the Repubs and Dems, not specific to this specific investigation (though most likely taking place in it, imo).
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-21-2012
He has already made a statement in which he claimed no knowledge of the operation for several months after it began, Do you believe that?
If you do then incompetence is just as good of a reason to remove him.
Obama said he saw it on TV first, Do you believe that?
If you do then incompetence is just as good a reason to marginalize him until he can be voted out of office.
Congress has asked for documentation, if both of the assertions above are true based on their previous statements then why hide those facts that support your previous statements?
I don't think guilt is the question I think responsibility for the guilt is the issue.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - HairOfTheDog - 06-21-2012
I don't know what to believe, Dick. I'm following along. As I said here and in other threads, many things surrounding the botched F&F operation and its investigation smell fishy to me. I don't know if it's because we the people simply know so little (which could be either for valid or cover-your-ass reasons) or because it does strike me as odd that Holder and Obama first claimed no knowledge and now Obama is claiming privilege. Is it possible that he's justifiably claiming privilege based on what he's learned since he made his original statement? Maybe, imo.
Is it incompetent that neither Holder or Obama may have been aware of the F&F operation? I don't know. There are a lot of operations underway at any given time and both men do and must delegate. I'd have to understand better whether Holder knew nothing at all according to his claims (which would not look good) or if he knew of the operation and it's goals and general status, but was not involved in all of the details. The latter could be appropriate, imo.
I'm on the fence here until we all know more.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-21-2012
Do you think that the gun shops didn't have an agreement with the justice dept holding themselves harmless in the illegal sale of firearms?
Have the shop owners been arrested and charged? have any rogue agents been indicted or fired? weren't those in charge of fast and furious given promotions and moved to another area in the justice dept?
The facts are simple until a person becomes an apologist for them.
It's then that the facts become a real problem and all of the what ifs come out.
The simple fact is there are only 2 possibilities, they either knew or they didn't and either way they are guilty of giving the orders or not knowing what was going on in their positions.
The buck stops where?
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - HairOfTheDog - 06-21-2012
Quote:Dick wrote:
Do you think that the gun shops didn't have an agreement with the justice dept holding themselves harmless in the illegal sale of firearms?
I don't know. Has this been verified to be a fact?
Quote: Dick wrote:
Have the shop owners been arrested and charged? have any rogue agents been indicted or fired? weren't those in charge of fast and furious given promotions and moved to another area in the justice dept?
I don't know. Have "rogue agents" been verified to have existed and been identified?
I do believe I read about some related promotions within the Justice Dept sometime back, can't say for sure.
Quote:Dick wrote:
The facts are simple until a person becomes an apologist for them.
It's then that the facts become a real problem and all of the what ifs come out.
The simple fact is there are only 2 possibilities, they either knew or they didn't and either way they are guilty of giving the orders or not knowing what was going on in their positions.
The buck stops where?
The buck ultimately stops with Holder, imo. If Holder committed any crime or gross negligence of duties and Obama knowingly assists him, Obama's responsible as well. However, at this time, I don't know what comprises "the buck".
I don't form definitive opinions and make positive assertions as quickly as do you, Dick. I like to know what the fuck really went down before I convict or impeach anybody. Sometimes, it's so obvious that we'll never know the truth because it's being withheld for nefarious reasons that I can form a strong opinion against someone/something based on that alone. In this case, I'd need more to mentally convict or absolve Holder and/or Obama.
RE: Happy Days Happy Dance - IMaDick - 06-21-2012
(06-21-2012, 04:02 PM)HairOfTheDog Wrote:Quote:Dick wrote:
Do you think that the gun shops didn't have an agreement with the justice dept holding themselves harmless in the illegal sale of firearms?
I don't know. Has this been verified to be a fact?
Quote: Dick wrote:
Have the shop owners been arrested and charged? have any rogue agents been indicted or fired? weren't those in charge of fast and furious given promotions and moved to another area in the justice dept?
I don't know. Have "rogue agents" been verified to have existed and been identified?
I do believe I read about some related promotions within the Justice Dept sometime back, can't say for sure.
Quote:Dick wrote:
The facts are simple until a person becomes an apologist for them.
It's then that the facts become a real problem and all of the what ifs come out.
The simple fact is there are only 2 possibilities, they either knew or they didn't and either way they are guilty of giving the orders or not knowing what was going on in their positions.
The buck stops where?
The buck ultimately stops with Holder, imo. If Holder committed any crime or gross negligence of duties and Obama knowingly assists him, Obama's responsible as well. However, at this time, I don't know what comprises "the buck".
I don't form definitive opinions and make positive assertions as quickly as do you, Dick. I like to know what the fuck really went down before I convict or impeach anybody. Sometimes, it's so obvious that we'll never know the truth because it's being withheld for nefarious reasons that I can form a strong opinion against someone/something based on that alone. In this case, I'd need more to mentally convict or absolve Holder and/or Obama.
Here is what went on, they both denied knowledge, then Obama claimed executive priviledge when the shit hit the fan.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that we the public will never know all ofthe facts.
just deal with the facts we have, from this point forward spin will take over and what we find out will be nothing more than damage control.
I know those agents were given promotions, is that normal for someone who went rogue?
The buck stops with Obama the buck no matter what it is always stops with the President when his appointments fail.
He wouldn't hesitate to take credit if success was the story, He shouldn't hesitate to be held accountable when death and bullshit are the result.