NEGOTIATING WITH TERRORISTS

[Duchess]

Other countries negotiate with terrorists and get their kidnapped people back. Should America have that policy? Should we be paying a ransom?

[Cutz]

depends. Do the terrorists want a kit kat bar? I'm not giving nukes to North Korea for some 20 year old blond girl that went there for vacation or to learn about herself and life.

[HairOfTheDog]

I don't think we should negotiate because there's proof that it only encourages future kidnappings and higher ransoms.

I saved a NY Times article about it from a few weeks back -- good detailed report.

Some extracts:

Since 2008
-$91.5 million has been paid to Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb in exchange for the release of French, Swiss, Austrian, and Canadian tourists.

-$5.1 million has been paid to the Shabab for the return of Spanish tourists.

-$29.9 million has been paid to Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula for the return of French, Finnish, Austrian, and Swiss tourists.

“Kidnapping for ransom has become today’s most significant source of terrorist financing,” said David S. Cohen, the Treasury Department’s under secretary for terrorism and financial intelligence, in a 2012 speech. “Each transaction encourages another transaction.”

And business is booming: While in 2003 the kidnappers received around $200,000 per hostage, now they are netting up to $10 million, money that the second in command of Al Qaeda’s central leadership recently described as accounting for as much as half of his operating revenue.

“Kidnapping hostages is an easy spoil,” wrote Nasser al-Wuhayshi, the leader of Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, “which I may describe as a profitable trade and a precious treasure.”

The stream of income generated is so significant that internal documents show that as long as five years ago, Al Qaeda’s central command in Pakistan was overseeing negotiations for hostages grabbed as far afield as Africa. Moreover, the accounts of survivors held thousands of miles apart show that the three main affiliates of the terrorist group — Al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb, in northern Africa; Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, in Yemen; and the Shabab, in Somalia — are coordinating their efforts and abiding by a common kidnapping protocol.

According to the report, the governments of the United States and Britain do not pay ransoms to terrorists and advise other countries to refrain from doing so. That policy appears to work in terms of deterring terrorist groups from targeting American and English tourists -- the groups are well aware of which countries will and won't pay. However, it's not a popular policy with some of the loved ones of kidnapped tourists. In 2009 a British man, Edward Dyer, was kidnapped by Al Qaeda in Mali, along with a German woman and a Swiss couple. Ransom was paid for the other three hostage and they were freed. But, the British government refused to negotiate with terrorists for the release of Dyer and he was killed. Mr. Dyer’s grieving brother, Hans, said his brother’s citizenship had cost him his life. “A U.K. passport is essentially a death certificate,” he said.

Story: http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/30/world/...t_now&_r=1
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I don't think the US government could stop a family or business from negotiating, but don't feel that the US government should engage in it (no matter how badly we would all like to save the hostages).

I'm all for Special Ops rescue attempts, though -- and those ain't cheap.

[Cutz]

You know what... I'm all for negotiating. On equal terms. If we want a combatant back, we give them a combatant. If we want an innocent back... we give them an innocent. Of course this will require kidnapping and torture of terrorist's families... but hey, I'm all for compromises.

[Maggot]

Other countries negotiate with terrorists and get their kidnapped people back. Should America have that policy? Should we be paying a ransom?

Not no but hell no!

[Duchess]

I don't think we should be paying ransom for people who are taken. I was curious how other Americans felt about it. Apparently Jim Foly's brother was interviewed and while he prefaced that he really shouldn't be getting into this he proceeded to say he thought our government could have done more to get his brother back.

I'm horrified they cut that poor man's head off. It made me sad & mad and to further read he had been tortured for months after the terrorists found pix of his brother who serves with the Air Force was awful. At one point they crucified him BUT Jim Foley knew the risks, he had already been taken once before.

I think ISIS knew they were going to kill him. They asked for something like $132 million. They aren't stupid, they knew they would never see that kind of money.

[Carsman]

The whole world now knows Jim Foly's name, his life had meaning (it was not in vain) and he has left his mark. He will be remembered for a long time to come, and even probably make it into our history books for future generations to know of his name.

