(10-07-2023, 07:06 PM)rothschild Wrote: How did you come to see Israel as you do?

It's been a very long time since I first began to feel this way and it started with my sense of fair play and one rule for all. I've never understood how Israel could accuse others of terrorism when those they accused were doing the same damn thing Israel does. I don't pretend to know & understand foreign policy, I find it all very confusing.

(10-08-2023, 05:00 AM)Duchess Wrote:

(10-07-2023, 07:06 PM)rothschild Wrote: How did you come to see Israel as you do?

It's been a very long time since I first began to feel this way and it started with my sense of fair play and one rule for all. I've never understood how Israel could accuse others of terrorism when those they accused were doing the same damn thing Israel does. I don't pretend to know & understand foreign policy, I find it all very confusing.

It isn't a complicated as most would have you believe.

The Arabs who occupied the area, known as Palestine, demand return of "their" land that was controlled . . . then ceded to establish a Jewish state, by the British.  This happened over 100 years ago (with the blessing of The League of Nations).

Israel is an American ally.  

Israel is a democracy.

Israel has sovereign borders.

Israel is under attack by hostile forces to destroy their government, people, culture . . . and grab territory.

The US, therefore, is obligated to help Israel defend herself . . . to preserve and promote democracy.


Sorry . . . I meant to type Ukraine . . . not Israel . . . in the above single sentences.

(10-08-2023, 10:38 AM)BlueTiki Wrote: Sorry . . . I meant to type Ukraine . . . not Israel . . . in the above single sentences.

I recognize sarcasm when I see it, ma'am.

(10-08-2023, 11:25 AM)Duchess Wrote:

(10-08-2023, 10:38 AM)BlueTiki Wrote: Sorry . . . I meant to type Ukraine . . . not Israel . . . in the above single sentences.

I recognize sarcasm when I see it, ma'am.

Dammit!  Busted!

You're too bright to ignore my deliberate subtext, regarding rules and reasons for US intervention, policy and commitment, (all with US taxpayer treasure) regarding foreign nations.

Goose and Gander.

(10-08-2023, 05:00 AM)Duchess Wrote:

(10-07-2023, 07:06 PM)rothschild Wrote: How did you come to see Israel as you do?

It's been a very long time since I first began to feel this way and it started with my sense of fair play and one rule for all. I've never understood how Israel could accuse others of terrorism when those they accused were doing the same damn thing Israel does. I don't pretend to know & understand foreign policy, I find it all very confusing.

I'm genuinely puzzled as to how you understand that Zionism has engaged in terrorism because that information, in my experience, requires searching for bits and pieces of truth that are not easy to come by unless you have an idea of what you're looking for. Today it's very difficult even if you do know what you're looking for, as the free search engines are garbage compared to what they used to be.

I'd be happy to pay for a search engine that doesn't skew or censor results. Any thoughts, Tiki?

(10-08-2023, 11:52 AM)rothschild Wrote: I'm genuinely puzzled as to how you understand that Zionism has engaged in terrorism because that information, in my experience, requires searching for bits and pieces of truth that are not easy to come by unless you have an idea of what you're looking for. 

I never searched for anything. Like I said, I was young and I just recall thinking look at those fuckers, they are terrorizing & killing others yet cry victim...or something like that. I always get a sense they want people to turn a blind eye to their atrocities. I thought it was unjust and moved on until the next time they were in the news.

(10-08-2023, 12:41 PM)Duchess Wrote:

(10-08-2023, 11:52 AM)rothschild Wrote: I'm genuinely puzzled as to how you understand that Zionism has engaged in terrorism because that information, in my experience, requires searching for bits and pieces of truth that are not easy to come by unless you have an idea of what you're looking for. 

I never searched for anything. Like I said, I was young and I just recall thinking look at those fuckers, they are terrorizing & killing others yet cry victim...or something like that. I always get a sense they want people to turn a blind eye to their atrocities. I thought it was unjust and moved on until the next time they were in the news.

CounterPunch, Mother Jones and The Nation provided some fair coverage of the Pals vs Israel conflict., The Nation far less so but better than most. They're nothing like they used to be, taken over by the "liberal" suits that run most of what passes for jounalism today. Seymour Hersh is still around -- one of the very best when it comes to investigative jounalism -- but I know of no one else in America that has his level of integrity.

