Johnny S. Clarke & Lisa Straub- young Ohio couple murdered

[NightOwl]

Lady Cop a question will the Jurors' be kept in isolation?


From 13 ABC
"Addressing the more than six dozen prospective jurors on Tuesday in the Williams trial, Judge Dean Mandros issued a ban on information about Pettaway.

"It would be highly improper for you to read, hear, see or learn anything about that case," says Judge Dean Mandros."

[Aberlin]

Aberlin, my hat goes off to you! you've had close to a dozen posts to-day and I've enjoyed them all, some great insights! speculation etc., keep them coming!!

Thank you my friend. Good to see you back on here today

I personally believe Destiny will play a vital role in this case. I think she either knows what happened, participated, or has vital information she was unaware of at first.

There's plenty of violent males out there but now that we have female DNA, I think it would be easier to narrow down the list of suspects (unless Ohio has some wild women). We linked these two guys to the crime scene and I believe for a female to do something with them this vile she either has to be:

1. In a close relationship to one or both suspects (romantic or non-romantic)

OR

2. Someone who they forced to come along because "they owed"

The more I think of it, if you're dealing with someone who's scared and forced to help, that person would already be at a breaking point and would crumble under fierce police interrogation.

Imagine being there because your life might have been in danger thinking you're only going to tie someone up. Then suddenly Lisa dies and then Johnny. Unless this person has no conscience, I would have been the first one at the police station clearing my involvement in the case.

Therefore, I personally believe this person was close to one or both of the subjects.

Did they get DNA samples from Sam's girlfriend at the time, now suddenly wife? Very suspicious that they would be thinking of marriage right after you're the prime suspect of a murder case.

Perhaps the Spousal Privilege Law is the reason here. Under this, a spouse cannot be held in contempt of court for not providing condemning testimony against their spouse. The right to remain silent only applies to accused individuals.

There are different parameters for this law based on what state you're dealing with including if this applies to pre-marriage crimes (on a non-state level, the law is to protect the sanctity of marriage so I don't think it applies to even pre-marriage information).

Maybe you'll find the specifics here (too much reading for a simple answer for me):
http://opd.ohio.gov/RC_Casebook/privilege.htm

I'm not ready to rule out Destiny until I see/hear proof of her innocence. Plenty of Sam and Cameo's friends thought they "couldn't have done it"...but they were involved/did it none the less.

Who else does that leave? Who else is in their lives?

To stir the shit, I'd like to know all the reasons why TW was ruled out. She's even placed at the scene of the crime before anyone else was there and she changed her account of her & Johnny's phone call. Not to mention giving a detailed description of what the inside of the house looked like. When Maytee got there she had to peer down through the cracks of the blinds (being hoisted up by John).

Yes I know... but either something still doesn't mix or she has got to have the shittiest luck I've ever witnessed. I do lean towards the latter but really would like to know how they cleared her

Have all the other women who've been questioned being cleared simply through weak alibis and lie detectors?

Lie detectors are circumventable...

"A 1997 survey of 421 psychologists estimated the test's average validity at about 61%, a little better than chance."

Here's the link to the entire article:
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2002...-lie_x.htm

Someone is being overlooked and/or is a gifted deceiver. UNNNNNNLESS, she is the girlfriend of the true mastermind behind the crime (spooky music plays here) who also has just the right amount of distance from the two suspects to not be listed in the same "network".

Fun moment: Perhaps they drove around looking for retarded people to set up and there on the corner selling drugs and pootang was good ol Cameo.

[Lady Cop]

Lady Cop a question will the Jurors' be kept in isolation?

i don't think either jury is sequestered, someone please correct me if i'm wrong.

but they do take an oath and can throw a trial into chaos/mistrial if they violate the rules/oath set by the judge. they can even be prosecuted in some circumstances.

[shitstorm]

To stir the shit, I'd like to know all the reasons why TW was ruled out. She's even placed at the scene of the crime before anyone else was there and she changed her account of her & Johnny's phone call. Not to mention giving a detailed description of what the inside of the house looked like. When Maytee got there she had to peer down through the cracks of the blinds (being hoisted up by John).

Considering Tiffany was at the house that night, I'm pretty sure she was thoroughly checked out. I wasn't aware of her ever changing her story. In what way do you think she changed it? It was Maytee's cousin who big John lifted to peer into the window.


If there is unidentified DNA, wouldn't the cops request DNA samples from everyone we've heard of during this past year and a half?

[Adub]

I noticed in something I read, that a Cousino was a detective or LEO? Involved in the investigation somehow? That name rings a bell.

[justme]

Lady Cop a question will the Jurors' be kept in isolation?

i don't think either jury is sequestered, someone please correct me if i'm wrong.

but they do take an oath and can throw a trial into chaos/mistrial if they violate the rules/oath set by the judge. they can even be prosecuted in some circumstances.

