2012 ELECTION

[username]

It's an interesting question but Wolf should have used a different example. Substitute early stage pancreatic cancer or something.

[Cracker]

If you didn't buy yourself some health insurance, spent that money on booze and broads, and you end up in a coma, TOUGH SHIT! Bad decision.

If you are old as shit and let your son take out a mortgage on your house to buy a new car and he doesn't pay the mortgage, TOUGH SHIT! Bad decision.

WTF, people? Take care of your own damn self. Why should I pay insurance and you don't? WTF?

[HairOfTheDog]

On Sunday, former President Bill Clinton laughed off former Vice President Dick Cheney's suggestion that Hillary Clinton should challenge President Barack Obama in 2012.

"Well, you know, I'm very proud of her, so I'm always gratified whenever anyone says anything nice about her. And I very much agree that she's done a good job," Clinton told Bob Schieffer on CBS's "Face the Nation."

And I think he, by saying something nice about her in the way that he did, knew that it might cause a little trouble," Clinton continued. "I don't want to help him succeed in his political strategy. But I admire that he's still out there hitting the ball."

"Hillary Clinton is a pretty formidable individual," Cheney told ABC's Jonathan Karl earlier this month. "I think she’s probably the most competent person they’ve got in their cabinet. And, frankly, I thought she was gonna win the nomination last time around."

"Maybe if the Obama record is bad enough -- and these days it's not very good, given the shape of the economy -- maybe there will be enough ferment in the Democratic Party so that there will be a primary on their side," he continued. A Democratic primary "might even help the Republicans a little bit," Cheney told Karl.

Snipped from:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/18...68532.html

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Dick Cheney: :stir_shit: Bill has his number.

[Duchess]

Bill

[Maggot]

I would vote for Hillary, she would win. I just know it. Not that I like her much but she would probably be the best choice today. I will stick with Ron Paul until then. but its early still.

[HairOfTheDog]

Did a little research. The only time a cabinet member has challenged the incumbent President was back in 1940. John Nance Garner had been Vice President under Franklin Roosevelt for 2 terms and disagreed with some of Roosevelt's later policies. Roosevelt unexpectedly decided to run for a 3^rd term after Garner announced his candidacy. Roosevelt slaughtered Garner, who resigned as VP in 1941. Garner once described the Vice-Presidency as being "not worth a bucket of warm piss."

Hillary will wait until 2016 to run. But, it would sure shake things up if she threw her hat in the ring for 2012.

[Duchess]

I think I have a problem with people not running for the sake of etiquette.

[username]

I think I have a problem with people not running for the sake of etiquette.

I don't think its etiquette. Basically you're saying I took a job from this guy and worked for him for 3 years but I was an idiot because he's really a dumb-tard (and oops, I didn't see that going in) and now you should vote for ME!

She'd have to rip up the guy that she agreed to work for and whose foreign policies she's supposedly been following for the last 3 years...that would be difficult. I think she'll run in 2016.

[username]

If you didn't buy yourself some health insurance, spent that money on booze and broads, and you end up in a coma, TOUGH SHIT! Bad decision.

If you are old as shit and let your son take out a mortgage on your house to buy a new car and he doesn't pay the mortgage, TOUGH SHIT! Bad decision.

WTF, people? Take care of your own damn self. Why should I pay insurance and you don't? WTF?

Middle-aged guy, lost his job (and home) in the recession (paid in to the "system" for years prior to that), hasn't been able to find employment, couldn't pay the insurance premiums, diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. What then?

A child who is sick and his/her parents haven't had health insurance for years. What then?

And who decides who is "worthy" of health care?

[Cracker]

If you didn't buy yourself some health insurance, spent that money on booze and broads, and you end up in a coma, TOUGH SHIT! Bad decision.

If you are old as shit and let your son take out a mortgage on your house to buy a new car and he doesn't pay the mortgage, TOUGH SHIT! Bad decision.

WTF, people? Take care of your own damn self. Why should I pay insurance and you don't? WTF?

Middle-aged guy, lost his job (and home) in the recession (paid in to the "system" for years prior to that), hasn't been able to find employment, couldn't pay the insurance premiums, diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. What then?

