BULLSHIT!! that's all I have to say. He "may not" of killed them but HE WAS THERE. So he's just as damn guilty.

Shell: " I'm not worried about prison time, it doesn't matter if it takes 20 yrs they will catch the true killers."
--------------------------------


that is quite a cavalier attitude about living in prison at his age. innocent people who are serving time are screaming their innocence.
in fact it sounds like bullshit and bravado. maybe there is something to the story that he will be amassing funds while incarcerated. but even if he's collecting a fortune, someone WILL want to shank him. and he will never have a good steak or a woman again. it's not a happy existence, even if he becomes institutionalized.
as for people not capable of murder...whoever killed Johnny and Lisa did not go there with the intent to murder. things got out of control. they got scared and panicked. anything could happen to a thug who was just a robber before.

Shell52486

Was Cameo Christened?

Yes, Sam and Cameo were both there. The cigarette was not planted, there was no party there, and their DNA did not get on it by some other method. Their lack of an alibi and their refusal to talk is the reason why Sam is in jail and why Cameo should be.

I do believe AC and Maytee both had something else to do with it as well. The only one that I really believe anything from is TW but it's only bits and pieces at that.

[quote='MikeyA' pid='278621' dateline='1345144544']
Yes, Sam and Cameo were both there. The cigarette was not planted, there was no party there, and their DNA did not get on it by some other method. Their lack of an alibi and their refusal to talk is the reason why Sam is in jail and why Cameo should be.

You can think what you want but you don't have any evidence proving cameo was there. Just bc his DNA was on that cigarette don't mean anything. Your DNA can transfer by just taking the cigarette out of the pack. And cameos phone records are enough of n alibi. And no I'm not retarded to think that I have lived with cameo for 8 yrs and not one time did he leave his phone at home when he left. So stop stating that you know something if you don't have reliable evidence to back it up. As for tw you say you only believe things she says. Well she lied on the stand numerous times, and to the investigators and knowing that you believe some things she says. The only thing she didn't lie about was if she knew the defendants.

I do believe AC and Maytee both had something else to do with it as well. The only one that I really believe anything from is TW but it's only

(08-16-2012, 04:02 PM)shell52486 Wrote: [quote='MikeyA' pid='278621' dateline='1345144544']
Yes, Sam and Cameo were both there. The cigarette was not planted, there was no party there, and their DNA did not get on it by some other method. Their lack of an alibi and their refusal to talk is the reason why Sam is in jail and why Cameo should be.

You can think what you want but you don't have any evidence proving cameo was there. Just bc his DNA was on that cigarette don't mean anything. Your DNA can transfer by just taking the cigarette out of the pack. And cameos phone records are enough of n alibi. And no I'm not retarded to think that I have lived with cameo for 8 yrs and not one time did he leave his phone at home when he left. So stop stating that you know something if you don't have reliable evidence to back it up. As for tw you say you only believe things she says. Well she lied on the stand numerous times, and to the investigators and knowing that you believe some things she says. The only thing she didn't lie about was if she knew the defendants.

I do believe AC and Maytee both had something else to do with it as well. The only one that I really believe anything from is TW but it's only

Ok, what do I think is more believable. That Cameo just happened to grab a cigarette in Sam's pack, only to put it back, and THAT is the one Sam left at the scene? Or do I think that either 1) they shared a cigarette while waiting or 2) when Johnny wasn't "talking" they shared a cigarette to discuss what to do next.

And yes, it is not a stretch to think that Cameo would have either left his phone behind before going to a premeditated crime OR gave it to someone else during that time.

I could show the facts of this case to 100 people who DIDN'T live with Cameo and I'd get a 95% probability of guilty. The fact is the judge through out the other statements so other than the cigarette there was nothing else to corroborate that he was there. Sam was not as lucky to get it thrown out. That is why Sam is in jail and Cameo is free.

Your closeness to Cameo has clouded your view of the facts of the case. As you've said he COULDN'T have done this.

I didn't deny that TW lied. In fact I said I believe only some of what she says. Now if you think she had something to do with it, I'll listen. Please connect the dots for us. At this point I don't see anything that points to her being anything other than an idiot.

Shell52486, Has Cameo found employment yet? are you getting child support? he needs to be a real father and provide for his children, don't you agree?

(08-16-2012, 04:02 PM)shell52486 Wrote: And no I'm not retarded to think that I have lived with cameo for 8 yrs and not one time did he leave his phone at home when he left.

