Amanda Knox

[Cynical Ninja]

I don't trust Knox but I'm not sure she's guilty of murder I think she is definitely holding something back about the fateful night in question.

I saw a clip of her being interviewed recently on American television and she came across as being very insincere and cagey.

[HairOfTheDog]

VERDICT DELIBERATIONS UNDERWAY IN FLORENCE, ITALY


Accused murderers Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito. Murder victim Meredith Kercher, right - RIP.

If convicted, Sollecito, who like Knox spent nearly four years in jail, risks immediate arrest.

An appeals court in Florence deliberated into the evening Thursday in the third murder trial of U.S. student Amanda Knox and her former boyfriend as she waited a continent away with, in her words, "my heart in my throat."

Knox's absence does not formally hurt her case since she was freed by a court and defendants in Italy are not required to appear at their trials. However, presiding judge Alessandro Nencini reacted sternly to her emailed statement about waiting at her mom's house with her heart in her throat, noting that defendants have a right to be heard if they appear in person.

Sollecito, on the other hand, has made frequent court appearances, always in a purple sweater, the color of the local Florentine soccer club. He was in court again Thursday morning, accompanied by his father and other relatives and said he would return for the verdict.

Knox's situation is complicated by her absence. In the case of a guilty verdict, experts have said it is unlikely Italy would seek her extradition until a verdict is finalized, a process that can take a year.

"As I have always said, Amanda was involved," Patrick Diya Lumumba (the black bar owner who she accused of killing Kercher initially and who successful sued Knox for slander) said while the deliberations were under way.

The first trial court found Knox and Sollecito guilty of murder and sexual assault based on DNA evidence, confused alibis and Knox's false accusation against Lumumbal. A Perugia appeals court dismantled the guilty verdict two years later, criticizing the "building blocks" of the conviction, including DNA evidence now deemed unreliable by new experts, and the lack of motive.

Italy's highest court ordered the third trial in a scathing dismissal of the appeals court acquittal, ordering the examination of evidence and testimony it said had been improperly omitted by the Perugia appeals court as well as addressing what it called as lapses in logic.

In the third trial, "Most of all, the court was instructed to evaluate all of the evidence in their complexity," said Vieri Fabiani, one of the lawyers for the Kercher family.

The Florence deliberations will either confirm or overturn the initial guilty verdict "as if the acquittal never happened," Fabiani said.

In Florence, the new prosecutor, Alessandro Crini, redefined the motive, moving away from the drug-fueled erotic game described by his colleagues in Perugia. Crini contended that the outburst of violence was rooted in arguments between roommates Knox and Kercher about cleanliness and was triggered by a toilet left unflushed by Rudy Hermann Guede, the only person now in jail for the murder.

Guede, a small-time drug dealer originally from Ivory Coast who had previous convictions for break-ins, is serving a 16-year sentence for the murder, but courts have said he did not act alone.

The defense teams for Knox and Sollecito are certain to appeal any guilty verdict to Italy's supreme court, which can take a year or more and could, in theory, result in yet another appeals court trial. The prosecutor general, on the other hand, could decide to let an acquittal stand, although most observers don't believe that's likely.

Full story: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/01/30/...e-head-to/

[Cynical Ninja]

Its clear the Italian authorities want to nail the ass of Knox and put her away for a long time.

I suppose the big question is why? Why are the Italians like a fucking dog with a bone with this case?

[Duchess]

They are a laughing stock with this bs. I see attorneys here on the morning news questioning their judgement.

[heartbreaker6713]

She was found guilty... Again

[Cynical Ninja]

I think she might be holding back something about the case and trying to accuse Lumumba was a mistake but....I don't think she's guilty of murder.

Once you're aquitted that should be it really.

[heartbreaker6713]

http://www.king5.com story is developing I am sure. The guy also found guilty previously was also found guilty was suppose to be appearing today. I haven't seen any word of if he did. And if he did, did they take him into custody. The victims family was in court and could see them with smiles on their faces so it was easy to see a guilty verdict was what had come down prior to being told when the cameras were showing live picture.

