BY GOD, IT'S MY RIGHT TO DISCRIMINATE AGAINST YOU!

[blueberryhill]

It's a confusing story, blueberry.

Alumni, as opposed to current students, were reportedly the ones to first see the Facebook post and start the protest against Mrs. Jannuzzi. One of them is related to Susan Sarandon, who also chimed in.

I just found an update to the story; looks like Mrs. Jannuzzi has been reinstated, with stipulations about the tone of her public statements.

The school and religious leaders went back and forth, eventually deciding that while her views posted on Facebook were not against their standards, the tone was.

Here's the latest story with more details: http://www.mycentraljersey.com/story/new.../25587809/

Thanks for some clarification....I do think, that instead of the news media blowing these cases way out of proportion, there are enough injustices in the USA and other countries to keep us busy. I spoke a little harshly to a friend who constantly sends me crap on how we all have to arm ourselves to protect us from the Gov't....I wrote back to her and asked her who was going to protect me from her....and other stuff....she also says we are becoming a 3^rd world country....she immigrated here from England in the 50's and is an old flying buddy, but she is definitely into tea parties....and other preachy stuff...All I ever asked, is that she just stop sending me all this crap and we will be fine....we have hungry kids here, and we feed children from other countries...maybe that is propaganda as "they" say that food meant for needy folks is intercepted by some kind of terrorist somewhere.....Kids die every day from loaded weapons and child abuse.....as i said we should all be more concerned with building more dang prisons instead of freeing all these killers after they serve 15 years in prison and are released to kill again and again....People who were arrested for selling pot get longer jail sentences than rapists, child killers, etc..... You see there is a still a lot to worry about....Can we just give the gay issue a rest and continue to treat others as we would want to be treated. I have no energy left today......and if we don't start fixing the nation's highways and bridges, we are all going to drop into some giant pothole never to be seen again.....Well thanks, Hair, for listening....

[ZEROSPHERES]

[blueberryhill]

Back at ya, Zero!

[ZEROSPHERES]

Back at ya, Zero!

Love ya, BBH

[HairOfTheDog]

You see there is a still a lot to worry about....Can we just give the gay issue a rest and continue to treat others as we would want to be treated.

There will always be a lot of important social issues for civic-minded people to worry about simultaneously, that's true.

I think continuous improvement is inherent in developed societies, though one group's "improvement" is often another's "set back". Sometimes it seems to me that free speech is being quashed or restricted in the process these days - when that speech conflicts with what's perceived as the politically correct stance. That bothers me a little at times, but there's always a choice to speak out (even if there's backlash) or stay quiet.

Anyway, the gay community has been speaking out -- loudly and constantly -- for a very long time. They've made large strides in their quest for equal rights over the last few years. It's not a minor issue for them and I don't think they would consider giving it a rest when they're on a roll and they still have a long way to go. They're gonna keep fighting for the rights to live, marry, and receive marital benefits anywhere in the country, equal to heterosexuals. The gay rights movement, IMO, doesn't take away from other important simultaneous movements towards minimizing child abuse, ending mass unwarranted incarceration, and pushing for road repairs.

But, I agree that it's easy to get overloaded if one attempts to contribute or keep up with every good cause.

[blueberryhill]

You see there is a still a lot to worry about....Can we just give the gay issue a rest and continue to treat others as we would want to be treated.

There will always be a lot of important social issues for civic-minded people to worry about simultaneously, that's true.

I think continuous improvement is inherent in developed societies, though one group's "improvement" is often another's "set back". Sometimes it seems to me that free speech is being quashed or restricted in the process these days - when that speech conflicts with what's perceived as the politically correct stance. That bothers me a little at times, but there's always a choice to speak out (even if there's backlash) or stay quiet.

