RETURN TO SENDER/ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION

[Duchess]

This is the tweet exchange that went down today. An official White House tweet accused Senator Harris of supporting MS-13 and she pushed back.

The White House official account was used to go after a few Senators. I like Senator Harris' push back.

Trolling sitting Senators. WTF.

[HairOfTheDog]

I'm so hung up on DHHS taking all those kids (some infants & toddlers), who will never find their way back to their parents. It's unforgivable. They haven't a fuckin' clue where some of those kids are.

It is unforgivable. As you noted upthread, many of the cases involve young children who can't even communicate about their parents.

It's also unacceptable that the Administration refuses to release important information about what the government is doing and the status of the separated children.

It does not appear that the Trump Administration will meet the reunification deadlines established by the federal court in San Diego. I'm not sure what comes next, from a legal perspective.

But, it's good to see the courts, the press, and the public are keeping the heat on. That needs to continue until every child's location is known to his/her parents, communication between them is established, and the path to reunification is firmly established.

[Duchess]

But, it's good to see the courts, the press, and the public are keeping the heat on. That needs to continue until every child's location is known to his/her parents, communication between them is established, and the path to reunification is firmly established.

Yeah!

I can't wait until all those incompetent, unqualified muthafuckas are run out of town on a rail. There are tiny bits of happiness here & there when I hear of them paying a price, however small, for their fucked-upness. Alan Dershowitz wrote an op-ed and talked about being shunned on Martha's Vineyard. His (former) pals have "socially banned" him. His phrase, not mine. HaHaFuckinHa. Cry me a river, you old twat.

[HairOfTheDog]

There are tiny bits of happiness here & there when I hear of them paying a price, however small, for their fucked-upness.

The government missed its deadline for reuniting children 5 and under with a parent or guardian. Only four out of the 102 babies and toddlers had been reunited before the July 10 deadline, according to a court filing from government lawyers.

The children in question for Tuesdays deadline were all 5 and under, but nearly 3,000 minors in total still need to be reunited with their parents as a result of a ruling Judge Sabraw issued on June 26, calling for reunification and an end to family separations within a month.

Sabraw urged the federal government to reunify children separated from their parents as quickly as possible.

"These are not aspirational goals," he said, referring to the deadlines he set out. HHS has until July 26 to reunify children aged 5 to 17.

DNA testing is being used to match children with their family members. The judge ordered the DNA samples to be destroyed after reunification.

Yesterday, another judge, Dolly Gee, denied the Administration's attempt to detain families together indefinitely. She said the government was bound by Flores and called their legal move a "cynical attempt" to shift responsibility for immigration policy to the judiciary.

Full story: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/pare...ne-n890251

[HairOfTheDog]

When families are released with case managers and/or ankle monitors, more than 90% turn up for their immigration court dates. Until Congress passes immigration reform, I think that 'catch and release' policy will likely be reinstated, no matter how much Trump beat Obama over the head about it.

I hope the suspicion that the government is drawing this out, because the separations and images of migrants in detention and distress appeals to the President's base, is overstated.

But, based on Trump's statements yesterday and the pace of reunification, it's not hard to believe that it's intentional (to deter migrants and asylum seekers and shore up the base).

[Duchess]

But, based on Trump's statements yesterday and the pace of reunification, it's not hard to believe that it's intentional (to deter migrants and asylum seekers and shore up the base).

This administration does not care a wit about people who are anything other than white and once you get into only the white people other caveats may begin to apply.

I'm pretty sure the plan to separate families was in the works shortly after the inauguration, if not before and I don't think for a minute that any judge's ruling is going to phase these people at all. They are still planning for facilities that are going to be housing these people.

I hate all those fuckers. Everyday I have a choice to make, stay on top of current events or protect my sanity. It's one or the other.

[BigMark]

[Duchess]

Shhhh. Hush yur mouf. I lost my mind when this administration took those kids. Now, some are lost forever. I'm not going to be quiet about this.

[Blindgreed1]

Bravo

[BigMark]

Duchess,Milania, Sally or whatever the fuck your real name is. remember when we all agreed Aussie was losing her mind? That's you, now.

[HairOfTheDog]

When the forum Dodo, backed by the resident birdbrain, musters up a radical burn like "you're cuckoo for knowing and caring about shit!!!"............ it's gotta really sting bro.

That mighta worked on my friend aussie sometimes when she was on a low swing, but Duchess could easily clean your clocks (if it was worth the minimal effort, which is unlikely).

[Love Child]

Duchess,Milania, Sally or whatever the fuck your real name is. remember when we all agreed Aussie was losing her mind? That's you, now.

No it isn't.

[Duchess]

trump and his administration were told that their zero tolerance immigration policy would cause severe psychological damage to young children and they went forward with it anyway. They didn't have a problem with destroying records regarding these kids either, some of them will never see their parents again.

[Fry Guy]

As a parent I find it absolutely the height of disgraceful that parent subject their children to this.
There is systems in place and legal ports of entry and yet they sneak themselves and their children in and risk their children dying and/or being raped and abused by human "coyotes".

There is a system in place to become a legal citizen of the US. There is a system in place to become a refugee (it involves going in through the legal ports of entry and claiming asylum). Which do these guys choose and expose their children to? What choice do they make?

The President and the Administration of the US has NO obligation to accept immigrants of either gender and of any age coming into their country. They DO NOT OWE them.

Whilst we can make the case for the poor children separated from their parents, okay are you ALSO going to make the case for the illegal immigrant adult smuggler or criminal using an unaccompanied child to get in? What if they are a pedophile or a child trafficker? Still want them to stay together with the child? Or do you want to take that chance by keeping them together on the off-chance that they are a family?

