Johnny S. Clarke & Lisa Straub- young Ohio couple murdered

[TotallyCurious]

I HAD NOT SEEN THIS FB PAGE BEFORE.
Quite intriguing comment by Maytee.

http://www.facebook.com/home.php?tab=3#!/JC.and.LS.Case

What comment are you speaking of ? I believe she was banned on that site too !

VELEZ-MITCHELL: What is running through you when you feel that possibility that maybe, while you were there, they were still inside?

VAZQUEZ: That my husband was doing their job for them and that my son is dead in this house, that s...omething horribly wrong has happened to my son. From hearing the 911 -- the call that the girl makes to another friend to make to me, I`m feeling in my gut is wrenching. Something is horribly wrong with my son and Lisa

[shitstorm]

ok i got it. again, how is this person connected to this case? we are not going to speculate about everybody on everybody's facebook friends. i need a nexus.

Are you talking about VD or his GF?

mj facebook. i have no idea who vd is.
maybe i have finally lost the plot.

VD was really good friends with JC, and is the boyfriend of the girl on FB who said she was with JC before he went to pick up LS, watching the Pro Bowl. Turns out VD, after JC was murdered, replied to someone who said wasn't that horrible about JC, and he answered Johnny who (unknown posted that)? So far so good?? VD also went to legacy.com and post a big goodbye to JC there, but he was asking just before that Johnny who?
Okay well VD is FB friends with MJ and turns out MJ is also friends with TW's current boy AG> So VD's girlfriend was supposedly with JC right before he picked up LS, per her post on FB. And the deeper you dig the scarier the characters are that are all connected!

Damn, I've been away from the thread all night and it's 1 AM. No sleep for me, AGAIN.

You're good, Kat. I nominate you to do the flow chart.

[Inspector Gary]

ok i got it. again, how is this person connected to this case? we are not going to speculate about everybody on everybody's facebook friends. i need a nexus.

Are you talking about VD or his GF?

mj facebook. i have no idea who vd is.
maybe i have finally lost the plot.

VD was really good friends with JC, and is the boyfriend of the girl on FB who said she was with JC before he went to pick up LS, watching the Pro Bowl. Turns out VD, after JC was murdered, replied to someone who said wasn't that horrible about JC, and he answered Johnny who (unknown posted that)? So far so good?? VD also went to legacy.com and post a big goodbye to JC there, but he was asking just before that Johnny who?
Okay well VD is FB friends with MJ and turns out MJ is also friends with TW's current boy AG> So VD's girlfriend was supposedly with JC right before he picked up LS, per her post on FB. And the deeper you dig the scarier the characters are that are all connected!

Damn, I've been away from the thread all night and it's 1 AM. No sleep for me, AGAIN.

You're good, Kat. I nominate you to do the flow chart.

It was NOT VD who said, "johnny who." It was GB who said, "johnny who."

[ToledoNative]

I double checked...Lisa and Tiffany became facebook friends on Jan. 21^st, followed by a post from Lisa saying, "whats uppp biaaatch.. i need ur diggies baby lol" then Tiffany posts her phone number and says that she heard "they" (Lisa and Johnny?) were at the minor's house and she wants Lisa to get her a job where Lisa works.

Seems Lisa was fairly chummy with Tiffany, by that message.

She must have deleted it, I can't find that comment on her facebook.

Yes, they seemed chummy on that post.

Diggies in this case is digits. Tiffany posted her phone number (and you don't usually go around borrowing other seller's digital scales).

To be more specific, Tiffany resonds with her phone number, says I heard you guys were at Z's (his full name) and then says are you still going to get me a job where you work like we had talked about.

[shitstorm]

No. These guys in this youtube video are toolbags compared to these guys like M.J. I mean, any guy in a gang is a toolbag but these guys are more hard core. Look at M.J. tats on his forearms. It's 300 on one and Western on the other. Western Ave. is a bad area in south toledo. It's "300 WESTERN BLOCC CRIPZ" is actually how they present and rep their hood.

