MYSTERY IN THE SKY - WTF? - MH370 & MH17 & QZ8501 & More

[Duchess]

This is affecting Russia's economy which was already shaky due to sanctions & the uncertainly of the near future and their market is very unstable now. Aha!

I don't know much about Russia, what I've seen of it, it looks poor and backwards but that can't be if they are a power, right? I've read that the very wealthy fear Putin, that most people there do for that matter. They have state run television that sounds like they make up their own facts and events as they happened. <insert Fox joke>. I waffle between wanting to know everything I can about what is going down to wanting to stick my head in the sand. It's all so fucked up.

[Maggot]

They may have been trying to kill one person, everyone else may have been collateral damage. Thus the cover of looting and disappearance of evidence.

[HairOfTheDog]

They may have been trying to kill one person, everyone else may have been collateral damage. Thus the cover of looting and disappearance of evidence.

You think maybe separatists or Ukrainian military had it out for a specific passenger on MH17? Who?

If you mean that the Ukrainian military might have launched the missile thinking they were aiming at Putin's plane, he hasn't flown in Ukrainian airspace in months -- that was confirmed the other day. If he'd been in that airspace, he'd be screaming it from the rooftops, IMO.

[crash]

I was ok when I read the article..

Maslin family releases tribute to children killed in MH17

The parents of three West Australian children who were killed with their grandfather in the MH17 tragedy have released a statement addressed to "the Ukraine, the politicians, the media, our friends and family".

The Maslin children Mo, 12, Evie, 10, and Otis, 8, were flying home to Australia with their grandfather Nick Norris aboard the Malaysia Airlines flight when it was shot down over Ukraine.

The children's parents, Anthony Maslin and Marite Norris, described their pain as "intense and relentless".

"We live in a hell beyond hell. Our babies are not here with us – we need to live with this act of horror, every day and every moment for the rest of our lives," the statement reads.

"No one deserves what we are going through. Not even the people who shot our whole family out of the sky.

"No hate in the world is as strong as the love we have for our children, for Mo, for Evie, for Otis. No hate in the world is as strong as the love we have for Grandad Nick. No hate in the world is as strong as the love we have for each other. This is a revelation that gives us some comfort."

but when I looked at this picture for a few seconds..



and looked at their smiles, the words of that article ^ sunk in.

and..



I think I'll hug my three just a bit tighter this weekend.

[Maggot]

They may have been trying to kill one person, everyone else may have been collateral damage. Thus the cover of looting and disappearance of evidence.

You think maybe separatists or Ukrainian military had it out for a specific passenger on MH17? Who?

If you mean that the Ukrainian military might have launched the missile thinking they were aiming at Putin's plane, he hasn't flown in Ukrainian airspace in months -- that was confirmed the other day. If he'd been in that airspace, he'd be screaming it from the rooftops, IMO.

I would not put it past Putin to have had a hand in this somehow.

[HairOfTheDog]

It's just sad all the way around.

I don't think whoever launched that missile had any idea what they were really targeting -- it's a huge FAIL for their image, their cause, their integrity -- nothing to gain from it.

I can't see any way that the Ukraine government or military would have launched that missile. Yeah, they're capitalizing on the tragedy and getting some short term gain from it, but the conspiracy theory that they downed a plane with intent to frame the separatists makes no sense to me. Putin's pissed at Ukraine for identifying more with the West than his Eastern European block, ousting his PM puppet, and making a NATO bid. That's what got the whole Crimea annexation and separatist fervor kicked off.

So, no way, Ukraine would shoot down a plane filled with European civilians or carrying Putin for any reason. And, I can't see them mistaking a commercial flight for a Russian military plane. Russia could take the Ukraine down militarily in a nano second. And, it would compromise the Ukrainian government's goals to take down its ally's civilians or assassinate Putin.

It makes most sense, to me, that separatists thought it was another Ukraine military plane and shot it down under that pretext. It's simply exactly what it appears to be. If that's true and it's confirmed that the missile was launched by separatists trained and/or supplied by Russia, Putin had to know what was going down at the border.