Anyway, the gay community has been speaking out -- loudly and constantly -- for a very long time. They've made large strides in their quest for equal rights over the last few years. It's not a minor issue for them and I don't think they would consider giving it a rest when they're on a roll and they still have a long way to go. They're gonna keep fighting for the rights to live, marry, and receive marital benefits anywhere in the country, equal to heterosexuals. The gay rights movement, IMO, doesn't take away from other important simultaneous movements towards minimizing child abuse, ending mass unwarranted incarceration, and pushing for road repairs.

But, I agree that it's easy to get overloaded if one attempts to contribute or keep up with every good cause.

i think you should know by now, I will never get off my soapbox when it comes to equality....but sometimes, the media just seems to and I don't want to hear ever minute case of problems caused by being gay, a woman, or another member of a minority group. I am going to let the younger whippersnappers take over for me. However, I will stand up for equality until I take my last breath, but I must give some time to other worries as should the media....they/we need to pick their/our battles. We can't take up each and every case of someone, be it a child, adult, gay, white, black, etc. being treated unfairly because it happens every day, every minute. Rather, we need to continue the bigger battle which is equal rights......for everyone. For example, the prevalence of rogue cops killing citizens (before establishing guilt/innocence)....We can't just change the mindset of the people in Ferguson, MO or in Baltimore, MD....we have to change the mindset of people, period......yes, I know it has to start somewhere, but....gays, women and others are going to be treated unfairly and that is a fact of life. We could better use our energy in educating others that differences aren't really bad, it is the unknown which is bad and causes mistrust and hate. I guess I was just frustrated at this moment on this particular day about all the stories I read every day which speak of unjust and/or unfair treatment, but disposition of these individual cases doesn't resolve the basic, original problem. For example, a child commits suicide due to bullying, the media reports it, we talk about it here on Mock and agree it is terrible and needs to stop, but it doesn't stop.....All of these societal problems are related in that we can prevent and perhaps in future can reduce occurrences by education, grass roots organizations, etc. I have signed a bunch of petitions lately. Paper wars can and do work. I recall when I worked for Department of Army during Vietnam war. I lost neighbors and friends in that war. I happened to work at at Correctional training facility at Ft Riley, Ks. The prisoners there were young men who had gone AWOL and/or deserted the Army because they did not want to go to Vietnam...My job was to correspond with Congressmen re complaints made on behalf of these young men (all men). I wore a bracelet in honor of MIA in Vietnam. In the weekly Ft Riley newsletter, the CG, had talked about giving support to those missing in action and writing to Hoichi min. I took a petition around the office and asked approximately 100 civilian employees to sign this petition in the hopes of putting pressure on North Vietnam. Do you know that not one of those fuckers would sign the petition....I did, as did many residents of the military community, and when the prisoners were finally released in 72, 73, it was, in large part, due to pressure put on North Vietnam due to all the letters received from civilians at Fort Riley, Kansas and other military bases and civilians all over the US. Today, i think the media sometimes harms the cause more than helps because they so want to "stir the pot." Ft Riley housed the "Big Red One." We have to continue supporting those lawmakers who believe in equality and sort out the good ole' boys who just need to die off. They have been in Congress for some 100 years (just kidding Sally and FQ2). Why oh why, don't we insist as constituents that there should be term limits. No, we can't change people's minds overnight, but we can sure try to educate people and try to dissipate old wives' tales which results in misinformation, misunderstandings,bickering, etc....We don't all have to agree, but if we can't someday reach a goal where everyone is treated equally, then we shouldn't even be called humans....With all that being said (and then some), in our "fight" for equal rights, we sure don't want to fall into some gigantic hole in the road and disappear from this planet so let's go ahead and legalize pot in every state so that have the dang money to fix all the roads and to um.....feed the poor. Some of you will think that means people who are getting handouts from Government, but i think every society, even primitive cultures take care of the needy and hungry. It is just a thing that most human beings do for their fellow man. Some people are down and out through no fault of their own....Some of lost value in our homes, our mutual funds, our stocks, or maybe some of you lost your home to foreclosure, maybe lost a job to downsizing. You can have a Master's degree and still lose your job...we need to work on our compassion maybe...If someone is collecting money from welfare who doesn't deserve it or who is cheating system to get the money, then i am going to get my dander up. Sometimes we judge without knowing the rest of the story....

