Making a Murderer -- DID STEVEN AVERY REALLY KILL TERESA HALBACH?

[Midwest Spy]

LytoMe, please explain as best you can, why Avery would call Teresa's cell using the *67 feature twice, once @ 2:15pm and the second @ 2:30, and then @ 4:45 or so, he called her not using the blocked feature.

[LytoMe]

LytoMe, please explain as best you can, why Avery would call Teresa's cell using the *67 feature twice, once @ 2:15pm and the second @ 2:30, and then @ 4:45 or so, he called her not using the blocked feature.

MY thoughts on these calls don't really draw a red flag, honestly. Because he already scheduled her to come out to the property for a photo. So regardless if he called or not, there was a trail of where she was going to be that day at a specific time. Why he called that why, not sure. But that doesn't say he murdered her.

The call afterwards is the only one I am a little confused about, because this is where all the inconsistencies start. From ALL witnesses. Some who saw her leave the property, some saw her at the property around 3:30 pm. But again still just because these calls were made does not mean he murdered her. Weird, odd YES.

If these boggle you, then what about the Ex-Boyfriend and the brother logging into her phone deleting voicemails and deleting emails? What do you think of that? Deleting something in my opinion if more of a red flag then hiding a telephone number, especially when she was already scheduled to be on the property.

Thoughts?

[Blindgreed1]

I agree with you on this one, I would read the transcript from the February interview of Dassey. It was a VERY interesting find honestly. I have not read anything with the things he stated until today. Like of HOW she could have possibly have been killed, and WHY her blood was in her car.

Her DNA should have been SOMEWHERE, especially since we know for a FACT she was there to take pictures. SO why could they not have found something just on that basis.

And the lack of investigation into ANYONE else on the property or related to Teresa. That boggles my mind.

Humans leave their DNA everywhere and blood gets all over the place as well. Even bleaching it leaves behind traces that can be seen with luminol.

[LytoMe]

I agree with you on this one, I would read the transcript from the February interview of Dassey. It was a VERY interesting find honestly. I have not read anything with the things he stated until today. Like of HOW she could have possibly have been killed, and WHY her blood was in her car.

Humans leave their DNA everywhere and blood gets all over the place as well. Even bleaching it leaves behind traces that can be seen with luminol.

This is where I am TORN, they found NOTHING with her DNA on it in the house or garage. Now you would even think that she would have let DNA on the key, on anything!!

They found her Blood in the trunk of her truck, like she was placed there after the fact. And according to testimony it was a hair like smear. To me means a head injury.

And just to put it out there, I really do not put ANY credit into Dassey or ANYONE from that side of the family.

[Midwest Spy]

LytoMe, the calls, to me, are very incriminating evidence that he was anticipating her arrival.

The last call, meant to establish an alibi IMO, really solidifies it for me.

Circumstantial? Sure, but the fact that no one else sees her after the bus driver eyes her vehicle on the property, leads me to believe he's the one who killed her.

[Blindgreed1]

LytoMe, the calls, to me, are very incriminating evidence that he was anticipating her arrival.

The last call, meant to establish an alibi IMO, really solidifies it for me.

Circumstantial? Sure, but the fact that no one else sees her after the bus driver eyes her vehicle on the property, leads me to believe he's the one who killed her.

So since nobody sees her after a bus driver sees her car (not her, but her car)... THAT is your smoking gun?

[Midwest Spy]

LytoMe, the calls, to me, are very incriminating evidence that he was anticipating her arrival.

The last call, meant to establish an alibi IMO, really solidifies it for me.

Circumstantial? Sure, but the fact that no one else sees her after the bus driver eyes her vehicle on the property, leads me to believe he's the one who killed her.

So since nobody sees her after a bus driver sees her car (not her, but her car)... THAT is your smoking gun?

She's seen at Avery's, her bones are found in a fire pit, with witnesses that put Avery at the fire Halloween night, and her phone and other personal effects are found 20 feet from his house.

Pretty damn hysterical.

[Blindgreed1]

LytoMe, the calls, to me, are very incriminating evidence that he was anticipating her arrival.

The last call, meant to establish an alibi IMO, really solidifies it for me.

Circumstantial? Sure, but the fact that no one else sees her after the bus driver eyes her vehicle on the property, leads me to believe he's the one who killed her.

So since nobody sees her after a bus driver sees her car (not her, but her car)... THAT is your smoking gun?

She's seen at Avery's, her bones are found in a fire pit, with witnesses that put Avery at the fire Halloween night, and her phone and other personal effects are found 20 feet from his house.