[Duchess]

Makes me long for the good ol' days of the Taliban.

[Mohammed]

Once the Qatar embassy here started to give 3 million US$ per victim, first the Swiss woman, after that the Austrian and 2 Fins, people started to look at me very differently.

If somebody would offer that kind of cash for any blacks in Germany, I swear there wouldn't be anymore left by now.

[Duchess]

Once the Qatar embassy here started to give 3 million US$ per victim, first the Swiss woman, after that the Austrian and 2 Fins, people started to look at me very differently.

So you think it's a bad idea to pay a ransom for hostages?

Mo, have the people there heard of Jim Foley. I'm not sure why I even ask, I know the people there have their own issues with trying to stay safe and probably don't have time to be thinking about others who have been kidnapped.

[Mohammed]

Yes, it's a very bad idea. Try this. You wrap yourself up with 500k, then go for a walk thru LA, New York, or pretty much anywhere really.

Now it's not enough that you got all that cash strapped on you, but you make sure you announce it everywhere you go. See what will happen. Not only that, make it 6 times that much and it becomes just plain silly.

Yep, we sure get the news here as well. I guess the poor guy is another one who was at the wrong place at the wrong time, ending up with a bunch of motherfuckers, one of them apparently a British rapper. Our world is sure a crazy place.

[HairOfTheDog]

AMERICAN JOURNALIST RELEASED FROM AL-NUSRAH IN SYRIA TO QATAR OFFICIALS

Peter Theo Curtis was born in Atlana, GA and went to school in Vermont.

Curtis is an author and freelance reporter who writes under the name Theo Padnos. He contributed articles about the Middle East to various publications, including the New Republic, The Huffington Post and the London Review of Books.

Curtis has also published two books: "My Life Had Stood a Loaded Gun," a memoir about teaching literature to young offenders at a correctional facility in Vermont, and "Undercover Muslim: A Journey into Yemen," which investigates Islamic extremism.

Curtis was captured by rebel/terrorist/militant (depends on who's doing the reporting as to what these groups are labeled) group al-Nusrah in Syria two years ago. His mother has been working to gain his release. She sought the help of officials in Qatar. A week after the video depicting an IS jihadist beheading American journalist James Foley in Syria, Qatar brokered the release of Curtis. He was freed on Sunday in Israeli territory (Golan Heights, at the Syrian border).

Anyway, glad he's home safely. Here's his first brief statement.

Story: http://edition.cnn.com/2014/08/27/world/...?hpt=hp_t3

Curtis' family, Qatari officials, and US officials insist that no ransom was provided in the negotiations.

No details as to the release negotiations have been provided. It's just my opinion that Curtis was released shortly after the Foley execution because it benefits al-Nusrah; positioning themselves as legitimate and rational as compared to IS. Al-Nusrah is a Qaeda-linked group and they've been battling it out with IS in Syria as part of the ongoing rebel/terrorist in-fighting.

[Cheyne]

AMERICAN JOURNALIST RELEASED FROM AL-NUSRAH IN SYRIA TO QATAR OFFICIALS
~respectfully snipped~

No details as to the release negotiations have been provided. It's just my opinion that Curtis was released shortly after the Foley execution because it benefits al-Nusrah; positioning themselves as legitimate and rational as compared to IS. Al-Nusrah is a Qaeda-linked group and they've been battling it out with IS in Syria as part of the ongoing rebel/terrorist in-fighting.

You may be right HotD. The news is that the US may start a bombing campaign in Syria to root-out IS there. Perhaps these terrorists (Al-Nusrah) are looking to ally themselves to the US temporarily to get some good ol' US guns and stuff. Or at least not be bombed to oblivion.

[sharit]

Seen a bumper sticker here in Illinois that said ISIS, also had 2 Obama bumper stickers. True story!

[HairOfTheDog]

HOSTAGE RESCUE ATTEMPT IN YEMEN

The U.S. refused to negotiate with Yemeni terrorists for the release of two hostages and instead launched a rescue operation in partnership with the Yemeni government. Unfortunately, both hostages died. Doesn't seem like our special ops have been successful in rescuing hostages much lately.