[HairOfTheDog]

You seem like someone who is sincerely committed to equal rights and vocal about it, blueberry. I think that's cool and agree with you that sometimes mountains get made of molehills on hot topic issues and people can lose perspective.

I don't think that discrimination will ever end either, but it can be reduced.

I hear and read a lot of comments from people who truly don't believe that racial discrimination and systematic injustice exists in America. That sexual orientation is a choice. That transgenders are just self-loathing gays in denial. That if a non-white or female wins the presidency it's not primarily because that candidate is most qualified or perceived to be more committed to improving the diverse society's well being, but instead due his or her gender or skin color... Are they wrong? Well, I don't share their views, but I consider what they have to say and sometimes see something I'd missed previously.

To me, evaluating and discussing individual stories related to those topics can and sometimes does change perspectives over time, which is evidenced by shifting public opinion on those topics (and many others). I see all of those topics being addressed at a macro level now too -- by the Supreme Court, the DOJ, the ACLU, Presidential candidates... In my opinion, there are a few historically significant equal rights movements underway in America right now; it's a very interesting time.

Maybe because I'm not on Facebook or other social media, I don't get bombarded with comments and stories that I don't give a shit about. There are so many media sources and topics being covered at any given time, it's easy for me to pick and choose what I want to read or discuss, even when certain stories are dominating the news.

[blueberryhill]

You seem like someone who is sincerely committed to equal rights and vocal about it, blueberry. I think that's cool and agree with you that sometimes mountains get made of molehills on hot topic issues and people can lose perspective.

I don't think that discrimination will ever end either, but it can be reduced.

I hear and read a lot of comments from people who truly don't believe that racial discrimination and systematic injustice exists in America. That sexual orientation is a choice. That transgenders are just self-loathing gays in denial. That if a non-white or female wins the presidency it's not primarily because that candidate is most qualified or perceived to be more committed to improving the diverse society's well being, but instead due his or her gender or skin color... Are they wrong? Well, I don't share their views, but I consider what they have to say and sometimes see something I'd missed previously.

To me, evaluating and discussing individual stories related to those topics can and sometimes does change perspectives over time, which is evidenced by shifting public opinion on those topics (and many others). I see all of those topics being addressed at a macro level now too -- by the Supreme Court, the DOJ, the ACLU, Presidential candidates... In my opinion, there are a few historically significant equal rights movements underway in America right now; it's a very interesting time.

Maybe because I'm not on Facebook or other social media, I don't get bombarded with comments and stories that I don't give a shit about. There are so many media sources and topics being covered at any given time, it's easy for me to pick and choose what I want to read or discuss, even when certain stories are dominating the news.

Oh no, I am not saying it shouldn't be here on Mock. I am thankful that we have you as a resource.....It is never boring here and there should be a diversity of subject matter to encourage debate, pot shots, humor, learning, etc. I wasn't suggesting this stuff shouldn't be posted. Most definitely, it should. The irony of the two stories were just emotionally draining for me....It is like damn if you do and damn if you don't clique. You keep up the good work......Cheers!

[HairOfTheDog]

I didn't think you meant anything about postings on Mock, blueberry. No worries.

[FAHQTOO]

What do you think about Mrs. Jannuzzi's firing, FAHQTOO? (and anybody else)

I strongly disagree with the beliefs she posted on Facebook, but respect her right to express what she feels and don't think she deserved to be fired over it.

Like you, however, I support private businesses' and organizations' right to terminate employment for conduct that violates their standards.

It's interesting to me how religious organizations are struggling with gay issues these days. There's no consistent stance even within the same religion, as far as I can see. At present, a gay teacher is being pushed out of a Catholic School for being engaged to another gay male, meanwhile a straight teacher in a different city is being pushed out of a job at a Catholic School for condemning gay marriage.

