ELECTION 2020

[HairOfTheDog]

OK now I get it............Bernie wants to raise taxes.  Who knew? Thanks. 

Wouldn't a 20% flat tax do the same thing? 

No -- you obviously don't get it.  You missed the main crux/objective of the tax proposals,  my wormy friend.  

As I explained, Bernie proposes to raise taxes on extreme wealth to pay for his plans. 

Bernie's plans are designed to redistribute some of the extreme wealth gained by policies which enabled the extremely wealthy to greatly expand their fortunes over the last four decades (via tax breaks and massive deductions, high inheritance exemptions, unregulated risky Wall Street speculative trades on the backs of investors....) to the middle and lower income households who've not been given those breaks and whose collective wealth has declined over the same period.

Moving to a flat tax of 20% for everyone on everything (with no special breaks for anyone) would be more fair than the current system, in my opinion........though I don't know if it would increase or decrease government revenue. 

However, moving to a flat tax would not accomplish Bernie Sander's 'redistribution' goal.  It would slowly reduce the income inequality gap over time, but would not effect the base income inequality that already exists. 

And, it would likely take a very long time to generate the funds needed to implement universal health care (which is estimated to save the country money after implementation), tuition-free college, aggressive environmental policies and retraining workers for green industries, etc...  The time for change is now, not way off into the future, according to Bernie Sanders and his supporters (and climate scientists).

[Maggot]

Well that's wonderful! My SS taxes wont go up and my medicare medicaid taxes wont go up either! Go Bernie Go!

[HairOfTheDog]

Well that's wonderful! My SS taxes wont go up and my medicare medicaid taxes wont go up either! Go Bernie Go!

And............if Bernie really gets going, you won't have to pay health insurance premiums anymore either!

[Maggot]

wOw that's great! now I can keep all my paycheck! Maybe the government can take over the auto company's and make an electric car that everyone could use.

[Duchess]

Well that's wonderful! My SS taxes wont go up and my medicare medicaid taxes wont go up either! Go Bernie Go!

If trump has his way you won't need to worry about something you don't have. Bernie isn't the one you should be concerned with, look to the guy you support.

[HairOfTheDog]

wOw that's great! now I can keep all my paycheck! Maybe the government can take over the auto company's and make an electric car that everyone could use.

Yeah, and he could put on a Santa Claus suit and gift everyone in American with an environmentally-friendly car too! 

It sounds like a dream (delusion)..........but, I could see it turning into a nightmare for you, given your pressing political concerns Mags.

Just imagine...

-- Those sneaky 'Lib' operatives wouldn't have to lure blacks to ride the bus to the polls with a free boxed lunch -- they could drive their own selves!

-- More free-loading young 'violent lefties and dems' could drag their asses out of bed late and still make it to the polls on time if they had wheels too!

-- And, those millions of 'illegals' and 'dead people' who the Dems have gotten to vote without detection could expand into BILLIONS!

  I can get behind a government system which aims to:  make health care and necessary prescription drugs available to all, ensure that all young Americans have access to quality public education, promote a more fair economic outcome for people in the lower and middle income brackets, protect clean water and inhabitable land for young people and future generations, etc...   

You don't have to get behind those goals and/or support Bernie Sanders' plans to make them happen, of course.  No one's trying to convince you that you should.  We're just discussing what's been put on the table in terms of the 2020 election.

[cannongal]

wOw that's great! now I can keep all my paycheck! Maybe the government can take over the auto company's and make an electric car that everyone could use.

  I can get behind aiming for a government system which aims to:  make health care and necessary prescription drugs available to all, ensure that all young Americans have access to quality public education, promote a more fair economic outcome for people in the lower and middle income brackets, protect clean water and inhabitable land for young people and future generations, etc...   

You don't have to get behind those goals and/or support Bernie Sanders' plans to make them happen, of course.  No one's trying to convince you that you should.  We're just discussing what's been put on the table in terms of the 2020 election.

Yeah, but at what cost?

Bernie's health care for all plan concerns me greatly.  Some people have compared and likened it to Canada's universal health care.   Did you hear about the dude in Winnipeg that waited in the ER 6 days for surgery?  (Story here:  https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/winnipeg-man...-1.4742630 ) .  Friends in Canada tell me this is the norm, not the exception.   Spending 6 days in the ER with a broken arm, while being dosed with pain killers isn't my idea of a good time.  :(

[Maggot]

I hope and pray that Bernie can take on those pirate university systems that put education out of reach for our young people. They are charging way to much for the programs that get them jobs like geology, zoology and law.

[Rootilda]

I don't see how Bernie has a chance in hell of implementing any of his dreams while Moscow Mitch is still in office.

[Rootilda]

I hope and pray that Bernie can take on those pirate university systems that put education out of reach for our young people. They are charging way to much for the programs that get them jobs like geology, zoology and law.

I wish trade schools got more attention, that's a much more feasible way to learn a skill that will actually provide a decent pay check. But considering how unions are now being portrayed as communist or some shit, I'm not surprised.

[Duchess]

I don't think he does even if Moscow Mitch isn't there, but really, what the hell do I know.

[Rootilda]

Yeah, Bernie doesn't have a great record of actually getting anything done.

Anyway, have you seen the video of all the people streaming out of the cricket arena in India while Trump blabbers on? As someone on twitter so succinctly explained: "Again, the big turnout was for the grand opening of their cricket stadium. This was planned months & months in advance. If you really believe that all those ppls showed up for the orange dummy than I have a bridge to sell you."