Snip:
An American photojournalist and a South African teacher held by al-Qaida militants in Yemen were killed Saturday during a U.S.-led rescue operation that President Barack Obama said he ordered because of "imminent danger" to the U.S. hostage.

U.S. officials believe the militants shot the two men during a firefight, and that both were alive when American forces pulled them from a building on the group's compound and put them on aircraft, where medical teams operated on them during a short flight to the USS Makin Island, a Navy ship in the region.


^ South African hostage Pierre Korkie is believed to have died during the flight.


^ American hostage Luke Somers died on the ship.

About 40 U.S. special operations forces were part of the mission, according to the U.S. officials. The rescuers, backed by Yemeni ground forces, got within 100 meters of the compound in southern Shabwa province when they were spotted by the militants, and the skirmish ensued.

Yemen's highest security body, the Supreme Security Committee, issued a rare statement acknowledging that the country's forces had carried out the raid with "American friends." The committee said all the militants who were holding the hostages were killed in the operation.

Refs:
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/07/world/....html?_r=0
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/12/06...80288.html

RIP Pierre Korkie and Luke Somers.

[Duchess]

Richard Engel spoke about this, this morning. Him & his crew were kidnapped in Syria a year ago and he didn't know if they would be killed or not. He hoped that if their death was imminent that a rescue would have been attempted even at the cost of their lives. He went on to talk about the risks and that anyone working there is well aware of them.

I'll never be that brave.

[HairOfTheDog]

NEW U.S. POLICY ALLOWS NEGOTIATING WITH TERRORISTS

The White House will release on Wednesday a presidential directive and an executive order that will allow the government to communicate and negotiate with terrorist groups holding Americans hostage.

Officials will now be allowed to talk to those terror groups and discuss ways to secure the Americans' release, though the government will maintain its policy of not making "substantive concessions" to captors.

While the government won't pay ransoms, the White House will announce that officials will no longer threaten with criminal prosecution the families of American hostages looking to pay ransoms to their relatives' captors, according to a senior administration official.

President Barack Obama will meet Wednesday with the families of American hostages at the White House before delivering remarks at 12:20 p.m. to announce changes in the administration's hostage policy.

The payment of ransoms to terror groups has long been tolerated in many instances, though it is technically illegal. The administration has looked the other way when families of Americans held overseas have paid ransoms.

But several families -- including the family of James Foley -- have said they were threatened with prosecution as they considered making ransom payments. A member of the National Security Council staff had threatened Foley's family with prosecution during their ordeal.

On Wednesday, the White House will explicitly indicate that families should not fear criminal prosecution if they choose to make ransom payments. The new directive will not include a formal change to existing laws and the longstanding policy against government concessions to hostage takers -- including ransom payments -- will be reiterated.

House Speaker John Boehner on Wednesday said he feared the erosion of the U.S.'s policy of not paying ransoms and the principle of not negotiating with terrorists.

Full Story: http://edition.cnn.com/2015/06/23/politi...index.html
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Though I feel terribly for hostages and their families, I share Boehner's concern.

[BlueTiki]

Honestly, I don't understand the "radical" shift with this new policy.

I think it's odd they used the word "cell" (creating a Fusion Cell) as this is a term used primarily for terrorist identification.

I believe, this is another attempt to appear to be doing something that will neither prevent future hostage taking nor facilitate a quicker release . . . again, the illusion of addressing a problem.

Or maybe it's an out to limit committing troops to rescue hostages and puts the onus on the families of the captured to secure release?

[Jimbone]

This is a bad idea on so many levels.

So now our policy is that we still are not negotiating with terrorists.

Unless of course the family does.

And then we still don't like it.

But we won't do anything about it.

More foreign policy coherence from the geniuses in Washington DC.

[Duchess]

I don't like it either but what the hell are you going to do when a mother or father is trying to save their child from those savages. Throw the book at 'em?