She has her right to free speech and just like everyone else, there could be consequences. I don't believe she should have been fired over it. They asked her to delete her facebook account and she did. That should be case closed, but it never is. Also, I believe it's legal for employers to fire people for some of the stuff they put on FB and also to ask for their passwords. Of course, me being me, I would tell them to fuck off...and then they can fire me. I think neither one of them has on ounce of common sense to share between them. She should have thought twice before posting that, and he gets a job with the Catholics knowing he's gay.

[blueberryhill]

I made promise to myself, just to keep my lip zipped for now.....I could go and on, but you all have heard it so many times so will just be quiet for now..

[blueberryhill]

I have been on here quite a bit in past week or so, and promise it is temporary while I am doing the 3 week heart monitor thingy...It is not that i can't go out, but i have to carry monitor around even though sensor is around my neck so it is a little awkward; doesn't work in the purse so i just have to carry this beeping, flashing monitor around with no way to attach it to me....so that is why I am posting so much...I should be packing, cleaning, etc., but you know how that is...
Just remember this is a temporary thing......

[HairOfTheDog]

I made promise to myself, just to keep my lip zipped for now.....I could go and on, but you all have heard it so many times so will just be quiet for now..

I hope you come unzipped soon enough.

I like reading your posts and shooting the shit with you.

[blueberryhill]

Back at ya, Zero!

Love ya, BBH

Aw......i love you, too, Zero!

[HairOfTheDog]

What do you think about Mrs. Jannuzzi's firing, FAHQTOO? (and anybody else)

She has her right to free speech and just like everyone else, there could be consequences. I don't believe she should have been fired over it. They asked her to delete her facebook account and she did. That should be case closed, but it never is. Also, I believe it's legal for employers to fire people for some of the stuff they put on FB and also to ask for their passwords. Of course, me being me, I would tell them to fuck off...and then they can fire me. I think neither one of them has on ounce of common sense to share between them. She should have thought twice before posting that, and he gets a job with the Catholics knowing he's gay.

My nephew was applying for teaching jobs about 2 years ago when I went to visit for a few days. He was deleting all kinds of posts and party pics from his Facebook.

Before then, I'd never really considered how having all of that personal info for everyone to see could not only get someone in trouble with their employer, but also keep them for getting jobs in the first place. He told me it was very common for schools to gauge prospective teachers that way.

It makes good business sense, I guess (but if I had a personal FB page, I'd tell anyone who demanded my password to fuck off too).

[blueberryhill]

What do you think about Mrs. Jannuzzi's firing, FAHQTOO? (and anybody else)

I strongly disagree with the beliefs she posted on Facebook, but respect her right to express what she feels and don't think she deserved to be fired over it.

Like you, however, I support private businesses' and organizations' right to terminate employment for conduct that violates their standards.

It's interesting to me how religious organizations are struggling with gay issues these days. There's no consistent stance even within the same religion, as far as I can see. At present, a gay teacher is being pushed out of a Catholic School for being engaged to another gay male, meanwhile a straight teacher in a different city is being pushed out of a job at a Catholic School for condemning gay marriage.

She has her right to free speech and just like everyone else, there could be consequences. I don't believe she should have been fired over it. They asked her to delete her facebook account and she did. That should be case closed, but it never is. Also, I believe it's legal for employers to fire people for some of the stuff they put on FB and also to ask for their passwords. Of course, me being me, I would tell them to fuck off...and then they can fire me. I think neither one of them has on ounce of common sense to share between them. She should have thought twice before posting that, and he gets a job with the Catholics knowing he's gay.