I used to have a sub to Covert Action Quarterly, which should tell you just how nutty I am by mainstream standards.

No idea if they're still around. Be shocked if they still are, but who knows.

I'd be happy to pay for a search engine that doesn't skew or censor results. Any thoughts, Tiki?

To RC:

I really don't.

I use Brave on a regular basis . . . but their results are Chrome based.  Need I say more.

My suggestion is (if you aren't doing this already) explore non-mainstream financial and political publications.

I read so many Communist and Socialist publications, I'm probably on a government watch list (which might prove to be both an asset and a liability ). 

Read, digest and understand the arguments even when they tear at every fiber of your being.  Recognize emotional arguments and test their validity.  Examine and ponder any solutions proposed.  You might be surprised.

These are a few of the ones I read:

wsws.org

dissentmagazine.org

monthlyreview.org

marxist.org

There are a few from the UK, too (I like socialistworker.org).

To really get a feel and have access to a bunch of non-mainstream, pinko links, check out the Radical Newswire.

All give great insight as to current talking points and positions, shaping our country.

As an aside:  I believe Zionism is truly one of the original poster children to push the equity and inclusiveness agenda . . . everything the alphabet groups and minorities desire for themselves.

Do y'all have an opinion on why Israel seems to have been blind-sided by this when they have some of the most sophisticated anti-terrorism intelligence capabilities? I can't be the only one wondering how this happened.

(10-08-2023, 02:55 PM)Duchess Wrote: Do y'all have an opinion on why Israel seems to have been blind-sided by this when they have some of the most sophisticated anti-terrorism intelligence capabilities? I can't be the only one wondering how this happened.

Are you wanting to rule out the possibilities of a "false flag" operation by Israel -or- a US complicit operation with bad actors?

And to think . . . a recent $6B in US cash, to a known and sworn enemy of Israel, by this current administration.

And Biden . . . not coming out like other foreign leaders . . . to immediately side with Israel.   Odd.

Yeah . . . it was earmarked and is currently monitored for "humanitarian needs".

Guess that frees up a war-chest of other funds that were to be used for the same goals . . . in other accounts.

Nah . . . just bad intel gathering.  Yup . . . that's the ticket.

Woo-hoo!

https://covertactionmagazine.com/articles/

I'm reading that Israel has ordered a complete siege of Gaza. No electricity, food, water or fuel will be allowed to enter and while Egypt shares a border they are following Israel's lead. Palestinians have no place to go and many of them will have to watch their kids die.

(10-09-2023, 09:23 AM)Duchess Wrote: Palestinians have no place to go and many of them will have to watch their kids die.

Here's a thought . . . kill the parents before you kill the kids.

Now they can't see their children die.

Or kill the kids when the parents aren't looking.

Simple solutions to life's challenges.

Let's hope this reignites the efforts to treat Israel in the same manner that Apartheid South Africa was. Perhaps this will be the straw that finally breaks the camel's back.

"Apartheid" is another woke, incorrect, overused and gratuitous label  . . . when describing Israel.

Is it?

The narcissistic chosen poeple who run hollywood and trade fame for sex are arguably the biggest pain in the asses but even them don't deserve this shit.

No one deserves the shit that's rained down upon us from a place far above Hollywood, including ordinary Israelis.

(10-09-2023, 02:34 PM)rothschild Wrote: Is it?

You bet it is!

Comparing Israel to South African apartheid is like comparing a Girl Scout Cookie Booth to the Capital Riots.

It's the same bullshit as calling and labeling someone who supports a border wall a "racist".

Quit stooging, FFS!

You damn well know the difference . . . or should.

(10-09-2023, 06:32 PM)BlueTiki Wrote:

(10-09-2023, 02:34 PM)rothschild Wrote: Is it?

You bet it is!

Comparing Israel to South African apartheid is like comparing a Girl Scout Cookie Booth to the Capital Riots.

It's the same bullshit as calling and labeling someone who supports a border wall a "racist".

Quit stooging, FFS!

You damn well know the difference . . . or should.

My bet is that Israel treats the Pals worse than the South Africans were under apartheid.

The living conditions in the occupied territories are significantly worse than those that existed in the bantustans. Jimmy Carter said as much 25 years ago, as have a good number of Jewish peace activists. Haaretz is far more honest about this than the press here in the US, which lies as a matter of routine.

Israel is the worst abuser of human rights, per capita, in the world.