I know the Pettaway jury is not sequestered

[imsuchawildflower]

Did anyone else notice in the prosecution's opening statements the comment of Johnny promising to call his friend back after he "verbally confronted" someone?

I know Tiffany said over and over she heard the confrontation then a struggle in the background just before the phone went dead.

There's not much difference in the accounts but the "I'll call you back" insinuation by the prosecution makes me wonder if Tiffany just added the struggle part in her testimony after seeing there was a struggle.

Doesn't make much difference but it stands out to me.

The struggle would make sense in prior theories that Lisa had gone upstairs to change and Johnny was downstairs alone...she heard the fighting, and locked herself in her bedroom, hence the door being kicked
in because it was locked.

[Aberlin]

The struggle would make sense in prior theories that Lisa had gone upstairs to change and Johnny was downstairs alone...she heard the fighting, and locked herself in her bedroom, hence the door being kicked
in because it was locked.

Definitely. Not doubting the struggles, just pointing out she changed her testimony. The new version is watered down so to speak and because she didn't hear the struggle in this new account of hers, the people he confronted might not even have been the offenders or there could have been a completely different unfolding of events which would have possibly explained more. Just saying it for saying it's sake; probably was them but now we don't know if it was an immediate ambush, an argument, etc.

[Aberlin]

If there is unidentified DNA, wouldn't the cops request DNA samples from everyone we've heard of during this past year and a half?

There have been numerous cases were police only requested DNA samples from persons of interest and not people they simply questioned.

Plus part of the evidence has to be destroyed in order to compare DNA so why risk destroying all the evidence running random DNA tests? Unless there's a new non-destructive way for testing DNA now. If you look at the court documents, the prosecution pointed out when asking permission to DNA test the cig butt, that part of the evidence would have to be destroyed. This tells me that none of the cig butt was destroyed up until they made Sam, hence no DNA testing till that point.

I have heard that after the testing they can "save" the data so to speak but again, based on the prosecution's request to destroy evidence for DNA testing seems to weigh heavy on the fact that no prior DNA testing had been performed.

They might have swabbed everyone in this case but I personally doubt it...too much police work when you're looking for stories that don't add up. Even if they did, I doubt they ran tests on all the collected DNA of (correct me if I'm wrong) for over 200 people. As the court dockets state, DNA testing needs to be sent to specialists and its expensive.

I would love to know if they DID swab everyone though...if they did all they have to do is a run with the saved dna structures from the cig butt or the tape (once the DNA structure is saved). Again, it seems the strategy is to wait till you have a solid suspect before you do DNA testing because of price and resources (sigh).

Sorry for the redundant sentences.

"Unidentified DNA" more than likely means DNA that doesn't match already established DNA (Sam, Cameo, Johnny, Lisa). Having said that, until we know what all of the "Identified DNA" is, we'll not be able to know for sure what they mean by "Unidentified DNA."

[gurl2323]

Amazing JustMe !!

IMO . sad to say but i think one if not both will walk , OR , Cameo's going to get off , and Williams get the shitty end of the stick !
''Its not what you say in court , its what you can Prove in court''
And thats what the law goes by , thats why there is so many High Profile Murders that get away with the horrible crimes .
IMO i think the Uknown Female and male DNA is Alexandria Cousino , and Aaron Griffin.
being that AG was in prison before , his DNA should be in the system. So i would hope that they would have tested it. Alex was a key part in the ''Bad car deal'' she is the one who ''purchased'' it from johnny
Alex and AP are bad on drugs owe cameo and sam money , take them to the straubs try to rob them , where johnny was suprised to see aaron , gets into argument with him while sam and cameo are just smoking away in the garage , panicing trying to find anything to shut them up , and spot the BBB bags.

thats just IMO , and i also believe that aaron griffin is one of the confidential formants going against pettaway and williams , and just trying to place the blame on them . Kind of a he said , she said.
I believe TW was looking out for her BF , and when she had call johnny to make sure he was there , i believe she went back and cleaned up a little evidence that she could . and thats why i think there was no forced enty , was no drugs , was no footprints are any type of markings in the snow , i believe TW knew her bf did this and paniced as well , after all its DE JA VU for her .

I cant wait to hear THE REAL STORY !!! please keep me informed !

