DEATH TO THE MENTALLY ILL

[Duchess]

Is it okay with you that mentally ill people be put to death for vicious crimes they have committed?

In the heat of the moment I want people to die for the terrible pain they have inflicted on others but as I begin to think about it I realize I'm not exactly comfortable with those who are proven to be mentally ill being put to death. I'm curious to know what you think about it.

[ramseycat]

I think if I were schizophrenic I wound rather die. There is no cure. The side effects from the Meds are awful. As for other people? I don't know. It seems cruel to put them to death. But will they ever be normal? Can they live with what they have done? I don't ever want to be on a jury and have to make that decision.

[Midwest Spy]

If they're locked up and it's a LWOP situation then I'm okay with it.

[Carsman]

Those responsible knowing the history of the mentally ill and not keeping them in a safe place where they can do no harm to others should be put in jail. The mentally ill can't help themselves, those responsible for them can them.

[Duchess]

I think if I were schizophrenic I wound rather die. There is no cure. The side effects from the Meds are awful. As for other people? I don't know. It seems cruel to put them to death. But will they ever be normal? Can they live with what they have done? I don't ever want to be on a jury and have to make that decision.

Whenever I think of the mentally ill my thoughts always move to the mother who drowned all her children in the bathtub. I've only ever felt sorry for her. Her name just came to me, Andrea Yates. I had/have a lot of compassion for her.

[HairOfTheDog]

For me, it depends on the case.

I too believe that Andrea Yates was severely mentally ill (due to postpartum psychosis and depression) when she drowned her children in the tub. She'd been in treatment previously and had reached out for help again and been denied it, instead turning to religious counseling. I think she was telling the truth and thought that God was advising her that she was a terrible mother and that her children would be better off and in a better place with Him. She never denied what she did and pleaded not guilty by reason of insanity. I believe she knew what she was doing, but did not know that it was wrong at the time. I think she belongs in the sanitarium where she resides and seeking the death penalty was not appropriate in her case.

James Holmes, on the other hand, is a different story for me. I believe he is mentally ill. But, I believe he both knew what he was doing, and he knew that it was wrong. He stockpiled weapons and planned for months. He wore ear plugs to drown out the anticipated screaming when he wounded 70 strangers and killed 12 others in a confined public space and then fled the scene. Seeking the death penalty for him was appropriate, in my opinion.

[blueberryhill]

I think if I were schizophrenic I wound rather die. There is no cure. The side effects from the Meds are awful. As for other people? I don't know. It seems cruel to put them to death. But will they ever be normal? Can they live with what they have done? I don't ever want to be on a jury and have to make that decision.

I agree, but as you know, not all schizophrenic patients kill others or harm themselves....Sadly, there are side effects for most drugs, but I think mental health doctors need to make more of an attempt to find the right drug, the right dosage for the individual patient. The biggest concern I see with these patients, is that as soon as they start to feel better, they quit taking their medications...It would certainly be challenging for patient and his/her family...."They" say that a large percentage of the homeless suffer from schizophrenia and/or bipolar disease. Wow, I am so happy everyone here on Mock is normal..

Re Andrea Yates, I think all new mothers at their 6 week after birth check up should be evaluated for postpartum depression before it can develop into a full blown psychosis....This probably isn't practical, but her husband was aware of her weird behavior as was another relative . I am not sure, but think they did bring it to the attention of her doctor.

I just read Hair's post and I agree re A. Yates, but i think Holmes should be locked up forever, because in my opinion, that is worse than an "easy" death....I would though, try to honor the wishes of the victims' families.

[ramseycat]

I didn't have PPD but I cried and cried for a few days when Vincent was about a week old. Everything made me cry. It was hormones but I had no control over it. I have always felt sorry for Andrea Yates. And I have always blamed her husband for what happened.

This Colorado shooter just looks evil. He may be mentally I'll but I think he knew what he was doing and didn't care.

[Maggot]

The evil ones that kill should be donated to science so their brains can be examined.

[username]

My first reaction was "no" but then I think most killers are bat shit crazy (and may well have suffered some diagnosed mental illness at some point in their lives) so to make a blanket statement about the mentally ill...is difficult.

Some states have limitations on the death penalty for the mentally "challenged", those under 18...

I personally don't think it works as a deterrent, I think it costs too much to conduct a death penalty case and it just isn't working so well (California hasn't executed anyone in years because of legal hang-ups). I'd prefer to put killers in general in a death row type environment for life and be done with them. Interestingly, I was reading this morning that some consider the "death row environment", absent the actual implementation of the death penalty, cruel and unusual punishment.

At least the system worked in that Holmes DIDN'T get a not guilty by reason of insanity verdict.

[Duchess]

I'm not opposed to the death penalty in most cases but I do find it very ironic that we, as a society, kill those who are bad seeds because they have killed someone. How does that make us any better than them, because we do it in a more humane way? Again, I'm not disagreeing with the death penalty.

[HairOfTheDog]

I used to support the death penalty fully in cases where there was definitive proof of guilt, intent to kill, no mental illness nor very low IQ, and aggravating factors.

But, as time goes by, I have a harder time supporting it even in those types of cases because it costs so much more time and money for the prosecution and appeal of capital cases. Plus, I don't believe the death penalty deters violent crime/murder at all.

On the other hand, I like that state and federal prosecutors can often negotiate effectively with worst offenders using the death penalty as leverage. Prosecutors can sometimes solve cases and bring closure to victims' families by offering to take it off the table in exchange for a full confession, and/or for information about other unsolved crimes, and/or to elicit guilty pleas to avoid the expense of a trial and appeal altogether... Personally, I like the death penalty more as a bargaining chip for LE than I do as an actual punishment.

As for James Holmes, his crime was the worst of the worst and qualified for the harshest penalty the state had at its disposal. It would have been hard for state leaders to justify even having the death penalty in Colorado if they didn't pursue it in the case of mass-murderer James Holmes (plus most of his victims' families wanted it). I believe he's mentally ill, but he's undoubtedly also very smart and clearly knew what he was doing was wrong/illegal when he killed 12 innocent strangers. It doesn't bother me, however, that he got life without parole instead of death.

[Duchess]

There's something else that bugs me too. I saw it in that twat Jodi's case and I saw it with James' case as well and it's that lone juror who has a problem giving death. It's always been my understanding that jurors are made aware of that factor when they are being chosen for a jury. Am I wrong in thinking that they are aware they can be asked to vote for death? They know it's a very strong possibility and they say they can go for it, yet when the opportunity is there they don't do it. It's because of jurors like them that I find myself more & more agreeable to professional jurors.