[Duchess]

She was found guilty... Again

Are you kidding! I know you're not. She was right not to go over there for this trial. I saw a little bit this morning as I was getting ready to leave, they were talking about the knife and how there was no DNA on it. Did they have any evidence at all that tied Amanda to the murder? I ask because I was under the impression they really didn't and what they thought they might have was contaminated.

[heartbreaker6713]

I read somewhere that they won't ask for extradition until the verdict is final which could be a year from now. I believe Knox can appeal this as well or something like that.

[heartbreaker6713]

She was found guilty... Again

Are you kidding! I know you're not. She was right not to go over there for this trial. I saw a little bit this morning as I was getting ready to leave, they were talking about the knife and how there was no DNA on it. Did they have any evidence at all that tied Amanda to the murder? I ask because I was under the impression they really didn't and what they thought they might have was contaminated.

I honestly am not sure. I am probably am in the minority to think that don't feel she did it. I am not saying she may have known more about the night whether it be from finding out more or running into things from the events of her evening. It'll be interesting to see how this plays and how this affects us and Italy politics.

I can say I am one of those people who does not act appropriately when things go wrong. I laugh and makes jokes when I'm nervous and I laugh when things go wrong. I have the horrible knack of laughing if someone falls awkwardly and wanting to makes sure they are okay but I can't stop laughing. I am also the person who if I get bored in a line while turning in a term paper I'll do toe points like a ballerina and people will look at me like I'm crazy, but it's to get rid of energy boiling up.

[aussiefriend]

I think what people are forgetting is that the jury is privy to mounds of evidence that we do not get to see. They don't just look at a picture of her and decide whether she looks shifty or not. They have to make an informed decision based on the evidence.

It is interesting to note that Meredith Kerchers family believe she is guilty. They are also privy to information and 'behind the scenes' displays that we do not have access to.

During OJs trial he used to intimidate and berate Nicole's sister out in the hallway.

The family wouldn't want her to be found guilty if she didn't do it. They want the responsible party brought to justice.

[Duchess]

I am probably am in the minority to think that don't feel she did it.

I don't think she's guilty either & believe that court is filled with a bunch of yahoos who have no business practicing the law.

[aussiefriend]

That's a very broad call! You cannot just say that! 'you are all a bunch of yahoos and you have no business practicing the law'. I mean, this is their profession. There must be something there. They know the world is watching them. There is a poor dead girl and there needs to be justice for her.

[Duchess]

There is a poor dead girl and there needs to be justice for her.

There is no justice in a kangaroo court, Aussie. There are attorneys here who have seen & heard the evidence, they are stymied why there has even been a trial, let alone 3 of them. Dan Abrams laughed his ass off at the court & the prosecuting attorneys. He wasn't the only one. High profile lawyers here publicly said it would be a very bad idea for Amanda to return to Italy.

[Duchess]

Aussie, don't you give pause when you think about the justice system there? Serious question. This was the third trial. She was found guilty, appealed, sentence overturned and because some didn't like the verdict they decide to try her again. C'mon! Our country has something called double jeopardy, that farce never would have been allowed to happen here.

[heartbreaker6713]

Aussie I'm not forgetting that

[heartbreaker6713]

Aussie I have been the victim and I am completely aware of what happens in a trial. I also am completely aware of what is released and what happens when it doesn't go the way some think it will. As duchess has mention in the us we only have one chance to get the bad guys and for the sake of that it doesn't mean the people in my trial didn't do it just because all weren't found guilty. In my case the definition of the law wasn't written right correctly and one of the people got off while the other plead guilty and couldn't be used against the one that got off. So how does that work? Does that make them any less or more guilty morally based on the fact that the court says he was not guilty... His friend has a guilty charge on his record...and they committed the crime as a group.

[heartbreaker6713]

Amanda know was sentenced to 28 years this time. Last time she was sentenced to 26 years.

[HairOfTheDog]

Do I hear "double jeopardy"?

