INDIANA -- TEEN GIRLS KILLED WHILE HIKING; Liberty German and Abigail Williams

[HairOfTheDog]

Aye, that's the rub with DNA. There could be numerous cases with the same perpetrator DNA, but unless they can match the DNA to a name they have bupkis.

Yep, and it's terribly frustrating for LE and the victims' families when there's solid DNA evidence and no match.

I support the use of familial DNA matching, though it's controversial due to privacy concerns for some.

When male perpetrator DNA doesn't get a hit in the criminal database, LE in a handful of states can search for a possible match to a male family member in the criminal database (it's not technically possible with female DNA yet).

It's helped LE solve of a couple of high profile cases and more states are considering allowing it.

[Love Child]

Not sure in this day and age I would let my 13 yr old daughter do a trail like that without an adult. Maybe back in the day, but not now

I agree with SIX. When I lived in town we were right next to hiking trails, but I cannot recall my friends letting her boys go on them by themselves. I am going to ask her. I rarely saw kids w/out an adult. In fact I could say probably never.

My daughter is 13. This story hits me in the face. They are just at that age where they are not quite adults but are wanting more freedom and independence and you want to give it to them and them to still play safely.

I cannot imagine the fears of a parent

[Dogears]

Did anyone notice the side of the girls face that was on the railroad tracks? It looked like it was bloody or bruised and dirty.

[HairOfTheDog]

Did anyone notice the side of the girls face that was on the railroad tracks? It looked like it was bloody or bruised and dirty.

Welcome to Mock, Dogears.

I had not noticed that before. But, when I went back to the photo in post 2 and increased the view to 300%, it did look like Abigail's face was dirty or otherwise discolored.

By the time that photo was snapped, the girls had been in the hiking area for over an hour, I believe. So, Abigail might just have gotten dirty before anything nefarious took place. But, I see what you mean.

Are you thinking it's possible that Liberty took that picture at the direction of the killer?

[koko]

I know. When stuff like this happens, I take it personally and it affects me. Like when little Zahra was killed by her evil stepmother. Zahra was Australian living in the US.

Oh god. Zahra was the girl with the prosthetic legs, right? Her father's name was Adam I think? I forgot about that one.

Anybody remember in 2013, I think it was in the Atlanta area, a mom was walking her baby boy in a stroller, 2 pieces of shit came up and just shot the baby? That one broke my heart. That baby boy was the same age as the little boy I watch. (He's 5 now and calls me his best friend )

Anything involving kids feels even worse when you know one who could theoretically be placed in the same situation

[Midwest Spy]

I saw the reward in this case has been increased to $200K.

It's starting to feel more and more like an out-of-towner or drifter did this.

With that pic circulating and nobody making a connection, the writing seems to be on the wall.

[HairOfTheDog]

That's a hefty reward, MS, thanks for the update.

I don't have much faith that it will help, but hope it does.

Every morning I check out the crime news hoping to read of an arrest, or at least a big break, in this case.

[HairOfTheDog]

LE Investigating Possible Connection to 2012 Iowa Murder of Two Young Girls



--Liberty German and Abigail Williams, both 13, were murdered in Delphi, Indiana, in February this year.

--Cousins Lyric Cook, 10, and Elizabeth Collins, 8, were killed in Iowa in 2012; they had been riding their bikes near Meyers Lake when they were abducted.

--Their bodies were found by hunters 25 miles away five months later.

--No arrests have been made in either of the cases which police are now trying to link.

--Indiana State Police said it had 'compared notes' with officers in Iowa but no direct connection has yet been found.

Story: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...-case.html

[HairOfTheDog]

LE appears to have nothing more to go on in this case.

They've fielded 11,000 tips and are still hoping for someone to recognize the unidentified suspect's pic and/or voice in order to crack the case.

Today, the grandparents of Liberty German appeared at a press conference to talk about how much they missed her, how much she and Abigail loved each other and would never leave the other in trouble. They pleaded for people to take another look at the photo and call in any information.

Abigail's family isn't ready to speak publicly yet, but they issued statement of support for Liberty's family and reiterated how close Abigail and Liberty were; true blue friends.

Story: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...iller.html

[Midwest Spy]

Do we know how these girls were killed or if anything sexual assault-wise occurred?

Also, has LE noticed similarities between these girls and the Iowa girls' manner of death that would lead them to believe there's a connection?

[HairOfTheDog]

LE still hasn't released any information about COD or potential sexual assault, MS.

