(12-18-2010, 01:58 PM)Spiderlady Wrote: I do believe in angels, in the biblical sense. I don't believe each of us have an angel assigned to us to keep us safe - if it were, then some angels are falling down on their jobs. God expects us to take care of ourselves and each other.
I also believe in God, and I believe He has a purpose for everyone. He gives us free will to do as we choose- that's why there is so much messed-up stuff out there. And that goes back to my statement above- for every awful crime we've discussed on here, there was somebody who could have done something to prevent it, but they chose not to. Don't blame God for people being as mean as hell, when He gives all of us the choice in what we do- would you rather not have free will?
I don't believe in evolution in the sense that we all came from some big pile of ooze- to me, that takes a much bigger leap of faith than believing there is something out there that is bigger than we are that had a hand in designing such an intricate universe and all the things within it. I don't see how someone can look at all the things around us, and believe that it just 'happened'. I do believe animals and plants can adapt over generations to their surroundings.
Flame me if you must.

On your belief in "Biblical-style" angels: it was almost as sad as your reference to God as a "he," as if it's not childish to think that the creator of the Universe has or needs testicles.

On your free will comment: Making you be born a sick sinner, then demanding that you make yourself well or be damned and punished for all eternity, isn't exactly free will. In addition, we don't have any choice but to have free will.

On your evolution comment: You need to educate yourself in evolutionary science more. Competition and natural selection cause change in and out of organic ooze. Your instincts confirmed this when you said that you "believe animals and plants can adapt over generations to their surroundings."

(12-18-2010, 02:35 PM)Cracker Wrote:

(12-18-2010, 01:58 PM)Spiderlady Wrote: I don't believe in evolution in the sense that we all came from some big pile of ooze- to me, that takes a much bigger leap of faith than believing there is something out there that is bigger than we are that had a hand in designing such an intricate universe and all the things within it. I don't see how someone can look at all the things around us, and believe that it just 'happened'. I do believe animals and plants can adapt over generations to their surroundings.Flame me if you must.

I'm not going to flame you. The title of this thread indicates most people in America believe this.

You can't not believe in evolution then turn around and say animals and plants adapt over time, because the IS evolution. Adaptation over time= evolution. You can't have it both ways.

Please tell me what believers think of dinosaurs and Java man. I would love to know that. I won't be ugly.

I think there's a big difference in believing that we all came from some primordial ooze (did I spell that right?), and believing that animals and plants can adapt over seasons or generations.
I believe there were animal and plant types and that over the years, they can change and develop- I don't believe all the different types of dogs existed in the beginning, for example. But there was a type of dog in the beginning- wolves, coyotes, dogs and other dog-like creatures came from them.
The same with people - I think races of people developed and changed to adapt to their surroundings; I do believe we started out as humans.

Of course there were dinosaurs! doesn't this sound like a dinosaur?
Job 40:15 ¶ Behold now behemoth, which I made with thee; he eateth grass as an ox.
16 Lo now, his strength [is] in his loins, and his force [is] in the navel of his belly.
17 He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together.

And Job 41 describes a sea creature:
19 Out of his mouth go burning lamps, and sparks of fire leap out.
20 Out of his nostrils goeth smoke, as out of a seething pot or caldron.
21 His breath kindleth coals, and a flame goeth out of his mouth.

Not familiar with Java man- I'll have to research into that so I can answer you. I am in no way claiming to be a Bible scholar, so it may take me a while to find answers.

As far as science goes- I believe in science. I also know that scientists are human, just like the rest of us. Some make mistakes, and some have agendas that they will do anything to further. As an example: I'm 52 years old- my mom's generation of young women were encouraged to smoke and to take drugs like thalidomide that were later proved to cause birth defects, to prevent morning sickness. Science was behind that. so we can't say science is perfect either.

Okay, I'm reading a little on Java man now, and I see what you're talking about. My first thoughts: I'm wondering how many of these were finally found, especially complete skeletons; whether they could be aberrations in what we think of as humans, or whether they could be some other type of animal that has become extinct.
I'm reading on Christian and non-Christian based sites, and I have to go to work in a little while, but hopefully I can wade through all this stuff and see what sense it makes to me.

(12-18-2010, 03:03 PM)Middle Finger Wrote:

(12-18-2010, 01:58 PM)Spiderlady Wrote: I do believe in angels, in the biblical sense. I don't believe each of us have an angel assigned to us to keep us safe - if it were, then some angels are falling down on their jobs. God expects us to take care of ourselves and each other.
I also believe in God, and I believe He has a purpose for everyone. He gives us free will to do as we choose- that's why there is so much messed-up stuff out there. And that goes back to my statement above- for every awful crime we've discussed on here, there was somebody who could have done something to prevent it, but they chose not to. Don't blame God for people being as mean as hell, when He gives all of us the choice in what we do- would you rather not have free will?
I don't believe in evolution in the sense that we all came from some big pile of ooze- to me, that takes a much bigger leap of faith than believing there is something out there that is bigger than we are that had a hand in designing such an intricate universe and all the things within it. I don't see how someone can look at all the things around us, and believe that it just 'happened'. I do believe animals and plants can adapt over generations to their surroundings.
Flame me if you must.