[gurl2323]

latest post from Maytee

I LOVE YOU I MISS YOU I WILL FIGHT FOR YOU TILL I TAKE MY LAST BREATH AND THATS MY PROMISE TO YOU AND NO ONE WILL EVER GET AWAY WITH HURTING YOU THE WAY THEY DID I PROMISE!!!!!!!!


also an hour ago, she posted a poem

A Life Of Hell

A life of hell have I wrought
With grief so strong that leaves you distraught
The pain and suffering we endure
That leaves you baffled and so unsure
What was it that caused this fate
Why did it happen on that date
Questions unanswered no words to find
Leaves room full of doubt in your mind
No one to warn us even though they knew they plotted against you and carried it through
The mark it left would change my destiny our lifes forever
How do you cope with what you do not know,i relive this catastrophe night and day it plays in my mind like it happened today
People can be cruel they want you to let go
They have no meaning of the loss we share
To forget them and move on meant we didn't care
To me I'd rather live in this hell
Those that I thought I knew so well
It is those who have failed me in my time of need
Their life is empty and still full of greed
They have no compassion or understanding of life
I would gladly give them all of my strife
But this I have learned in my life of hell
This is my cross and I wear it well
and this i do know the pain they caused you my beloved son johnny will reflect on all their faces their mothers faces and all their kids too no evil deeds go unseen everything done in the dark will be brought out into light MY PROMISE TO YOU

[Older Than Dirt]

Both sides lay out cases in Pettaway murder trial
BY JENNIFER FEEHAN
BLADE STAFF WRITER
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Cameo Pettaway is charged along with another man in two slayings in Springfield Township. THE BLADE/ANDY MORRISON Enlarge | Photo Reprints
Photos of the bodies of Lisa Straub and Johnny Clarke on their backs inside her parents' Springfield Township home make it look almost as if the young couple died peacefully. Nothing is further from the truth, Tim Braun, an assistant Lucas County Prosecutor, told jurors hearing the case against Cameo Pettaway on Wednesday.

"They didn't die peacefully. They died struggling, gasping for air inside a plastic bag, choked by duct tape tightly wrapped around their necks," Mr. Braun said during opening statements in Lucas County Common Pleas Court.

Autopsies showed that Ms. Straub, 20, and her boyfriend, 21, had bruising to their knees, elbows, hips, and chins, indicating there was indeed a struggle the night they died, Jan. 31, 2011.

Mr. Braun said other evidence indicates Clarke's killers held him down, and he probably died first because the black duct tape that bound Ms. Straub had cardboard from the end of the roll attached to it.

The prosecution laid out its case for the first time Wednesday as the trial of Mr. Pettaway, 23, of 133 Essex St. got under way before Judge James Bates. Mr. Braun said both Clarke and Ms. Straub had been abusing the prescription painkiller Percocet, and on the night they were killed, they had planned to have friends over and try to buy some illegal drugs. Ms. Straub's parents were on a cruise, celebrating their 25^th wedding anniversary, and had left Ms. Straub and her boyfriend at their home while they were gone.

Mr. Braun said it was months after the deaths that investigators first connected Mr. Pettaway and co-defendant Samuel Williams to the crime scene. The butt of a Newport cigarette found near the door leading from the house to the garage was analyzed at a laboratory, revealing the DNA of both defendants, Mr. Braun said.

"The first time the names of Samuel Williams and Cameo Pettaway came up in this investigation was through the genetic analysis of that cigarette butt," Mr. Braun said. "It didn't come up by reconstructing the lives of Lisa Straub and Johnny Clarke."

Although both men were indicted on two counts of aggravated murder, two counts of kidnapping, and one count of aggravated burglary, defense attorney Mark Geudtner told the jury the cigarette butt is the only evidence linking Mr. Pettaway to the crime.

"There's none of Cameo Pettaway's DNA found anywhere else at the crime scene -- not on the bags, not on the duct tape, not on any of the other physical items that were found in the crime scene area," he said. "What the prosecution cannot prove is that Cameo Pettaway's DNA got on that cigarette butt in connection with the commission of these homicides, and that's their burden of proof beyond a reasonable doubt."

Mr. Geudtner told the jury that Mr. Pettaway and Mr. Williams are friends from childhood, that they both smoke Newports, that perhaps Mr. Pettaway gave Mr. Williams a cigarette and perhaps Mr. Williams went to the Straub home to buy marijuana from Clarke. He said Mr. Pettaway maintains he was never at that house.

Both Mr. Braun and Mr. Geudtner said that the DNA of others -- unknown persons -- was found on the duct tape used to bind the victims' hands and Clarke's ankles. Mr. Braun told the jury that prosecutors believe others were involved in the killings.

"A lot of this case is dependent on the circumstantial evidence because the circumstantial evidence demonstrates exactly what was done in that house to Lisa Straub and Johnny Clarke," Mr. Braun told the jury. " … The other issue becomes who was involved, and that's a little harder. And I can tell you right now, it's the belief of the state of Ohio there were other people [who] were involved, not just Cameo Pettaway, not just Samuel Williams."