Thanks for the clarification.

(08-16-2012, 04:49 PM)NightOwl Wrote: Shell52486, Has Cameo found employment yet? are you getting child support? he needs to be a real father and provide for his children, don't you agree?

My strong guess is Cameo is back with the mother of his children #2 - #4. Babimomma #1 had no good things to say about him, and babimomma #5 hooked up with another eastside thug. Maybe Cameo Pettaway will be a stay at home dad so that momma can go out and bring home the bacon. Wondering if he shares his truck, now?

(08-16-2012, 05:03 PM)Adub Wrote:

(08-16-2012, 04:49 PM)NightOwl Wrote: Shell52486, Has Cameo found employment yet? are you getting child support? he needs to be a real father and provide for his children, don't you agree?

My strong guess is Cameo is back with the mother of his children #2 - #4. Babimomma #1 had no good things to say about him, and babimomma #5 hooked up with another eastside thug. Maybe Cameo Pettaway will be a stay at home dad so that momma can go out and bring home the bacon. Wondering if he shares his truck, now?

(08-16-2012, 04:02 PM)shell52486 Wrote: And no I'm not retarded to think that I have lived with cameo for 8 yrs

Shell,
I have a few questions for you, since you know Cameo so well. I got most of this information from an article in the Toledo Blade, you can see it here : http://mockforums.net/thread-4892-page-6.html - Post 76

He's the father of five children all under the age of 8. - Do you think that mentally retarded people should procreate? Do you think it is irresponsible for them to have children?

The boy she loved — who had never laid a hand on her — became violent. He would allegedly slap her, choke her, pull her hair. Bite, push. The woman said contact with Mr. Pettaway has been sparse for years and she does not allow her daughter to be alone with Mr. Pettaway. - Do you think that Cameo assaulted her because he is mentally retarded or because he is a violent person? Is he too retarded to care for his daughter alone or do you think the mother fears what he might do to her?

Reports also show that Mr. Pettaway has been accused of assaulting at least five people. - Would you say that in Cameo's "culture", the 5 people actually reporting him of assault are a small fraction of the ones he has assaulted or harmed? Or do you think that all 5 of these people are lying since Cameo is such a great guy and all?

Mr. Williams' older sister, Nora Aliemenious, told Toledo police that she was having "ongoing problems" with Mr. Williams and that he said he would come in and "blow her head off and her [17]-year-old son's head off," - Mr. Williams has also been accused of multiple other crimes including running a prostitution operation. Cameo may be too retarded to know better, but why would YOU associate with someone like that?


I am just curious what someone that knows them so well thinks. Personally I think they are both guilty but, quite frankly, I wouldn't care if they were falsely accused of this particular crime. I still hope to see them either rot in jail or killed, preferably the latter so we don't have to pay for them and their crimes. People that live like this do not deserve to live in free society. And they definitely should not be procreating or influencing the lives of innocent children.

In fairness, I will go ahead and add Maytee and TW, AG, AC - the whole damn lot of them - to that list.

I love all you fellow Mockers, but geeeeez, is it really necessary to pick on those who know Pettaway and Williams and believe they're innocent? It can't be easy to process the heinousness of the crime and picture someone you know having been involved, any more than it is for me to process Lisa being the victim.

I, for one, appreciate their presence here and look forward to their posts. They have insight that the rest of us don't, and I find it enlightening to hear the perspective of those who know the accused. They also know the other "players" that have been the subject of discussion here and may be able to bring valuable information to Mock that hasn't been disclosed before.

I believe Sam Williams is guilty, and a jury agreed. I believe Cameo Pettaway is guilty, and a judge acquitted him. (And for the record, it's not the cigarette butt DNA or Eric Yingling the snitch that make me believe this; it's Williams' own voice in the jailhouse phone call to Steven Pettaway when he thought it wouldn't be traced to him, where he clearly implicated himself AND Pettaway.)

Having said that, reasonable people can disagree. I'd rather learn what I can about those involved, that I didn't know before, than preach the virtues of good parenting to individuals who, I think we can all agree, had nothing to do with the crime. I just don't see where that fits with the purpose of this forum.

I hope these folks don't get tired of having to constantly defend themselves or their positions and stop posting here. With all of the unanswered questions surrounding this case it seems silly to potentially squander an opportunity to hear from some fresh voices that may be able to provide insight that could lead to some answers. Let's not shoot the messenger.

Oh shit! I think I just twisted my ankle getting off my high horse. Medic! Will somebody get me a damn Medic?!?!!!