[Maggot]

I hope and pray that Bernie can take on those pirate university systems that put education out of reach for our young people. They are charging way to much for the programs that get them jobs like geology, zoology and law.

I wish trade schools got more attention, that's a much more feasible way to learn a skill that will actually provide a decent pay check.  But considering how unions are now being portrayed as communist or some shit, I'm not surprised.

My son is going to Trade school not next year but the year after. One year freshman and the next 3 in trade. He wants to be an electrical engineer. I was amazed when he came back from his field trip and said that. He is in 8^th grade now and if he does finish high school in the trade school I told him I would put him 2 years into a bachelors degree in architectural design. Time will tell though and I already got him a job in the summer to dabble in HVAC electrical trouble shooting. 
I'm not getting my hopes up though. These things can change. But no government tuition loans would be used and he would have a clean slate and a job once finished. Possibly making 80,000.00 to start taking care of his old man.

Trade schools are truly the way to go today.

[Maggot]

Bernie has a good message with some good dreams but I don't think America is ready for them. But I wish him the best. This is his last chance.

His persona is wild. He reminds me of an old hippie with love, love love but with no way to make it really work.

[BigMark]

enter the sandman

[HairOfTheDog]

I hope and pray that Bernie can take on those pirate university systems that put education out of reach for our young people. They are charging way to much for the programs that get them jobs like geology, zoology and law.

I wish trade schools got more attention, that's a much more feasible way to learn a skill that will actually provide a decent pay check.  But considering how unions are now being portrayed as communist or some shit, I'm not surprised.

Yeah, trade schools are great opportunities for people looking to hone specific job or industry skills; they are an area of focus for Sanders and included in the tuition-free public education plan being proposed.  

I have mixed feelings and experiences when it comes to unions, but Sanders is 100% behind them and supported by most of the major ones.  

If he's elected, labor unions would very likely regain prominence in U.S industries.  I think the same would probably be true if Elizabeth Warren were elected.

    

[HairOfTheDog]

cannongal wrote:

Bernie's health care for all plan concerns me greatly.  Some people have compared and likened it to Canada's universal health care.   Did you hear about the dude in Winnipeg that waited in the ER 6 days for surgery?  (Story here:  https://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/winnipeg-man...-1.4742630 ) .  Friends in Canada tell me this is the norm, not the exception.   Spending 6 days in the ER with a broken arm, while being dosed with pain killers isn't my idea of a good time.  :(

Yes, I've read and heard those same horror stories about the Canadian and European public health systems for years now; whenever the topic of universal health care in the U.S. is broached.

I've also read and heard very positive reviews and experiences from Canadians and Europeans.

Likewise, I've read and heard both positive and negative reviews/experiences of the U.S. private health system by U.S. citizens for a very long time.

In any case, to me, it would be better for all Americans to have full health care coverage to bitch (or sing) about than it is to have so many millions of Americans who are uninsured or under-insured.

If Bernie Sanders or another candidate is elected and committed to doing everything he or she can to make universal health care a reality in the U.S., I consider that a good thing.

If it's feasible to provide both a public and a private option (for those who want to pay for it), even better.

P.s.  I believe that being laid up with a broken arm for days would be a bummer for you...........not so sure when it comes to the 6 days of pain killers though.  ')

[cannongal]

If it's feasible to provide both a public and a private option (for those who want to pay for it), even better.

P.s.  I believe that being laid up with a broken arm for days would be a bummer for you...........not so sure when it comes to the 6 days of pain killers though.  ')

I think 'Bama tried to do something like that with his affordable care act.  Turns out, it wasn't very affordable at all.  My Step son in law is one of the millions of Americans that are uninsured today.  The reason he's uninsured, is because as soon as the insurance penalty was dropped from yearly taxes, he canceled his insurance.  If he's sick, he just goes to the ER and then never pays the bill.   Of course, he's the type of guy that'll spend 50 bucks on Chinese food one night, and go to the food pantry the next.  At least the grandbrats are on medicaid.

and I believe that being laid up with a broken arm would be a bummer for anyone,  unless you're a masochist.  I'm not a big fan of pain killers, I was on oxycodone or some shit for 9 months after a car accident.  I didn't like the side effects.  I'll stick with weed, thanks.

[HairOfTheDog]

There are different views and different experiences when it comes to health care, like most everything else that matters. And there always will be.

I think Obama’s Affordable Care Act moved the country forward and know it resulted in millions of people having access to full health coverage for the first time. 

That includes a large number of citizens in rural areas who didn’t realize they had ‘Obamacare’ until they were told it was under threat of being taken away.

Citizens and voters across the country made it clear at town halls and in the last mid term elections that even with its flaws, they did not want it taken away when the new Trump administration and Republican lawmakers attempted to repeal it without having anything better with which to replace it (after swearing to do so for years). 

But, there’s still a long ways to go in terms of having every citizen covered and getting the price of prescription drugs to a reasonable level.  I’m open minded to any proposals to get there, including Bernie’s Medicare for All.

And, keep your weed, by all means. I was joking about the pain killers. Hopefully, everyone in every state will have legal access to weed as a medicinal alternative/preference very soon.  It’s long past due, in my opinion.

[Rootilda]

"That includes a large number of citizens in rural areas who didn’t realize they had ‘Obamacare’ until they were told it was under threat of being taken away. "

I remember watching man-on-the-street interviews where people got red in the face angry at the thought of Obamacare and then were horrified at the thought that the Affordable Care Act might be stopped. They had absolutely no idea that the two were one and the same.

We're a nation of idiots.