A child who is sick and his/her parents haven't had health insurance for years. What then?

And who decides who is "worthy" of health care?

Everybody has a hard luck story, user. I find it hard to believe decent people cannot find ANY employment for years and years. They may have to take a job they don't want or don't like, but I have had to do that very same thing.

If you are a parent, you should have healthcare. Poor people can buy PeachCare in GA for pennies on the dollar of what I have to pay each month. When I didn't have insurance, I paid cash.

You are telling the wrong person. I have been broke and a single parent and have had hard times. I never ONCE used aid, I worked shitty jobs I didn't like instead. It sucked. I sucked it up and did it anyway.

Hospitals and charities and funds are set up for people who are really in need. Doctors and dentists reduce the amount you have to pay if you are paying out of pocket.

Why should I have to pay when I have my own family? Because I work? That is fucking bullshit.

I had to add this: I have paid for several (four I can think of off the top of my head) doctor visits/meds and dental procedures for my extended family members in the last six months. Why can't other people take care of their families and help each other out? That is how it is supposed to be, not people expecting me to pay for mine AND every other fool's that doesn't take care of their adult responsibilities. Fuck entitlement. If you make yourself a charity case, get money from charity. I am not a charity. If I were, I wouldn't be paying all these fucking taxes.

[IMaDick]

The true problem is that people who have no standing in this country will get the same healthcare I will after paying into this shit for my whole life, in fact they might get better care because I'm old and have paid in my whole life, cost -V- benefit.

Fuck that, you want to see old people go off and start fucking people up, treat them like that and that's what will happen, prison is free health care as well as food, bed and shower.

[username]

If you are a parent, you should have healthcare. Poor people can buy PeachCare in GA for pennies on the dollar of what I have to pay each month. When I didn't have insurance, I paid cash.

Do you think that's a good thing (that there's cheap healthcare in GA)?

Back to the question, if you're a kid (and your parents don't have health insurance) should you get the same treatment as other kids? Or should kids who have no health insurance get lesser treatment than the kids of parents that do have health insurance?

[Cracker]

If you are a parent, you should have healthcare. Poor people can buy PeachCare in GA for pennies on the dollar of what I have to pay each month. When I didn't have insurance, I paid cash.

Do you think that's a good thing (that there's cheap healthcare in GA)?

Back to the question, if you're a kid (and your parents don't have health insurance) should you get the same treatment as other kids? Or should kids who have no health insurance get lesser treatment than the kids of parents that do have health insurance?

The kids should get the healthcare, the parents should owe the bill. That is fair.

I don't mind PeachCare or Medicare or whatever old folks have. I DO very much mind paying for illegals. That shouldn't happen.

I would rather see us fund more clinics. Don't poor folks go to clinics? That wouldn't bother me, either. I get super pissed when I have a medical emergency and the emergency room is filled with people wanting their regular medical care because they can't be bothered to go to the doctor during the day (they were probably asleep all day or didn't want to miss their stories).

Nobody should have to pay for your anything unless you are retired. Pay for your own shit. That's a good life rule.

[Cracker]

Why can't Herman Cain be president? I like that dude. http://www.hermancain.com/images/economicgrowth.pdf

9% tax across the board, no payroll taxes. What could be more fair?

Maybe Vice President? He's good with money. Not sure if he's good with the military, both are important now.

[Duchess]

9% tax? He da man! Is he the black dude? I'll kiss his black ass in the middle of I-95 if he gives us 9% tax. Fuckin' aye.

[Duchess]

I didn't see the entire debate so I'm only going to comment on what I did see & what has stuck in my mind.

Rick Perry suggests that we help illegals get educated, he thinks they deserve a discount on tuition which after four years comes to eighty eight thousand dollars or more. My parents spent tens of thousands of dollars educating me & my brothers, a couple of my brothers got partial sports scholarships because they bought some talent to the school but other than that the funds came directly from our parents. What the fuck part of ILLEGAL are people not getting. Unfortunately, that comment alone has turned me off him completely. Fuck him. He had the amazing audacity to say that people who don't agree with him & his suggestion are heartless.