On your belief in "Biblical-style" angels: it was almost as sad as your reference to God as a "he," as if it's not childish to think that the creator of the Universe has or needs testicles.

On your free will comment: Making you be born a sick sinner, then demanding that you make yourself well or be damned and punished for all eternity, isn't exactly free will. In addition, we don't have any choice but to have free will.

On your evolution comment: You need to educate yourself in evolutionary science more. Competition and natural selection cause change in and out of organic ooze. Your instincts confirmed this when you said that you "believe animals and plants can adapt over generations to their surroundings."

Does your Father have testicles? In scripture God is refered to in the masculine, sorry if that pisses you off because your arguement is elementary and pitifully shallow and uneducated.

Evolution would require an in between state of being something not quite this or that but on it's way from this to that , apart from "evolution" science has adaptation that out of necessity takes what is there and either eliminates it due to outside environmental influences or promotes it's change"adaptation" due to enviromental conditions.

may be a good exercise for you would be to actually know something about what you claim to be science ? which by the way when you speak of science you speak of hypothesis -V- law, I'm sure that went over your head but it really dosn't matter if you understand it or not, I'm sure your contributions to physical law are limited to the wall in your basement , and your underwear.

(12-18-2010, 03:16 PM)Spiderlady Wrote: Okay, I'm reading a little on Java man now, and I see what you're talking about. My first thoughts: I'm wondering how many of these were finally found, especially complete skeletons; whether they could be aberrations in what we think of as humans, or whether they could be some other type of animal that has become extinct.
I'm reading on Christian and non-Christian based sites, and I have to go to work in a little while, but hopefully I can wade through all this stuff and see what sense it makes to me.

There is a lot to know. Make sure you filter everything you read with, "Why did this person write this?"

I don't need the Biblical account of creation to believe there MIGHT be something that drives this whole show. Scientists cannot predict what lies on the other side of the singularity that created this universe. You can have religion and science at the same time as long as you never mistake one for the other.

I do believe we are all part one thing. I just don't claim to know what that one thing is. The trick to any belief system is being able to find room for truth, even scientific truth, and still keep your belief.

Good reading: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sn/prehistoric_life...ndex.shtml

I'm not even sure I believe in God and Jesus Christ let alone angels.

I had a dumb redneck friend that hand-painted a sign for her front door that said, "Protected by Angles." I never told her.

(12-19-2010, 01:51 AM)Cracker Wrote: I had a dumb redneck friend that hand-painted a sign for her front door that said, "Protected by Angles." I never told her.

L

(12-19-2010, 01:51 AM)Cracker Wrote: I had a dumb redneck friend that hand-painted a sign for her front door that said, "Protected by Angles." I never told her.

fuck, i see dumbasses spell it 'angles' all the time. it's right up there with loosers instead of losers.

I am gonna wager a guess that most of us, as children, believed in the existance of Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, tooth fairy and the Grinch. Guardian Angels? Why not? It may be cool to think someone is watching out for my fat Italian ass. But on the flip side, if I screw up, I am not blaming the Angel, just me. But I am also of the rosy eyed notion that my deceased parents (may they both RIP) are looking out for me. And if I believe that, who does it hurt??

My fat Italian ass did believe in angels, God, Jesus, Mary, Joseph and all the Saints back when I was a good Catholic girl. Now I think it's all hogwash. I'd like to believe in something, but I just can't anymore. When I'm on my death bed or need something, well then it's a different story.

(12-19-2010, 07:55 PM)bampton Wrote: My fat Italian ass did believe in angels, God, Jesus, Mary, Joseph and all the Saints back when I was a good Catholic girl. Now I think it's all hogwash. I'd like to believe in something, but I just can't anymore. When I'm on my death bed or need something, well then it's a different story.

How absolutely deep and thoughtful you are. I bet your're exhausted from expending all that brain power all in one post?

I had to take nap.

(12-19-2010, 09:02 PM)bampton Wrote: I had to take nap.

I think you were being honest. There are a lot of reborn Christians on Death Row.

I think some people cling to religion because they want something. They want God to provide for them and protect them and be the reason for everything. It's more difficult to find your own meaning and make your life mean something.

(12-19-2010, 09:51 PM)Cracker Wrote:

(12-19-2010, 09:02 PM)bampton Wrote: I had to take nap.

I think you were being honest. There are a lot of reborn Christians on Death Row.

I think some people cling to religion because they want something. They want God to provide for them and protect them and be the reason for everything. It's more difficult to find your own meaning and make your life mean something.

Do you think criminals on death row are result driven people?

Dick: "Do you think criminals on death row are result driven people?"


well...they know all the angles.






sorry. that was terrible

(12-19-2010, 10:00 PM)IMaDick Wrote: Do you think criminals on death row are result driven people?

Tony Robbins visits Mock!


I think there's some truth to the expression "there are no atheists in foxholes".