Even so, money talks. Despite the loss of European lives, I don't think that Germany is gonna go for stricter sanctions -- they rely so heavily on Russia for energy and won't wanna risk the supply being cut off or the prices soaring. Plus, I think Merkel is still pissed about the phone taps -- she seems on better terms with Russia than the US, to me. The Netherlands is in debt to Russia. France doesn't want to halt its lucrative trade agreements...

IDK. It's easier for the US and Britain to push for big punitive measures that fit the crime because it won't affect our economies much -- we can hurt Putin and Russia more than they can hurt us -- but it's still not a huge hit to Russia without Europe. I really don't think Germany and France are gonna go for strict sanctions that could hurt their economies.

IMO, the big push will be on Putin to rein in the separatists, divest from supplying them with anything, and agree to peace talks and a swift agreement with Poroshenko. He won't admit to anything even if evidence points to Russia's involvement, but he'll back off on Ukraine and position himself as a peace-maker until things cool down. That's what I think is gonna happen anyway.

[Duchess]

Some of the victims on their way to the morgue to be identified. They are back in Holland now.

[blueberryhill]

I think the terrorists, oh I mean the separatists, were having fun with their new toy and they were enjoying shooting down planes; probably drinking a little and didn't have too many brains to start with, and got carried away and shot down the plane... ... ........and they probably said in unison, oops... I liken it to young boys (maybe a few girls) playing the latest edition of Grand Theft Auto and shooting down planes was becoming fun and games. Then they had to return their "toy" back to Russia.

[blueberryhill]

P.S. The fact that these street thugs stole personal items from the victims further speaks to just how despicable they are and probably don't know what the hell they are fighting about.

[Duchess]

Villagers are still being allowed to wander through the debris field, people are still looting and there are still body parts rotten in the summer sun. This is beyond enraging. I know we can't do anything about it but someone, somewhere, can, yet, nothing. It horrifies me to see strangers pawing through the possessions of those poor lost souls and taking what they want.

[Duchess]

Eight months and still nothing.

[Midwest Spy]

The pilot of the missing aircraft was a genuine aircraft enthusiast.

He had a 777 simulator in his house.

I think he flew this plane 'beneath radar' once he reached the Strait of Malacca. With 4+ hours of fuel remaining he literally could've flown 1,000's of miles from the last known military radar sighting. Out over the ocean, cell phones wouldn't have worked.

His motive? Well, I'd like to know how his personal finances look, whether or not he was involved with lovers, etc., ANYTHING that could seem like a reason to want to commit suicide.

Did he recently purchase life insurance? I'm sure the CIA and Malaysian authorities are looking into this now.

The planes black box has a 30-day life. After that, there's no 'pinging' that would help people locate the aircraft.

If his goal was to ditch this plane in the middle of the Indian Ocean without a trace, he's got a pretty good start.

More brilliance ^.

When you think about it, the pilot has a far better chance to sabotage an aircraft than anybody else. Sneaking weapons or bombs on board a plane is really difficult in 2014.

Turns out the pilot had connections to a Malaysian political prisoner (jailed a few days before the plane went missing).

Again, by crashing his plane and having it never found, he makes the Malaysian govt look pretty bad, which certainly could've been his motive.

[HairOfTheDog]

Turns out the pilot had connections to a Malaysian political prisoner (jailed a few days before the plane went missing).

Again, by crashing his plane and having it never found, he makes the Malaysian govt look pretty bad, which certainly could've been his motive.

The pilot was politically active; that information and his support of the jailed reformist was released way back in March -- along with other information about the pilots, an engineer, some of the passengers... Have you seen something that indicates investigators have since linked the pilot's politics to the disappearance of the plane, MS?

Personally, I don't think making the Malaysian government look bad is a likely motive IF the plane was actually intentionally diverted. It would be impossible to know how the Malaysian government would handle the situation, whether they would find the plane, whether the blame would be cast on the pilot himself or somebody else...

I hope this plane is found and there's some physical evidence that sheds light on what the hell happened.

