Understanding political discourse

[pyropappy]

Empirical fact: if this country doesn't come together our republic is doomed to suffer the same fate as Rome.

The Mistake You Make in Every Political Argument

maybe this will help; the cynic in me doubts it though.

[Duchess]

The very first headline I read on that site said - Mass Shootings Aren't Becoming More Common.

[Maggot]

I agree and small discourse on an internet forum is a better beginning than most words coming out a  lifetime politicians mouth. Although looking at other times gone by our little lob balls are smaller than the past. They were much worse at other points. It's just that today it's amplified by the internet. As an individual it's up to us to decipher the "wall of sound" as it is usually so bias that a person has to sit back and blink a zillion times to even digest it.

[Fry Guy]

One of the problems I feel most infuriated by is that the establishment seems to hold an idea that THEY make the news and their ideology is to be believed at all costs. Truth and facts be damned, they will omit, misrepresent and lie. It is about winning not being true or factual. I do not roll that way. Everyone has a bias. Everyone. That is cool but when you have to contort everything to make your narrative fit, then there is something wrong with the narrative.

An example is Donald Trump. 98% of reporting on him is terrible. That DOES NOT represent the support of around 50% of the voting public. It just does not. It CAN NOT be that someone with 10 000 000's of supporters is doing everything wrong.

The ONLY way this reporting makes sense is if it is a bias driven narrative. 60%/40% good/bad or bad/good reporting may make sense. Not 98% and not with those numbers.

A big part of the problem and how this is prolonged is that the "Progressive Left" in conjunction with the Globalist Establishment has seized institutional power in most aspects of culture and society. There is pushback and Trump is part of that. But those following the Progressives are following ideological precepts without critically thinking through them. They have been informed they are more moral and puts them on a better intellectual position than their detractors and so it comes with a position of smugness or righteous indignation and neither position allows for much in the way of critical reasoning or examination. They follow this because they are "better" and morally righteous and know it all. Why would they debase themselves considering other opposing points of view?

It USED to be that the Left were good at coming to the table with any debate and being open to new ideas and tolerant of opposing viewpoints (and yes I do doubt myself as I type this because I was always told this and always followed this on the Left and still do, but maybe "I" was lied to there). There was no DEMAND that discourse be suppressed or the like. Deplatforming was not a thing. Good ideas won out and if you were beaten with your best ideas, it was simply time to examine your ideas and their ideas and see WHY you lost and was it sloppiness on your part in projecting your held belief or was there something to take away from what was said? It is a different mentality nowadays. I have seen the Left drift further and further Left and find myself see the centre right next to me and the moderate Conservatives very close to me on the Right and the Left far away from me.

I see things getting worse and worse. I fear Pappy may be right. The only things I think could help is maybe a Decades long enforced legal blitz against the deplatforming, threats and such people with Conservative opinions get. Include them in the hate crime laws and such. Make it illegal to discriminate and such and break up the big techs. pushback against progressive ideological courses in schooling and the like.

If this can be done and with an iron fist until every bad faith ideologue was crushed, then what would be left is a few harmless whackos and a a bunch of already indoctrinated Leftists needing to be bought back from the ledge.

[sally]

Stop with your shit Fryguy. Over half the population are borderline retarded and impressionable idiots and both parties keep them in check. They talk like they're against each other and put up this big hoopla, but nothing gets approved without both sides approving. Now for me, Trump is way better for my taxes because I'm in that tax bracket that Obama deemed as rich, but Trump gave us "rich people " a break. Like 20 thousand dollar break. But I fully expect to pay that all back some way or other because it's all a fucking sham.

[Fry Guy]

More than a little truth in what you say Sally. But as to your point about being kept in check??
I dunno, Sally, I really don't. I will tell you two reason. With the rise of the Progressives (please say you see this in the Democrat Party) the power of the old style Liberal is waning if in fact they really had ANY power outside of the Democrat Party. The Big tech heads are Progressives and not Liberals (Zuckerberg and Dorsey for example are in the tank for Progressives and Progressive causes and against Conservatives but no more than the heads of Reddit or Google or any of the other Silicon Giants). Nor in media.
If the Democrat Party debates had the Liberals Gabbard and Delaney polling well against Biden and whackos like Warren and Sanders up in the polls. There is plenty of others. Castro, O'Rourke and such
The Democrats are promoting crazy ideologues. The true believers. I suspect Harris, Buttigeig, and Gillibrand are simply saying what people want to hear.
The second thing though is the efforts to consistent deplatform, censor, ban and false report the "wrong voices"

If it was only the non-powered populace , that would be one thing. It is not that

[Maggot]

Electing someone that says they will pay out truth or not will get the unwashed masses to go along with the dream. It happens. I just wish they would leave me alone like this stupid Obamacare didn't, that shit was real. And got real close to pissing me the fuck off.