I imagine they don't want to reveal any details that only the killer(s) would know this early on.

But, if time marches on with no real leads, it's possible that LE might release that info in hopes of having an impact on anyone who might know the identity of the suspect.

[LytoMe]

If he's not in the database, it won't be that easy.

It's been a while, but this case I have been following from the start since My daughter is in Fact 13 and we live near an area like this where we HIKE as a family. With Tracks, Bridges, etc.

So if they did in fact find a good solid sample of a males DNA, the database is LARGE and in several hundred cities. They might have a name, we don't know. They might have an idea of who this is, but he is not a local, etc. I have seen cases where they do like not to give to much up because of issues with the suspect being known to run or "train jump".

Also, I have NOT read this anywhere just speculation of this guy being a train jumper. IS this in fact an active railroad, if so how often does it run, where does it go, what does it carry, etc. Many questions about this should be asked or looked at by LE! Only a Local would know these answers.

I know the tracks by my house, the train runs once a day. And does not go further then an hour away from my town. A train jumper would not get fair.

[HairOfTheDog]

MS mentioned the possibility that the suspect is a train-jumper upthread.

In my opinion, if LE knew the identity of the suspect, they'd be all over his relatives and would likely release it to the public before he has an opportunity to kill again, train-jumper or not.

Releasing the name could lead to tips from people who know him, but don't recognize him in that grainy photo.

[LytoMe]

MS mentioned the possibility that the suspect is a train-jumper upthread.

In my opinion, if LE knew the identity of the suspect, they'd be all over his relatives and would likely release it to the public before he has an opportunity to kill again. Releasing the name could lead to tips from people who know him, but don't recognize him in that grainy photo.

What I gather is that the train jumping theory is not what LE has indicated, just what AP and commenters have posted?

Does anyone live in the area on Mock?

[HairOfTheDog]

FAHQTOO lives in Indiana, LytoMe. I'm not sure if her location is anywhere near the crime scene though.

[Midwest Spy]

I was shocked to learn that many 'normal' people, most of them older, 45 & up, still hop trains.

Never occurred to me that ordinary people with jobs, homes, kids, etc, would do this.

So many tracks linked, particularly in the Midwest and out east, that an experienced train rider would know how to get just about anywhere they pleased.

[HairOfTheDog]

New article/recap/LE interview

Snip:
Despite the lack of progress on the investigation thus far, Sgt. John Perrine of the Indiana State Police told reporters that he's confident authorities will track down the person or persons responsible for Abby and Libby’s murders.


^ Perrine told ABC News this is an "all hands on deck" investigation with more than two dozen law enforcement agencies involved, including the FBI, "because we want to bring justice to Libby and Abby's families.”

For now, the girls' causes of death have not been released, Perrine said, because authorities need to keep some evidence "close to the vest for investigators to use as they talk to people, interrogate people.”

He said that evidence other than the audio recording has been recovered, but could not elaborate on that evidence and could not say if more evidence will be made public in the near future.

"At this point, we just have to be very careful because we cannot get this wrong. We cannot fail on this case,” Perrine said. "We have to find the person responsible for murdering Abby and Libby.”

Full piece: http://abcnews.go.com/US/shaken-double-m...d=46019975

[FAHQTOO]

FAHQTOO lives in Indiana, LytoMe. I'm not sure if her location is anywhere near the crime scene though.

I'm 100 miles east of Delphi. The trains in my area go through about every half hour and a lot of times there's dual trains running in the opposite direction.
I don't believe the guy is local at all. I think with the reward being that high, if he was local he'd be caught by now.

[HairOfTheDog]

I agree, FAHQTOO. If the suspect were a local, I think he would have been identified by now, especially given the hefty reward.

There's really nothing new in today's update article, but here's the link: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...teens.html

Seems that LE is working its tail off, but none of the leads are panning out so far. :(

[HairOfTheDog]

Investigation Update

LE got a new search warrant and were back at the home of the landowner where Liberty and Abigail's bodies were found.

LE is declining to say what they're searching for this time, but stated that 77-year-old Ronald Logan isn't considered a suspect. His attorney says Logan is still struggling with something so heinous happening on his property and he encourages people to call in tips.

Logan was arrested last week for parole violation for a DUI conviction. He is one of 13 people arrested on unrelated charges during the course of the investigation. Seems to me like LE is trying to sweat everyone who might know something, anything.

LE has received over 13,000 tips and interviewed 300 people. They've cleared 200 of them and are still investigating the alibis of the other 100.

More here: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...rests.html