I don't think so, Cars.

When you live abroad, you are subject to the laws of the land, of course.

All members of the Council of Europe (which includes nearly all European countries, and every member of the European Union) have signed the European Convention on Human Rights. The optional Seventh Protocol to the Convention, Article Four, protects against double jeopardy and says:

No one shall be liable to be tried or punished again in criminal proceedings under the jurisdiction of the same State for an offence for which he or she has already been finally acquitted or convicted in accordance with the law and penal procedure of that State.

Member states may, however, implement legislation which allows reopening of a case in the event that new evidence is found or if there was a fundamental defect in the previous proceedings:

The provisions of the preceding paragraph shall not prevent the reopening of the case in accordance with the law and penal procedure of the State concerned, if there is evidence of new or newly discovered facts, or if there has been a fundamental defect in the previous proceedings, which could affect the outcome of the case.

This optional protocol has been ratified by all EU states except five (Belgium, Germany, Spain, the Netherlands, and the United Kingdom). In those member states, national rules governing double jeopardy may or may not comply with the provision cited above.

In many European countries, the prosecution may appeal an acquittal to a higher court (similar to the provisions of Canadian law) – this is not counted as double jeopardy but as a continuation of the same trial. This is allowed by the European Convention on Human Rights.
=======================================

In Knox's case, the appellate court overturned the lower court's jury ruling of "guilty" based on inappropriate evidence, essentially.

Then, the case was reviewed by the Higher Court. The Higher Court found that there was sufficient evidence that wasn't covered in the appellate court's acquittal and rendered the acquittal invalid, giving the prosecutors a green light to retry the case.

Knox released a statement today that this wasn't proper because she was "found innocent' before. She was never "found innocent"; the guilty verdict was overturned. Today, she was found "Guilty" according to Italian law. But, the US will likely refuse to extradite Knox if Italy demands it because she could not have been retried under US-specific laws regarding double jeopardy.

If Knox and Sollecito were not involved, Meredith's family has been misled and it's an injustice to Meredith, the Kerchers, Knox and Sollecito.

If the pair were involved, I fear the Kerchers will get no justice on the Knox side - I think the US government is gonna protect Knox, despite the fact that the retrial was legal under Italian law.

Shame the Italian courts made such a mess of it all.

In any case, we may never know what really happened to Meredith.

P.s. Good to see you, Heartbreaker. Thanks for the verdict update!

[HairOfTheDog]

AFTER THE SECOND GUILTY VERDICT - WHAT'S NEXT?

Less than 24 hours after Amanda Knox was convicted again for the murder of her roommate in Italy, Knox's ex-boyfriend was picked up by police. He is not under arrest at this point. But Raffaele Sollecito was also convicted for a second time in the 2007 death of Meredith Kercher.

For Knox, a new battle begins: the fight against extradition from the U.S.

"We might never know the truth. We can only go by what's out there in reports and documents," Stephanie Kercher, the victim's sister, said Friday,

In a statement, Knox blamed her latest conviction on, "overzealous and intransigent prosecution … reliance on unreliable testimony and evidence ..." and "character assassination."

Could Knox be sent back to Italy? Julian Ku, a Hofstra law professor, says the U.S. isn't necessarily a safe haven for Amanda. "This is a case where extradition would be appropriate because she's already been convicted," Ku said.

Any decision on whether to extradite the 26-year-old from the U.S. is likely months away, at least. Experts have said it's unlikely that Italy's justice ministry would request Knox's extradition before the verdict is finalized by the country's high court. If the conviction is upheld, a lengthy extradition process would likely ensue, with the U.S. State Department ultimately deciding whether to turn Knox back over to Italian authorities to finish serving her sentence.

Peter Van Sant of "48 Hours" -- who has followed the case since the beginning -- said on "CTM": "In this seemingly never ending game of legal ping pong, Knox will appeal to Italy's Supreme Court. We have also been told the family may appeal to the European Court of Human Rights, which has the power to overturn this verdict."

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/amanda-knox-...-to-italy/