Surprise, surprise....I do agree with you on one of your statements above, FQ2, i.e., employers having right to fire someone over what they write on Facebook....I have seen some vile things on FB and threats made on the life of Obama and people calling he and his family monkeys, they call Michelle a tranny and other insults....it goes way beyond a disagreement of politics, it is very evident, that is a race thing in all of its glory, right there for everyone to read. If they were my employee, they would be fired on the spot..You can look at someone's profile page, because your name and picture is right there for everyone to see.....and when you look these people up, you see that they work maybe in the Motor Vehicle Depart (just using this as example) and they are saying really nasty race related things...Would Dept of Vehicles want one of their employees on line making those statements public.....or any business, if you get my drift. One guy had a Confederate flag for his profile picture, and he suggested that someone "take care" of Obama with a wink on his part....Other posters threatened to report them to their employers.....I, of course, would never do that...When these sub humans threaten lives, they have crossed a line and deserve to lose their job and maybe go to jail for threatening a life. Oh, and just one last comment re you saying guy should not have applied for job at Catholic school since he was gay. Maybe he just thought he would be in good company and surrounded by others who shared his lifestyle. He just didn't realize there was a double standard. One for Priests and one for teachers....My apologies to the gay teacher for last remark.

[blueberryhill]

O.K. I stuck foot in mouth and I didn't mean to imply that being gay had anything to do with being a pedophile...but is just seems strange that the Church tolerated this "criminal" behavior for so long and yet, can't employ and gay person who emphatically, is not a pedophile. Again, my apologies to the gay community...I, too, am pleased as punch with the new Pope...He is not your traditional Pope like the Priest who told my family that we couldn't step up to altar when my son married into Catholic church... He was so mean....at least, they allowed me to walk down the aisle with my son.....
When society doesn't progress, it becomes stagnant and useless, and I for one, am happy to see the new Pope unwilling to continue with past mistakes....he and the Church are on the right track....so consider myself chastised for the above remarks....

[HairOfTheDog]

WASHINGTON — The Supreme Court sided with a Colorado baker on Monday in a closely watched case pitting gay rights against claims of religious freedom.

Justice Anthony M. Kennedy, writing for the majority in the 7-2 decision, relied on narrow grounds, saying a state commission had violated the Constitution’s protection of religious freedom in ruling against the baker, Jack Phillips, who had refused to create a custom wedding cake for a gay couple.

“The neutral and respectful consideration to which Phillips was entitled was compromised here,” Justice Kennedy wrote. “The Civil Rights Commission’s treatment of his case has some elements of a clear and impermissible hostility toward the sincere religious beliefs that motivated his objection.”

The Supreme Court’s decision, which turned on the commission’s asserted hostility to religion, strongly reaffirmed protections for gay rights and left open the possibility that other cases raising similar issues could be decided differently.

“The outcome of cases like this in other circumstances must await further elaboration in the courts,” Justice Kennedy wrote, “all in the context of recognizing that these disputes must be resolved with tolerance, without undue disrespect to sincere religious beliefs, and without subjecting gay persons to indignities when they seek goods and services in an open market.”

Chief Justice John G. Roberts Jr. and Justices Stephen G. Breyer, Samuel A. Alito Jr., Elena Kagan and Neil M. Gorsuch joined the majority opinion. Justice Clarence Thomas voted with the majority but would have adopted broader reasons.

Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg, joined by Justice Sonia Sotomayor, dissented.

Full story: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/04/us/po...Multimedia
----------------------------------------
So, the Supreme Court basically kicked the broad issue down the road and did not lay legal groundwork for lower courts to decide similar cases filed by LGBTQ individuals and couples.

Instead, the Supreme Court ruled that the Colorado baker's religious objections and rationale for refusing services were not properly or seriously considered when the Colorado Civil Rights Commission ruled that the baker had in fact violated the gay couple's civil rights.

[Duchess]

The majority of Americans support same sex marriage so I think that the majority of people looking for baked goods are surely going to choose another bakery to give their money to. That man probably should have just kept his mouth shut and made the goddamn cake cause ain't nobody going to keep him afloat with cake buying now.

[HairOfTheDog]

That man probably should have just kept his mouth shut and made the goddamn cake cause ain't nobody going to keep him afloat with cake buying now.

I don't know. He might get more business than ever for adhering to his 'religious beliefs', considering how many people still view homosexuality as a sin, a crime, a mental derangement...