[HairOfTheDog]

I didn't see the entire debate so I'm only going to comment on what I did see & what has stuck in my mind.

Rick Perry suggests that we help illegals get educated, he thinks they deserve a discount on tuition which after four years comes to eighty eight thousand dollars or more. My parents spent tens of thousands of dollars educating me & my brothers, a couple of my brothers got partial sports scholarships because they bought some talent to the school but other than that the funds came directly from our parents. What the fuck part of ILLEGAL are people not getting. Unfortunately, that comment alone has turned me off him completely. Fuck him. He had the amazing audacity to say that people who don't agree with him & his suggestion are heartless.

Perry's stance on illegal immigration bothers me too. He says we can't really talk about the issue until fences and border patrol are erected around the borders (other candidates also seem to want to avoid the issue of illegals that are already here as well). Perry's record indicates that he has always supported the fences and increased border control. But, at the same time, some of his policies as Governor of Texas appear to offer illegals enticements. He is inconsistent on this key issue, imo.


Perry’s first immigration-related move as governor was likely his most controversial: In 2001, Texas became the first state in the nation to grant in-state college tuition rates and financial aid to immigrant children, regardless of their legal status. In 2009, roughly 1 percent of Texas college students — about 12,000 students — benefited from the law.

Two years later, Perry joined forces with Vicente Fox, then the president of Mexico, to advocate for reforms to guest worker laws. Faced with immigration questions from Lou Dobbs on CNN in 2003, Perry said Texas had a “close, complex” relationship with Mexico, and that businesses relied on immigrants for affordable labor. To that end, Perry has split with the platform of the Texas Republican Party, asserting that an Arizona-style immigration enforcement law — in which authorities are required to question people about their legal status — is not a good fit for Texas.

snipped from:
http://www.texastribune.org/texas-people...publicans/

[Duchess]

I cannot get past what "illegal" means, I just can't...because of people like Rick Perry who believe these people have rights is why many of them are not frightened of the law, hell, they bring lawsuits against Americans, they have no problem even entering a court of law & dealing with officers of the court. Bah.

[HairOfTheDog]

Why can't Herman Cain be president? I like that dude. http://www.hermancain.com/images/economicgrowth.pdf

9% tax across the board, no payroll taxes. What could be more fair?

Maybe Vice President? He's good with money. Not sure if he's good with the military, both are important now.

I like that Cain has very good high-level business experience. He is good with money, no doubt. I watched him being interviewed quickly behind stage after the big debate 3 weeks back and was a little surprised at this demeanor off stage (I thought he did well in the debate). He was really defensive and seemed angry, imo. When questioned about the 9 9 9 tax system, he said maybe 8 8 8 for poorer states, or something to that effect. It was an informal interview and disorganized. Still, not sure why he felt the need to waffle when an even tax for business, individuals, and sales across the country is the foundation of his proposal.

He was also criticized for his stance on Social Security - he wants it to be "personalized". I like the idea myself. But, he originally proposed that it be "privatized according to the Chilean model". He got hit hard because of some of the humanitarian issues in Chile. That seemed unfair to me. He wasn't suggesteing the US adopt Chilean governmental or humanitarian policy. He simply cited that Chile privatized their equivalent of the social security program and he considers it a success, a model. But, since the harsh criticism by those who also don't like privatization, he now uses "personalized" and corrects anyone who says he wants to "privatize" the program.

Some other points that may make him unelectable:

1. He has never held a public office. He was defeated the one time he ran for Senate.

2. Controversial statements. He is quoted as referring to himself as a "real black man" in comparison to Obama because he grew up in segretated Georgia and experienced volatile racism. Shades of Clarence Thomas, according to critics. He also said that he would not appoint a Muslim as a judge, backtracked, then basically repeated the sentiment. He opposed a mosque near the 911 site.

3. Cain is against abortion even in cases of incest and rape.

These are some of the common points against him from my readings - not that I agree with all of them. I wouldn't mind seeing him in a Cabinet position.

[IMaDick]

The illegals will put obama back in the whitehouse if they are not fragmented.

Perry knows that, He is pandering.