Mr. Geudtner suggested Lucas County sheriff's investigators failed to follow up leads on those suspects once Mr. Pettaway and Mr. Williams were arrested and that they "manipulated and corrupted" the crime scene.

"The evidence will show that there are a number of other suspects other than Cameo Pettaway who had motives that are actually more likely than Cameo to have been involved in these homicides," Mr. Geudtner said. " … You may be disappointed to learn that at this point actually nobody knows for sure who killed Johnny and Lisa."

Judge Bates sent the jury home after opening statements and advised them to return to court at 9 a.m. Monday for the first witnesses. Those witnesses also will be called to testify in Mr. Williams' trial, which will be happening simultaneously in the courtroom of Judge Dean Mandros.

[Older Than Dirt]

The above post is a newer version of the one earlier. I just do not understand the last sentence! Makes no sense to me. And, it didn't earlier either!

[gurl2323]

right , why waste all of this time to build up defense , and you cant even say that these are the 2 people who murdered lisa and johnny . Doesnt make sense to me , they were having people over , so that tells us that there were parties at that house , could just take me back to they were there for a party and a ciggerette butt was left there , whos telling what day that ciggerette butt came from

[Aberlin]

Mr. Braun said other evidence indicates Clarke's killers held him down, and he probably died first because the black duct tape that bound Ms. Straub had cardboard from the end of the roll attached to it.

Wow!! I can't help but wonder if that is a typo but I seriously doubt it.

Why kill Johnny first? Unless Lisa's family's supposed "safe" was really the true motive the entire time. Killing Johnny to make Lisa talk, but there was more evidence of Lisa dying first.

Perhaps we're dealing with two rolls of tape (or more). Makes sense to me. If I was going to tie someone up I wouldn't bring one rope but two; if I were to tape up someone I'd want to be sure I had enough.

Damn it!! Why can't this case just stay in one direction???

[NightOwl]

IMO i think the Uknown Female and male DNA is Alexandria Cousino , and Aaron Griffin.

Great post! I thought Alexandria Cousino and her bad boyfriend Thomas Nutter. Could be the other 2 goons are taking a newport break in the garage. IMO

[shitstorm]

Man, this evidence against W & P is very damn slim. Add to that, prosecutors saying someone else was there. This does not look good.

Whose prints and DNA are on Johnny's wallet?! I sure as hell hope the state has been doing everything possible to run down the unknown DNA.

[Aberlin]

Man, this evidence against W & P is very damn slim. Add to that, prosecutors saying someone else was there. This does not look good.

I agree :(

From the Toledo Blade article:
"Mr. Geudtner told the jury that Mr. Pettaway and Mr. Williams are friends from childhood, that they both smoke Newports, that perhaps Mr. Pettaway gave Mr. Williams a cigarette and perhaps Mr. Williams went to the Straub home to buy marijuana from Clarke. He said Mr. Pettaway maintains he was never at that house."

This statement alone could very well get Pettaway off unless there is strong witness statements (not actual crime witnesses, but people who might have overheard them saying something on the street).

However, I've never heard of someone taking 10+ minutes to smoke one cig. That fact alone might refute my above statement

The whole jumping the gun on the metal retardation campaign makes me call bullshit on Pettaway saying he was never at the house. Why would you already start projecting on your sentence if you knew you weren't there and thus there couldn't be anything more than the butt as evidence?

On a positive note, its nice to hear that Cameo is allowing his lawyer to put speculative blame on Sam. Hopefully this will go back and forth till one of them snaps and tells the whole story.

Personally, I know I'll be hated for this, I don't think we're going to ever know the truth on this one. Please someone prove me wrong!!

[shitstorm]

In that entire crime scene, they don't have ANYTHING - fingerprints, DNA - from W & P inside the house or on the bodies?! Just one cig butt in the garage. I think Tiff and friends will testify that W & P were NOT at the party the night before, so the butt may place them there the night of the murders, but it's not enough to convict on these charges, imo.

[Aberlin]

In that entire crime scene, they don't have ANYTHING - fingerprints, DNA - from W & P inside the house or on the bodies?! Just one cig butt in the garage. I think Tiff and friends will testify that W & P were NOT at the party the night before, so the butt may place them there the night of the murders, but it's not enough to convict on these charges, imo.

If I were a low life I would have said "yep I was there. I sold them drugs in the garage then went home. I noticed another car pulling up when we were leaving that had some girl in it."

Drug sentence is much better than life in prison...

I was also under the impression that Aaron Griffin was testifying FOR the defendants and not against them. Did I read that wrong?

We're so close!! We have DNA on the tape...the TAPE!! But there are murders all the time and from a budget perspective, its just another case. If money wasn't an issue I think all DNA would have been tested against everyone questioned.