IRAN/ISRAEL

[Duchess]

Israel bombed the Iranian consulate killing some Iranian generals, so now the Islamic Republic is threatening to launch an attack on Israel and Israel is like HOW DARE YOU! What the fuck is wrong with those fucking people. Goddamn. My feeling is, if you don't want to be attacked, don't attack others. Am I wrong? Why is this so hard? People are stupid. 

I don't care if they kill each other, but I get irate when pretty much every person I come across defends Israel. Israel brings shit upon themselves.

[rothschild]

Someone was pointing out that the attack could be directed at the nations providing arms and munitions to Israel.

[Duchess]

Yeah. I saw that. *sigh*

[rothschild]

According to this Al Jazeera investigation, Hamas was posting their training videos online. No babies were beheaded or cooked in ovens.

[Duchess]

I'm reading that Israel believes an attack is imminent. Take it for what it's worth, they are lying bastards.

[rothschild]

I'm reading that Israel believes an attack is imminent. Take it for what it's worth, they are lying bastards.

Some solid military analysis, if you're interested. Iran spent tens of millions of dollars on the attack and successfully hit an Israeli airfield, causing moderate damage -- Israel-US spent billions shooting down inexpensive drones. Complete strategic victory for Iran showing that the Israeli air defenses cannot stop an all-out air assault.

The big problem is that Israeli-US military policy is driven by politics, not military expertise.

[rothschild]

All remains quiet so far.

[BlueTiki]

 . . . What the fuck is wrong with those fucking people. Goddamn. My feeling is, if you don't want to be attacked, don't attack others. Am I wrong? Why is this so hard? People are stupid. 

You mean like what Hamas did on October 7^th . . . right?

[rothschild]

Before there was Hamas there was the Irgun and Lehi.

Live by the bomb, die by the bomb.

[Duchess]

You mean like what Hamas did on October 7^th . . . right?

Yes, Tiki. Do you think I'm saying or implying Israel doesn't have a right to defend themselves?

[rothschild]

You mean like what Hamas did on October 7^th . . . right?

Yes, Tiki. Do you think I'm saying or implying Israel doesn't have a right to defend themselves?

None of these events occur in a vacuum. Is it possible to know what is defense and what is military aggression without understanding the history of this conflict?

Every nation in the Western World has embraced multiculturalism except for Israel, which has repeatedly claimed it needs to preserve it's Jewish character. How do you reconcile a Jewish ethnostate with multiculturalism? Because of the Holocaust? The colonization of Palestine began well before the Holocaust.

Everywhere colonization has ever gone you find the brutal oppression of indigenous people who had little or no ability to defend themselves against European conquerors. The people who identify as Palestinians are no different.

From wikipedia:

There is no generally accepted definition of indigenous peoples, although in the 21^st century the focus has been on self-identification, cultural difference from other groups in a state, a special relationship with their traditional territory, and an experience of subjugation and discrimination under a dominant cultural model.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigenous_peoples


Are you familiar with the Nakba?

The Nakba (Arabic: النكبة an-Nakbah, lit. 'The Catastrophe') was the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians in Mandatory Palestine during the 1948 Palestine war through their violent displacement and dispossession of land, property and belongings, along with the destruction of their society, culture, identity, political rights, and national aspirations. The term is also used to described the ongoing persecution and displacement of Palestinians by Israel. As a whole, it covers the shattering of Palestinian society and the long-running rejection of the right of return for Palestinian refugees and their descendants.

During the foundational events of the Nakba in 1948, dozens of massacres targeting Arabs were conducted and over 500 Arab-majority towns and villages were depopulated, with many of these being either completely destroyed or repopulated by Jews and given new Hebrew names. Approximately half of Palestine's predominantly Arab population, or around 750,000 people, were expelled from their homes or made to flee, at first by Zionist paramilitaries through various violent means, and after the establishment of the State of Israel, by the Israel Defense Forces. By the end of the war, 78% of the total land area of the former Mandatory Palestine was controlled by Israel and at least 15,000 Arabs had been killed.

The Palestinian national narrative views the Nakba as a collective trauma that defines their national identity and political aspirations, whereas the Israeli national narrative views the same events in terms of the war of independence that established their aspirations for statehood and sovereignty. To this end, the Palestinians observe 15 May as Nakba Day, commemorating the war's events one day after Israel's Independence Day. In 1967 following the Six-Day War, another series of Palestinian exodus occurred; this came to be known as the Naksa (lit. 'Setback'), and also has its own day, 5 June.