You may have answered this but how do know you these gang designations? Really interesting!

[toledoarea]

Which still leaves me clueless as to why VD was gone for a week after the murders. No facebook, no nothing. Then a week later on the 8^th of Feb. all of a sudden he pops up on MJ facebook and says hey, sorry for not catchin up with you. I had to hide out for a while. Call me on some new number cuz I don't have a "FONE" anymore. Why no "FONE"? Was it one of those disposable "fones" that drug dealers use to deter LE? Wasn't there many "FONES" found at the scene? Maytee said johnnys "fone" was by/on his body. Then there were reports of "fones" being broken and scattered at the crime scene. Taking off for a little over a week might be enough time to hide your wounds without your "fone" to talk to anybody. Wounds being that someone might have given you if they were fighting for their life.

[Jane]

Does Maytee think they sit up in heaven on computers reading facebook. When I read her posts I keep picturing rows of angels on computers, with their wings getting caught in their office chairs.

[shitstorm]

She has two fb's.

Thanks - I missed that. And she's using them both by the look of it. Why do you think that is? (Neither one is friends with JC Sr though.)

Are you talking about B, VD's girlfriend?

[Jane]

Personally, I think whomever is writing about Mock on the facebook pages writes it there because they know that there are actual law enforcement people on this site and won't come on here and talk their talk.

Another thing I've noticed about Maytee...she seems to be in competition with the Straubs, whether it be to set up a fund because they set up a fund or because she's a good mom just like they were good parents, Lisa's past is just as bad as Johnny's past. I can't imagine her pain and what that can do to you but that's just an observation I've had...add that with the love she had for Johnny but knowing Johnny loved Lisa and chose to live with her over Maytee...I definitly can see her feeling like she had/has to comepte with Lisa/Straub's. AND..let's not forget if what's been said about her husband cheating, she's probably over the top with jealousy and feelings of competition.

I so agree with you here.

I think Johnny was distancing himself from Maytee. Others have used the word "embarrassed" and I believe that to my core.

Here was a chance for Johnny to make good. He was welcomed by a stable, respectable family and loved by a young woman who didn't talk or act like a gangster. She was edgy enough to like to party and to tolerate his past transgressions. He could envision a future far different from the environment of his youth, an upbringing he was most likely desperate to escape.

I think Maytee resented it fiercely. And I think Johnny's peers resented it, too.

I think you're probably right!

[ToledoNative]

It needs to be looked at that when the intruders got into the house, they felt comfortable being in the house for a little while.

Whether Tiffany was on the phone with Johnny or not when the intruders were there, the crime had to have taken some time.

THEY WERE READING CENTRAL SECURITY DOCUMENTS, FOR GOODNESS SAKES.

The method of murder was not a gun shot, it was a slow suffocation.

They ransacked the hell out of the master bedroom.

They knew they could be in there for some time...like a guaranteed two hours, let's say. I think Tiffany was involved, was the "lookout", was the alibi, was the way in, was the connection!

[toledoarea]

I couldn't agree with you more.

[ToledoNative]

Personally, I think whomever is writing about Mock on the facebook pages writes it there because they know that there are actual law enforcement people on this site and won't come on here and talk their talk.

Another thing I've noticed about Maytee...she seems to be in competition with the Straubs, whether it be to set up a fund because they set up a fund or because she's a good mom just like they were good parents, Lisa's past is just as bad as Johnny's past. I can't imagine her pain and what that can do to you but that's just an observation I've had...add that with the love she had for Johnny but knowing Johnny loved Lisa and chose to live with her over Maytee...I definitly can see her feeling like she had/has to comepte with Lisa/Straub's. AND..let's not forget if what's been said about her husband cheating, she's probably over the top with jealousy and feelings of competition.

I so agree with you here.

