ANOTHER PLANE CRASH

[blueberryhill]

Sorry for the double post, but just heard bits and pieces of the conversations on flight recorder. Captain said he didn't have time to go to bathroom in Barcelona, so his co pilot said "go ahead." Captain's chair could be heard moving back and he said "you take over." Captain is heard banging on door and shouting, "for God's sake, open the door," and loud noises as he kept pounding on the door and then, of course, the screams of the passengers were heard as they, too, were able to hear cockpit warnings which warned of a too fast descent, and of course, were heading for terrain....it is heartbreaking. Apparently this was leaked and wasn't supposed to be released to public.

[username]

I haven't looked for it but I've heard copies of the recording have been leaked and officials are pretty pissed off about that. Some are saying those passengers may have suffered a full 8 minutes of terror knowing something was going horribly wrong. That hasn't been confirmed but earlier on, they said the captain was locked out about 10 minutes before the crash so I'm afraid that's probably accurate.

ETA: I wouldn't have been able to listen to it if I found it but it didn't come up on a quick search. Apparently, however, the "officials" are even irritated that transcripts have been released.

[HairOfTheDog]

On news, heard about history of anxiety and depression of co-pilot, and that he received injections of anti-psychotic medication back in 2010, so this seems to affirm his mental health issues.

It's now been confirmed that Lubitz's medical records note that he had received extensive psychotherapy and possessed "suicidal tendencies" before he received his pilot's license.
Source: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/30...68616.html

If someone's been diagnosed with severe depression and/or mental illness and you aren't constantly monitoring to ensure that he's taking his meds, you don't let him get behind the controls of an airplane packed with hundreds of passengers any more than you'd hand him a loaded gun on the way to the mall. That's not discrimination, that's common sense.

So, now the question is did Lufthansa have this information before they hired him and trust Lubitz to monitor his own condition, or were they uninformed due to oversight or legal doctor confidentiality restrictions?

Wouldn't anti-psychotics have shown up in his physical examination conducted by the airline -- surely that involves a tox screen?

[blueberryhill]

On news, heard about history of anxiety and depression of co-pilot, and that he received injections of anti-psychotic medication back in 2010, so this seems to affirm his mental health issues.

It's now been confirmed that Lubitz's medical records note that he had received extensive psychotherapy and possessed "suicidal tendencies" before he received his pilot's license.
Source: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/30...68616.html

If someone's been diagnosed with severe depression and/or mental illness and you aren't constantly monitoring to ensure that he's taking his meds, don't put him behinds the controls of an airplane packed with hundreds of passengers any more than you'd hand him a loaded gun on the way to the mall. That's not discrimination, that's common sense.

So, now the question is did Lufthansa have this information before they hired him and trust Lubitz to monitor his own condition, or were they uninformed due to oversight or legal doctor confidentiality restrictions?

Wouldn't anti-psychotics have shown up in his physical examination conducted by the airline -- surely that involves a tox screen?

It is mind boggling to think that the Doctor who was giving meds and treatment to Lubitz, failed to communicate this to the airline. Did Lubitz hide his profession and seek out of town mental health treatment (so he wouldn't lose job)? There were people out there who knew something was "off" about this guy, and yet Management never heard a peep. Very strange. In any case, it does beg the question of why isn't more emphasis placed on the mental health of professionals who are responsible for the lives of others. I realize that Physicians are not trained Psychiatrists, but they should be able to see some sign of severe depression and psychotic behavior if they meet with pilots every 6 months for routine physical exam. In any case, I think this might over-ride any maximum amount of liability on part of airline. This was the result of negligence of the doctor and the airline....Apparently there was never a tox screen done at time of his physical, but again I don't know the timing here or how long the drug would stay in his body, Somewhere I read that he took some kind of leave and there was a break in his flying career. Maybe, it was then that he was seeking active treatment, i.e,, injections of anti-psychotic drugs, etc.. (2010). We could then conclude that he hadn't been taking his meds, and thus he carried out his suicide proclivities on day of crash.
To me, if some Doctor told him he was unfit for duty the day of the doomed flight, and failed to notify the airline, then he/she bears much of the responsibility also, IMO. I think next time I fly, I am going to download a short psychological questionnaire and ask both pilots to please complete and return to me ASAP.