These people break the law and expect to be looked after. The border needs to be protected and these people do not have a right to be in the country.

[Duchess]

Many of those parents went about it the right way. It's not illegal to seek asylum and they had their kids taken anyway.

They put their kids through the journey because they want a better life for them. They don't undertake that lightly, many of them risk their lives.

[Fry Guy]

Not if they come through the correct ports of entry.
Many of them are not even parents. Many of them are smugglers and child traffickers. Should they be kept with children they claim as their own? Is that safe and how would you protect these children?
Also how many of the world's population has a right to asylum and how many can claim refugee status without the checks in place? Please take into account that many of these people ARE "economic refugees" wanting to move to the US to make a better more prosperous live for themselves, NOT fleeing violence, war or imminent harm. How much of the world's population could also say that US provides THEM with better chances of economic success than they have at home. Start in SouthEast Asia make your way to the Middle East and then Down to Africa. Post the numbers. Once you have this down, Try China, Russia, North Korea and the East European countries.

The did not even come in the right ports of entry.

[Maggot]

What bugs me is when a judge lets an illegal go on bail after he was convicted of selling heroin or committing a crime. There is a judge in Mass with the name of Timothy Feeley that does it all the time. It's infuriating, the last stupid thing he did was let loose a dealer that was an illegal because he was just trying to "make money" .......Really?

Idiot judge

[Blindgreed1]

As a parent I find it absolutely the height of disgraceful that parent subject their children to this.
There is systems in place and legal ports of entry and yet they sneak themselves and their children in and risk their children dying and/or being raped and abused by human "coyotes".

There is a system in place to become a legal citizen of the US. There is a system in place to become a refugee (it involves going in through the legal ports of entry and claiming asylum). Which do these guys choose and expose their children to? What choice do they make?

The President and the Administration of the US has NO obligation to accept immigrants of either gender and of any age coming into their country. They DO NOT OWE them.

Whilst we can make the case for the poor children separated from their parents, okay are you ALSO going to make the case for the illegal immigrant adult smuggler or criminal using an unaccompanied child to get in? What if they are a pedophile or a child trafficker? Still want them to stay together with the child? Or do you want to take that chance by keeping them together on the off-chance that they are a family?

These people break the law and expect to be looked after. The border needs to be protected and these people do not have a right to be in the country.

This guy get's it.

[Duchess]

Could you elaborate a little and tell us exactly what some people aren't getting?

[Fry Guy]

Absolutely. Part of the problems with these kinds of debates is that they are political and politicised and so facts are lost in the soundbytes and talking points. It is not ever about being correct, it is about winning and being right. Right is not necessarily correct or even factual. Being in the right side or being morally right is seen often as being better than being truthful.

So nasty xenophobic Trump wants to build a wall and keep out illegal immigrants.
See, I am an Aussie. When he went on a tear saying shit like "They're rapist, They're murders, They're drug dealers and some are I assume good people" It was fucking word salad. None of that makes any sense. Obviously not all of them were rapist, murderers or drug dealers being he assumes some are good people and you can't be good people if you are any one of those things. So there was that and there was also in the same stream of consciousness he said They are "sending them". Who? Who in Mexico is"sending them". I had no idea.

What did I do? I looked up rapists, murderers, drug dealers, border US and Mexico and various combinations of these words in Google. Did I get an education and this is the kind of stuff gore sites will post.

Rape Trees?

https://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/..._n_5806972
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...sings.html
https://wgno.com/2018/06/19/state-police...operation/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Migrant_de...tes_border

See I get it. I do. It is nice to paint the mental picture of the nasty Trump who hates Mexicans and the poor downtrodden immigrants just trying to get into US to start a new life and bring their family in to become Americans and make a new life for themselves and contribute to the American Dream and Trump is being an arsehole.

Except. Many of those poor downtrodden men have raped a number of those poor women. Many of those poor families are not families at all and the parents professing love and a want to be kept together with their family was not a family until they were in sight of the border patrol.

Some of the families are not escaping violence but escaping justice.

Here is an example of the narrative hitting the wall https://www.youtube.com/results?search_q...+agent+cnn

So what is to be done? Build that wall. It will not stop everyone. There is always ways and means but it is like saying why lock your door because some burglars will still break in. A wall will mean that there is still going to be legal ports of entry that a desperate refugee can apply and be assessed for asylum status and the legal immigrants applying for a citizenship can still do that but there will be less sneaking over, through or around the border.

Perhaps a way to look at this is to push aside preconceptions and imagine.
You are a middle aged Central American man with a wife and teenage daughter and teenage son and an elderly mother and you make your way to the US border. You get intercepted by Mexican cartel members because you tried to sneak in. They support your efforts. Your Mother was too slow and holding everyone up. She could not keep up and was left to die from exposure in the heat. She did not get to see your wife and teenage daughter getting raped. But you and your son did and were powerless to stop them. Somewhere on some bush is their underwear. But they made it into America the land of opportunity because the border was unprotected.

I think this is evil. I think supporting this kind of thing is something I cannot support. A nation should protect its borders and close down or reduce this kind of predatory behaviour if they can. It is a moral imperative and openly supporting open borders and seeking to reduce the role of border patrol agents and the like is close on evil.

Edit: Trump DOES say a lot of really stupid crap. Some of his ideas really do not rate with me. Anti-vaccination? Birtherism? Yep some stuff is stupid. This isn't. I think it is moral.