I think Johnny was distancing himself from Maytee. Others have used the word "embarrassed" and I believe that to my core.

Here was a chance for Johnny to make good. He was welcomed by a stable, respectable family and loved by a young woman who didn't talk or act like a gangster. She was edgy enough to like to party and to tolerate his past transgressions. He could envision a future far different from the environment of his youth, an upbringing he was most likely desperate to escape.

I think Maytee resented it fiercely. And I think Johnny's peers resented it, too.

I think you're probably right!

If Johnny was completely trying to escape his past and begin a better life, he wouldn't be hanging out with the social elite like Tiffany, have digital scales in his girlfriend's parent's house, and he sure wouldn't let Lisa around people like Tiffany.

[TotallyCurious]

Personally, I think whomever is writing about Mock on the facebook pages writes it there because they know that there are actual law enforcement people on this site and won't come on here and talk their talk.

Another thing I've noticed about Maytee...she seems to be in competition with the Straubs, whether it be to set up a fund because they set up a fund or because she's a good mom just like they were good parents, Lisa's past is just as bad as Johnny's past. I can't imagine her pain and what that can do to you but that's just an observation I've had...add that with the love she had for Johnny but knowing Johnny loved Lisa and chose to live with her over Maytee...I definitly can see her feeling like she had/has to comepte with Lisa/Straub's. AND..let's not forget if what's been said about her husband cheating, she's probably over the top with jealousy and feelings of competition.

I so agree with you here.

I think Johnny was distancing himself from Maytee. Others have used the word "embarrassed" and I believe that to my core.

Here was a chance for Johnny to make good. He was welcomed by a stable, respectable family and loved by a young woman who didn't talk or act like a gangster. She was edgy enough to like to party and to tolerate his past transgressions. He could envision a future far different from the environment of his youth, an upbringing he was most likely desperate to escape.

I think Maytee resented it fiercely. And I think Johnny's peers resented it, too.

I think you're probably right!

Just in profession and parenting alone, Maytee Loses points to Lisa's mom.
Just in profession and parenting and spousal abuse J SR loses to Lisa's dad.
Just in family gatherings and holidays and physical surroundings Clarke's lose.
None of this makes them bad,but a bee in their bonnet it could be.

[ToledoNative]

It's very easy to get on here and speculate, but we need to stick to the facts.

How did anyone get alerted that something was happening to Johnny and Lisa?

TIFFANY

Tiffany called a friend who then called Maytee. Ok, so Tiffany is the one who knew something wasn't right. How did she know this? She says because she was on the phone with Johnny and heard the intruders come in. If she is lying about that phone call and what she heard, then why would she have alerted anyone in the first place (Sherita/Cherita)? She knew something was going on.

If Tiffany WAS INVOLVED with the crime, why would she have called the friend and said that Johnny and Lisa were in trouble? Because people knew (Maytee said that Johnny told her they were having friends over to shoot pool) that Tiffany was supposed to be over there that night and she didn't want to get blamed for the crime. She wanted to seem like a caring, concerned friend (two hours later, mind you).

[TotallyCurious]

If Johnny was completely trying to escape his past and begin a better life, he wouldn't be hanging out with the social elite like Tiffany, have digital scales in his girlfriend's parent's house, and he sure wouldn't let Lisa around people like Tiffany.
[/quote]

It takes some weaning away from. I truly believe he was and perhaps these
were the things he was passing on. Just like smoking, getting clean from
drugs is not an overnight affair. Give him a chance. My guess is he was
really doing it or Lisa's parents would not have left town. I think Tiff was
Lisa's friend. Come on, there are fuck ups in all our friendship groups. Oh
wait, when I belonged to the country club they all acted alike but oh, the
apartments the men shared to take women, the shenanigans that went on.
The happy golf and tennis pros. It's everywhere. Don't expect Johnny
to turn over a new leaf and that leaf be supremely free of flaws. That is
not life.