[Carsman]

Curious as to what are they looking for so intensely? Passengers are dust, plane rubble is fragmented in small pieces, clothes somewhat in tact, OK. Since they already found the black box and ascertained the exact cause of the crash, there is no mystery of why the crash. So seems like they're risking those searchers lives for no good reason. Are they going to "clean up" all the debris?

[Duchess]

They are collecting remains and identifying passengers through DNA.

[Jimbone]

Completely horrendous...

"Bild said the authenticity of the video is unquestionable, but said the scene on board is chaotic, "totally blurred and no individuals can be identified." The newspaper said the video was recorded in the rear of the plane, but could not determine whether the cellphone owner was sitting or standing.

It is also not known whether a passenger or crewmember made the recording.

"Just before the end of the video, the aircraft seems to be touching a mountain," Bild said. "It looks like the cabin gets blown to the side. Once again you can hear people cry — then the video ends."


http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world.../70726960/

[FAHQTOO]

I believe there are 2 black boxes. They are still looking for the other one.

[Midwest Spy]

Sounds like the descent was a nightmare.

Those that have flown a lot are used to a gradual descent. I also have been on planes where the pilot is trying to make up time and you come in nose down for quite awhile.

I think this would've been like that last scenario X 2.

Passengers would've immediately wondered what the hell was going on and then seeing the pilot trying to break down the door, it would've been absolute hysterics for everyone.

I feel horrible for everyone but I really feel sick to my stomach for the parents of the high school kids. Knowing their children were calling out to them in those final moments just makes me want to cry.

[blueberryhill]

[/quote]

from cars

Curious as to what are they looking for so intensely? Passengers are dust, plane rubble is fragmented in small pieces, clothes somewhat in tact, OK. Since they already found the black box and ascertained the exact cause of the crash, there is no mystery of why the crash. So seems like they're risking those searchers lives for no good reason. Are they going to "clean up" all the debris?
[/quote]

I would think there would be bone fragments and human tissue which they need for DNA purposes and the normal respect given for human remains.

[Duchess]

You just know most people boarding flights these days have given this crash a little thought. Everyone weighs their chances and thinks it will never happen to them.

[Jimbone]

You just know most people boarding flights these days have given this crash a little thought. Everyone weighs their chances and thinks it will never happen to them.

I flew on an A320 within days of the crash. I absolutely thought about it.

[HairOfTheDog]

Somewhere I read that he took some kind of leave and there was a break in his flying career. Maybe, it was then that he was seeking active treatment, i.e,, injections of anti-psychotic drugs, etc.. (2010).

During his press conference last week, the CEO of Lufthansa noted that Lubitz had taken 6 months break in his training back in 2008.

Mr. Spohr said that he didn't know why Lubitz had taken a leave, that it wasn't unusual for pilots-in-training to do so, and that he did not know the purpose for Lubitz taking a leave.

Today, Lufthansa confirmed that as part of its internal research it found emails Lubitz sent to the Lufthansa flight school in Bremen when he resumed his training. In the emails, Lubitz informed the school that he had suffered a 'serious depressive episode' which had since subsided.

I'd be surprised if Mr. Spohr wasn't aware of that information within hours of the crash. But, I guess it doesn't make much of a difference.

The Germanwings division of Lufthansa has set aside a large sum to assist the families of Lubitz's victims. With this latest revelation, Germanwings will quite likely be facing a slew of civil suits. I think the airline may go under fairly quickly, if it isn't essentially OOB already.

P.s. Despite the fact that his live-in girlfriend and medical records confirm Lubitz desperately feared losing his eyesight and therefore his career (most likely a psychosomatic condition) and the voice data and flight records clearly indicate that Lubitz sabotaged the plane, the conspiracy folks are in high gear on this one. The current most popular conspiracy theory seems to be that Lubitz is being framed by Lufthansa to conceal the fact that mechanical problems caused the crash.