The Nakba has greatly influenced Palestinian culture and is a foundational symbol of the current Palestinian national identity, together with the political cartoon character Handala, the Palestinian keffiyeh, and the Palestinian 1948 keys. Many books, songs, and poems have been written about the Nakba. Nakba denial remains prevalent despite the growing scholarship on it, such as those by the Israeli New Historians.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakba

IMO, this is why Palestinians and Israelis don't get along.

[Duchess]

I'm no intellectual giant who has deep, philosophical conversations about politics, religion, etc. I'm just someone who feels like there is a place for everyone. I am never going to be able to understand wars being started over religion. I really cannot imagine caring so much about who people worship that I would want them to die for that. It boggles my mind.

[BlueTiki]

You mean like what Hamas did on October 7^th . . . right?

Yes, Tiki. Do you think I'm saying or implying Israel doesn't have a right to defend themselves?

Yeah . . . kinda.

Mostly my impression was you believe Israel deserves all the attacks against them because they were the initial aggressors.

Just like RC.

[rothschild]

I'm no intellectual giant who has deep, philosophical conversations about politics, religion, etc. I'm just someone who feels like there is a place for everyone. I am never going to be able to understand wars being started over religion. I really cannot imagine caring so much about who people worship that I would want them to die for that. It boggles my mind.

It's really not about religion. Jews and non-Jews coexisted prior to the arrival of the Zionists. Jews and Iranians coexist to this day.

I'm not an intellectual giant, just a person that has an interest in philosophy, socio-economics and history. A hobby, if you will.

The wiki quote re the Nakba provides a decent overview from the perspective of universal human rights.

My bias is that I identify with the 99%. I don't hate the 1%, but I do despise the behavior that characterizes who they are and what they are about.

[rothschild]

You mean like what Hamas did on October 7^th . . . right?

Yes, Tiki. Do you think I'm saying or implying Israel doesn't have a right to defend themselves?

Yeah . . . kinda.

Mostly my impression was you believe Israel deserves all the attacks against them because they were the initial aggressors.

Just like RC.

She's never said anything suggesting that she sees it that way.

As long as Israel continues to assert that the conflict is an internal matter, completely outside the scope of internal law, I will think that they deserve what they reap. The day that changes I will celebrate, because it will greatly improve the integrity of the rule of law.

[rothschild]

All remains quiet so far.

DEFCON 3, anything can happen in the next 48 hours.

Netanyahu faces prison on corruption charges if his government collapses. Desperate people do desperate things. The Biden admin appears to be doing everything it can to dissuade Israel from going all in on Iran. Israel may do it anyway on the assumption that America will be forced to back Israel up.

The US strategic oil reserve lasts 17 days if production/shipping is disrupted, Iran, Russia and China know that.

Prayers are advised at this point.

[Carsman]

All remains quiet so far.

DEFCON 3, anything can happen in the next 48 hours.

Netanyahu faces prison on corruption charges if his government collapses. Desperate people do desperate things. The Biden admin appears to be doing everything it can to dissuade Israel from going all in on Iran. Israel may do it anyway on the assumption that America will be forced to back Israel up.

The US strategic oil reserve lasts 17 days if production/shipping is disrupted, Iran, Russia and China know that.

Prayers are advised at this point.

Can't help but wonder, what would Donny do if he was again POTUS! Scary. 

[rothschild]

All remains quiet so far.

DEFCON 3, anything can happen in the next 48 hours.

Netanyahu faces prison on corruption charges if his government collapses. Desperate people do desperate things. The Biden admin appears to be doing everything it can to dissuade Israel from going all in on Iran. Israel may do it anyway on the assumption that America will be forced to back Israel up.

The US strategic oil reserve lasts 17 days if production/shipping is disrupted, Iran, Russia and China know that.

Prayers are advised at this point.

Can't help but wonder, what would Donny do if he was again POTUS! Scary. 

He'd tell us that none of this would have happened if the election hadn't been stolen.

[BigMark]

we were a net exporter of oil during the oi's term, and america is the Saudi arabia of natural gas the cleanest method of creating energy ever invented to this very day.

[rothschild]

Israel has launched a "limited" strike against Iran, possibly Syria and Iraq. Seems to be over and done, too early to know.

This channel is scanning media reports from multiple sources live.