[ToledoNative]

If Johnny was completely trying to escape his past and begin a better life, he wouldn't be hanging out with the social elite like Tiffany, have digital scales in his girlfriend's parent's house, and he sure wouldn't let Lisa around people like Tiffany.

It takes some weaning away from. I truly believe he was and perhaps these
were the things he was passing on. Just like smoking, getting clean from
drugs is not an overnight affair. Give him a chance. My guess is he was
really doing it or Lisa's parents would not have left town. I think Tiff was
Lisa's friend. Come on, there are fuck ups in all our friendship groups. Oh
wait, when I belonged to the country club they all acted alike but oh, the
apartments the men shared to take women, the shenanigans that went on.
The happy golf and tennis pros. It's everywhere. Don't expect Johnny
to turn over a new leaf and that leaf be supremely free of flaws. That is
not life.
[/quote]


It just doesn't seem like he was weaning.

Lisa was trying to get Tiffany a job with her...that's getting closer, not weaning.

V says he was hanging out with Johnny so much more the past two weeks.

I feel like Johnny was getting closer and closer to this (we all can agree) horrible crew. Everything we have seen on Tiffany's facebook, myspace, her friends' pages, her MOTHER'S page, shows that this is not a crew you try to get closer to if you are trying to turn your life around.

This sounds like a crew from Toledo who heard about a safe filled with $100,000, needed Johnny there to open it, and had Tiffany in on the whole thing with her phone calls and time lapses.

[sealed27]

I believe the cell phones are a big lead for this case, maybe that is part of not hearing much until evidence comes back, if cellphones were strewn about, maybe one of the victims had record on their phone and maybe they wanted and thought if they broke those phones up no one would know anything, just been thinking why would they have destroyed phones, if the victims were taped up at wrists then why did they break the phones?

[ToledoNative]

I believe the cell phones are a big lead for this case, maybe that is part of not hearing much until evidence comes back, if cellphones were strewn about, maybe one of the victims had record on their phone and maybe they wanted and thought if they broke those phones up no one would know anything, just been thinking why would they have destroyed phones, if the victims were taped up at wrists then why did they break the phones?

Could have happened in the struggle? It's highly likely their cell phones were in there hands when the intruders came in. I know whenever I just drop my piece of shit cell phone, it busts into three pieces. Pieces could've got kicked around during the struggle.

[Jane]

just listened to the 911 call again. Maytee says "the car is in the driveway".. she's says it twice

edited to add - it's where you can tell Maytee is getting pissed off w/the dispatcher ... Lisa's car WAS in the driveway

Well I guess its the driveway then thanks

definately in the driveway, per Maytee & Tiffany, so far.

Just wanted to quote this because there has been so much speculation on where the car actually was.

NOOOOOO, I was wrong, lol... I was going by what Tiffany & Maytee said... it looks like LE stated "the car was in the garage" .... it's in the very first page, on this thread!

[Jane]

Does anyone have all the newspaper articles and 911 calls in
one spot? Do you think it would be helpful to post them here
for the people who might not go back and read?

i think it sounds like a grand idea TC. even though i've read the entire thread i find myself going back often. unless i'm stupid i can't find a way to go back(even if i know the post number) in a quick way. is ther a spot to punch in a page number or a thread number ?? yes i am old and computer challenged!!

you can enter the page # at the end of the web address bar (or whatever it's called. (the http//www....xxxxxx.html thing) it's near the end of it where it says "page-403.html"

i think tiff did say she's talked to police twice. that night and the next day.

thanks for the info. i asked about tiff because i was told by the dect. that both tiff and Z were questioned several times and this was almost a week or so before she stated this. hmmmmm

a detective told you this ??? Yeah, Tiffany said she'd been interviewed twice, the first time being the morning of the murders, & then when she went to take a polygraph, although LE didn't give her one, due to her being pregnant.. If a detective told you that, then that's (Tiffany's claim of twice) a huge lie, IMO... daaaaaamn!