Pretty damn hysterical.

All of which prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that he killed her? Yeah, fucking hilarious.

[HairOfTheDog]

Beyond a shadow of a doubt is not something that any prosecutor needs to prove. Beyond reasonable doubt is the burden and that's a much different bar.

We're not in a court of law here, but I don't get the impression that MS is claiming Avery and Massey are guilty of the murder without a shadow of a doubt.

I get the impression that based on the evidence he's reviewed, he's convinced beyond reasonable doubt that Avery and Massey are guilty of the crimes for which they were convicted.

[Duchess]

I'd love the opportunity to argue about this but I haven't watched any of it and I doubt I will.

Carry on...

[Blindgreed1]

Beyond a shadow of a doubt is not something that any prosecutor needs to prove. Beyond reasonable doubt is the burden and that's a much different bar.

We're not in a court of law here, but I don't get the impression that MS is claiming Avery and Massey are guilty of the murder without a shadow of a doubt.

I get the impression that based on the evidence he's reviewed, he's convinced beyond reasonable doubt that Avery and Massey are guilty of the crimes for which they were convicted.

I got the impression that he believes the smoking gun is the bus driver seeing her car. You know, because that's what he typed? Your powers of telepathy are probably better than mine though. I also get the impression that "reasonable doubt" based on the evidence is there. Anyone who doesn't see that chooses not to. I think all of that will come out eventually now that it has a higher profile.

[Blindgreed1]

Also, "beyond a shadow of a doubt" should be considered before you try to wrongfully prosecute someone who was already wrongly imprisoned for 18 years.

[HairOfTheDog]

I got a different impression of what MS meant in what he typed than you did, Gunnar. You'd think that stating my impression was some kind of jab at you, by your response. It wasn't, it wasn't about you at all.

I haven't seen MS argue that Avery and Dassey did it, no doubt about it whatsoever. I've only seen him defend his belief that the prosecution evidence points toward their guilt in his mind (after considering both sides), and acknowledge that some of the LEOs on the case were assholes.

He can clarify his position for us, if he wants. If I'm reading him wrong, no big deal.

[Blindgreed1]

LytoMe, the calls, to me, are very incriminating evidence that he was anticipating her arrival.

The last call, meant to establish an alibi IMO, really solidifies it for me.

Circumstantial? Sure, but the fact that no one else sees her after the bus driver eyes her vehicle on the property, leads me to believe he's the one who killed her.

FYP HoTD.

[HairOfTheDog]

It don't even know what FYP means, Gunnar, or what you're pointing out by reposting that quote.

The prosecution's evidence -- including the phone calls, where the remains/belongings were found, and the fact that her vehicle was eyed on the property after she was last seen (especially) -- leads MS to believe that Steven Avery is the one who killed Teresa, as charged and convicted, despite some questionable LEO tactics in the case. That's what I'm getting from MS.

If MS tells me that you're right and he is claiming to be 100% sure that Steven Avery is guilty, then I was wrong and misinterpreted him. There's nothing for us to argue about as neither one of us reads minds.

I understand that you believe anyone who doesn't have reasonable doubt about Avery's guilt after watching the Netflix series is wrong. That's your opinion; no problem.

[Midwest Spy]

Yes, HotD, I think I've clearly stated my position.

After reviewing the evidence I believe Avery and Dassey are guilty as charged.

Avery was clearly the ringleader but Dassey contributed IMO.

[Blindgreed1]

It don't even know what FYP means, Gunnar, or what you're pointing out by reposting that quote.

The prosecution's evidence -- including the phone calls, where the remains/belongings were found, and the fact that her vehicle was eyed on the property after she was last seen (especially) -- leads MS to believe that Steven Avery is the one who killed Teresa, as charged and convicted, despite some questionable LEO tactics in the case. That's what I'm getting from MS.

If MS tells me that you're right and he is claiming to be 100% sure that Steven Avery is guilty, then I was wrong and misinterpreted him. There's nothing for us to argue about as neither one of us reads minds.

I understand that you believe anyone who doesn't have reasonable doubt about Avery's guilt after watching the Netflix series is wrong. That's your opinion; no problem.

For Your Pleasure.

[HairOfTheDog]

For Your Pleasure.

Ah.

I like it.

But, reposting a quote isn't gonna make it happen, slacker.

[Duchess]

I don't get it.

[HairOfTheDog]

I don't get what you don't get, Duchess?