[blueberryhill]

Somewhere I read that he took some kind of leave and there was a break in his flying career. Maybe, it was then that he was seeking active treatment, i.e,, injections of anti-psychotic drugs, etc.. (2010).

During his press conference last week, the CEO of Lufthansa noted that Lubitz had taken 6 months break in his training back in 2008.

Mr. Spohr said that he didn't know why Lubitz had taken a leave, that it wasn't unusual for pilots-in-training to do so, and that he did not know the purpose for Lubitz taking a leave.

Today, Lufthansa confirmed that as part of its internal research it found emails Lubitz sent to the Lufthansa flight school in Bremen when he resumed his training. In the emails, Lubitz informed the school that he had suffered a 'serious depressive episode' which had since subsided.

I'd be surprised if Mr. Spohr wasn't aware of that information within hours of the crash. But, I guess it doesn't make much of a difference.

The Germanwings division of Lufthansa has set aside a large sum to assist the families of Lubitz's victims. With this latest revelation, Germanwings will quite likely be facing a slew of civil suits. I think the airline may go under fairly quickly, if it isn't essentially OOB already.

P.s. Despite the fact that his live-in girlfriend and medical records confirm Lubitz desperately feared losing his eyesight and therefore his career (most likely a psychosomatic condition) and the voice data and flight records clearly indicate that Lubitz sabotaged the plane, the conspiracy folks are in high gear on this one. The current most popular conspiracy theory seems to be that Lubitz is being framed by Lufthansa to conceal the fact that mechanical problems caused the crash.

I know family members were given approx $52,000 for immediate expenses, but then I read today that insurance company for airline is setting aside around $300,000 to cover lawsuits, etc. resulting from the crash. There are always those morons who think it is something it is not, they aren't the brightest tree in the forest. Those same people think Obama is scheming with IS to overtake the World and turn everyone into Muslims....(the extreme, fanatical ones).

[Carsman]

You just know most people boarding flights these days have given this crash a little thought. Everyone weighs their chances and thinks it will never happen to them.

Just booked flight back North today, it's going to be a long 6 weeks waiting for it to take place.

[Carsman]

They are collecting remains and identifying passengers through DNA.

Right, DNA identifying dust, to what end, families know all passengers are gone. Do they really need it confirmed? But that's just me.

[Blindgreed1]

They are collecting remains and identifying passengers through DNA.

Right, DNA identifying dust, to what end, families know all passengers are gone. Do they really need it confirmed? But that's just me.

You can use a single hair to identify someone by DNA cars and yes, I believe its necessary considering some may not know if their family/loved ones were on the flight or not. It's called closure.

[Jimbone]

You can use a single hair to identify someone by DNA cars and yes, I believe its necessary considering some may not know if their family/loved ones were on the flight or not. It's called closure.

Also it's likely necessary for insurance claims to pay out...

[HairOfTheDog]

Right, DNA identifying dust, to what end, families know all passengers are gone. Do they really need it confirmed? But that's just me.

I know what you mean. I thought about that too. Authorities and loved ones know exactly who was on the plane that day. There are no questions in that regard. And, there's no chance that anyone involved in a crash of that severity could have survived.

I think maybe it needs to be done as a matter of procedural requirement and consistency. In some high impact accidents where there aren't ticket records or boarding videos of the passengers to confirm identity, the DNA identification process would be key for notifying next of kin, declaring death, issuing a death certificate, etc...

It's also possible some of the families might want even the smallest of remains (after they're tested) for burial or some other memorial purpose.

P.s. I read that medical examiners hope to be able to determine from his remains what was in Lubitz's system. Sounds like a long-shot to me, but who knows?

[Blindgreed1]

You can use a single hair to identify someone by DNA cars and yes, I believe its necessary considering some may not know if their family/loved ones were on the flight or not. It's called closure.

Also it's likely necessary for insurance claims to pay out...

Yup.