Wonderful post, Mustang. There has been way too much criticism of the posts made by those who know Cameo & Sam. Let them have their say.

(08-16-2012, 08:00 PM)Teacher Wrote: There has been way too much criticism of the posts made by those who know Cameo & Sam. Let them have their say.

^^^^^^^^

Do you know if Cameo is worried about a hit on him? Is he scared? how many people do you think were involved in the crime? who does sam and cameo say they think did it? How do they explain the cigerette?

How does Cameo feel about being labled a retard?
Is he going back to work as a pimp/dealer?
How does he feel about Sam being found guilty while he gets his freedom?

(08-16-2012, 07:43 PM)Mustang Wrote: I love all you fellow Mockers, but geeeeez, is it really necessary to pick on those who know Pettaway and Williams and believe they're innocent? It can't be easy to process the heinousness of the crime and picture someone you know having been involved, any more than it is for me to process Lisa being the victim.

I, for one, appreciate their presence here and look forward to their posts. They have insight that the rest of us don't, and I find it enlightening to hear the perspective of those who know the accused. They also know the other "players" that have been the subject of discussion here and may be able to bring valuable information to Mock that hasn't been disclosed before.

Some Mockers do some harsh picking like MikeyA for instance

(08-16-2012, 07:43 PM)Mustang Wrote: I, for one, appreciate their presence here and look forward to their posts. They have insight that the rest of us don't, and I find it enlightening to hear the perspective of those who know the accused. They also know the other "players" that have been the subject of discussion here and may be able to bring valuable information to Mock that hasn't been disclosed before.

...

I hope these folks don't get tired of having to constantly defend themselves or their positions and stop posting here. With all of the unanswered questions surrounding this case it seems silly to potentially squander an opportunity to hear from some fresh voices that may be able to provide insight that could lead to some answers. Let's not shoot the messenger.

(08-16-2012, 07:43 PM)Mustang Wrote: I love all you fellow Mockers, but geeeeez, is it really necessary to pick on those who know Pettaway and Williams and believe they're innocent? It can't be easy to process the heinousness of the crime and picture someone you know having been involved, any more than it is for me to process Lisa being the victim.

I, for one, appreciate their presence here and look forward to their posts. They have insight that the rest of us don't, and I find it enlightening to hear the perspective of those who know the accused. They also know the other "players" that have been the subject of discussion here and may be able to bring valuable information to Mock that hasn't been disclosed before.

I believe Sam Williams is guilty, and a jury agreed. I believe Cameo Pettaway is guilty, and a judge acquitted him. (And for the record, it's not the cigarette butt DNA or Eric Yingling the snitch that make me believe this; it's Williams' own voice in the jailhouse phone call to Steven Pettaway when he thought it wouldn't be traced to him, where he clearly implicated himself AND Pettaway.)

Having said that, reasonable people can disagree. I'd rather learn what I can about those involved, that I didn't know before, than preach the virtues of good parenting to individuals who, I think we can all agree, had nothing to do with the crime. I just don't see where that fits with the purpose of this forum.

I hope these folks don't get tired of having to constantly defend themselves or their positions and stop posting here. With all of the unanswered questions surrounding this case it seems silly to potentially squander an opportunity to hear from some fresh voices that may be able to provide insight that could lead to some answers. Let's not shoot the messenger.

Oh shit! I think I just twisted my ankle getting off my high horse. Medic! Will somebody get me a damn Medic?!?!!!

Great logic Mustang. Your Mother must be proud of you.

YUP!

Thank you, Mustang. I wish everyone would put their energy into finding the real killers and bringing them to justice through the legal system instead of encouraging/condoning "street justice". Lately seems like a bad case of Maytee-itis has infected Mock. I am sick of people acting like a hit on Cameo solves anything - it does nothing more than make yet another Toledoan a murderer.
I know this isn't going to be popular but I am not convinced of Cameo's guilt. There are a lot of gaps that I wish would have been addressed in the trial, things I question that I wish could be answered. As for Sam, I'm not sure. Again, I am disappointed in the weakness of the case. I didn't find the phone call that convincing...I really don't know. And I feel terrible for the families and wish they could know truly who was responsible.
I wonder if LE is focusing too much on DNA testing rather than piecing together the case. What would have happened pre-DNA ? How would it be investigated? There's a way to fit the pieces together that will make a stronger case than (almost) random DNA testing with no other evidence.