[HairOfTheDog]

Another Asian Commercial Flight Falls off The Radar -- AirAsia Flight QZ8501



The plane, flying from the Indonesian city of Surabaya to Singapore, went missing as it flew over the Java Sea between the islands of Belitung and Borneo -- a heavily traveled shipping channel with shallow waters, according to Indonesian authorities, who are leading the search and rescue operations.

Before the plane lost contact with air traffic controllers, one of the pilots asked to fly at a higher altitude because of bad weather, officials said. No mayday or pan-pan calls were transmitted from pilots to controllers.

"Mayday means you're immediately in danger of losing the flight; pan-pan means that it is urgent but that you can continue the flight and request an alternate route or an alternate airport," said Schiavo, a former inspector general for the U.S. Department of Transportation.

Family members of the 162 passengers are desperately waiting for information about the mysterious disappearance.

Singapore air authorities and the Royal Australian Air Force are helping Indonesian aviation authorities with the search. It's been almost a full day since the plane fell off the radar.

Man, 2014 has been a very bad year for Asian flights.

Story: http://edition.cnn.com/2014/12/27/world/...?hpt=hp_t1

[ZEROSPHERES]

I think the pilot climbed too rapidly to avoid a storm and stalled the plane into an uncontrollable death roll into the ocean

[username]

One thing I heard today which was a major "duh, why haven't we done that" yet for me was those little black boxes and cockpit recorders. All of that shit should be live streamed out somewhere instead of searching for little boxes at the bottom of the ocean. The technology used dates back a decade or two.

[HairOfTheDog]

I think the pilot climbed too rapidly to avoid a storm and stalled the plane into an uncontrollable death roll into the ocean

I think the plane is at the bottom of the Java Sea too.

Luckily, it's much shallower than the Indian Ocean where MH370 is presumed to have gone down and aviation authorities know approximately where it dropped, so there's a decent chance of recovering QZ8501.

Here's some updated information on what the pilots did (and presumably did):

Snip:
The pilots requested a higher altitude because of weather.

Air traffic control approved the pilot's request to turn left but denied permission for the plane to climb to 38,000 feet from 32,000 feet, Djoko Murjatmodjo, an aviation official at the Indonesian Transport Ministry, told the national newspaper Kompas.

The increased altitude request was denied because there was another plane flying at that height, he said.

Djoko suggested that Flight 8501 (the plane is an Airbus A320) ascended despite air traffic control denying it permission.

A screen grab purportedly leaked by an Indonesian air traffic controller appears to show that Flight 8501 was rising in altitude but was losing speed at a velocity that was too slow to sustain flight, said Geoffrey Thomas, managing director at the aviation industry site airlineratings.com.

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/12/29/world/...?hpt=hp_t1

[HairOfTheDog]

AirAsia QZ8501 Located -- Recovery Efforts Underway



Soelistyo, the head of Indonesia's search and rescue agency, said the debris was discovered when a crew on a military aircraft spotted the shadow of an object that looked like a plane in the water.

Further searching found floating objects believed to be the bodies of passengers, and then what appeared to be an emergency exit of the plane.

Officials sent other search teams racing to the area. Hospitals in the Indonesian city of Surabaya are being prepared to help house and identify bodies being recovered off the coast of Borneo.

Several nations are contributing resources to the effort, including the United States. The U.S. Navy destroyer USS Sampson arrived Tuesday.

Full story: http://edition.cnn.com/2014/12/30/world/...?hpt=hp_t1

[QueenBee]

[HairOfTheDog]

As the crash recovery and passenger funerals continue, it's been confirmed that AirAsia wasn't even authorized to be in that airspace the day that flight QZ8501 went down...

.

Snip:
Surabaya, Indonesia (CNN) AirAsia Indonesia did not have a license to fly the Surabaya-to-Singapore route on Sunday that ended in tragedy, it has been revealed.

The airline was approved to fly the route four days a week but it did not include Sunday.

Indonesia’s Ministry of Transport has announced a full investigation of the breach (expected to take about a week) and suspended Indonesia AirAsia flights between the two cities. It will also check all other airlines operating in the country to make sure they were complying with license agreements.

Full story: http://wgntv.com/2015/01/04/officials-ai...nt-page-1/