walking while black - Trayvon Martin

[username]

I disagree that it's an assumption that there was some pursuit on the part of Z. As I recall, the 911 operator asked him if he was following T and he said yes and that's when the operator said "we don't need you to do that".

[Sterling]

User: Why is it difficult for you to consider that Martin DID attack Zimmerman? I swear - it seems to me that some of the members believe if they consider this scenario it somehow makes the shooting of this teen acceptable. Maybe if you can walk us through Martin's movements and locations from the time the 911 operator suggested Zimmerman stand-down, it would be helpful.

[LytoMe]

I disagree that it's an assumption that there was some pursuit on the part of Z. As I recall, the 911 operator asked him if he was following T and he said yes and that's when the operator said "we don't need you to do that".

You are right he stated he was watching him. I just can not imagine the 6 foot person we saw on the ⁷⁄₁₁ video would run. I was trying to just indicate its hard to assume the events that happened after the 911 call.

[username]

User: Why is it difficult for you to consider that Martin DID attack Zimmerman? I swear - it seems to me that some of the members believe if they consider this scenario it somehow makes the shooting of this teen acceptable. Maybe if you can walk us through Martin's movements and locations from the time the 911 operator suggested Zimmerman stand-down, it would be helpful.

If you read all of my 100's of posts in this thread, you'd know I never said that. There are several unaccounted for minutes; I'm not sure if we'll ever know definitively what occurred during that time.

I think that anything could have happened. I think T might have gotten tired of being followed and attacked Z when he approached, I think Z could have confronted Trayvon (maybe even tried to grab him) and a fight ensued. Maybe T was hiding and Z came around a corner and he jumped him then. Those few minutes are a big, fat, unknown (especially if you disregard the g/f's statements).

I admit I have a harder time believing the scenario where Z is innocently on his way back to his truck and T jumps him. Just from the 911 call, he sounded pretty damn determined to follow Trayvon and keep him in his sights.

[Adub]

I just can not imagine the 6 foot person we saw on the ⁷⁄₁₁ video would run.

Then Zimmerman lied when he told dispatch the the "suspect" ran. Zimmerman said that Trayvon ran. Have you not listened to the 911 tape?

[Sterling]

If you read all of my 100's of posts in this thread, you'd know I never said that.

I think that anything could have happened.

1.) I did. Truly.

2.) I'm glad you acknowledged this. I was fearful the online petition stole your soul, objectivity and closet conservatism.

[Sterling]

Then Zimmerman lied when he told dispatch the the "suspect" ran. Zimmerman said that Trayvon ran. Have you not listened to the 911 tape?

Then if he told the truth about Martin "fleeing" then he must be telling the truth about being attacked! Or were both just lies of convenient circumstances for "bad behavior"?

[Nina]

This story The Missing 2:30 & DeeDee's Testimony gives a good breakdown of the time line and a plausible explanation of what might have happened.

There was a couple of minutes between when Z first reported Martin was running and the shooting. I wondered why a fit 17 year old couldn't have run the short distance to his destination if he was in fear of Z. It would have taken only about 30 seconds to get there. Why was he stilll in the common area?

Location F is where the fight/shooting happened.

Phone records indicate the girlfriend called after the 911 call was placed. I can envision a young guy wanting to impress a girl and confronting his follower. "Run" she tells him. Most hot blooded young men are going to try to play it cool "Fuck that, I'm gonna see what this dude wants". So he double backs and confronts Z as Z is headed back to his truck. Possible.

[Cracker]

"Twin Trees" "Long Oak" hahahahaha

[Adub]

Then Zimmerman lied when he told dispatch the the "suspect" ran. Zimmerman said that Trayvon ran. Have you not listened to the 911 tape?

Then if he told the truth about Martin "fleeing" then he must be telling the truth about being attacked! Or were both just lies of convenient circumstances for "bad behavior"?

My thought on that is that one was before death, and the other after.

[Maggot]

"Twin Trees" "Long Oak" hahahahaha

...........Its OK, I get it.

[Disciple]

Well the call to the g/f aside, on the 911 call Z made he indicates he's following T, he sounds out of breath and then there's the "these assholes always get away" comment. Sounds like a pursuit (at that time) to me.

But this is your assumption of the night, not the actually events. I do understand what you are saying, and I can see how you have come to that conclusion. Its is just an assumption of the night, not the actually events that happened.

Just not to long ago everyone was assuming from word of mouth that George had no injuries, until photos were released. It will be very interesting to see how this all unfolds.

User obviously knows the difference between an assumption and a conclusion.

[Midwest Spy]

Well the call to the g/f aside, on the 911 call Z made he indicates he's following T, he sounds out of breath and then there's the "these assholes always get away" comment. Sounds like a pursuit (at that time) to me.

I think there's a difference between 'pursuit', which to me means 'seeking prey', versus following/observing, which to me would mean, 'I'm keeping an eye on you until the authorities arrive'.

That's the rub. It's my belief that Z would've sounded out of breath because T was obviously trying to elude him.

As T tells GF that someone's following him, he decided to speed up, at which point Z could've easily muttered, 'they always get away'.

As Z decides to head back to truck after losing him, T (who's either been lying in wait, or has doubled back) then jumps him.

That's the conclusion that I'VE come to. If I'm proven wrong down the road, I'll gladly admit my error.

[LytoMe]

Well the call to the g/f aside, on the 911 call Z made he indicates he's following T, he sounds out of breath and then there's the "these assholes always get away" comment. Sounds like a pursuit (at that time) to me.

I think there's a difference between 'pursuit', which to me means 'seeking prey', versus following/observing, which to me would mean, 'I'm keeping an eye on you until the authorities arrive'.

That's the rub. It's my belief that Z would've sounded out of breath because T was obviously trying to elude him.

As T tells GF that someone's following him, he decided to speed up, at which point Z could've easily muttered, 'they always get away'.

As Z decides to head back to truck after losing him, T (who's either been lying in wait, or has doubled back) then jumps him.

That's the conclusion that I'VE come to. If I'm proven wrong down the road, I'll gladly admit my error.

I agree. I think this version seems the most plausible!

[Ma Huang Sor]

They're both stupid motherfuckers. It's a shame one of them died from being so stupid.

[Duchess]

George is a pussy muthafucka for starting something he couldn't finish without a gun available to him & I hope he does some time, if he doesn't, I hope there is rioting in the streets and the shit hits the fan in a major way.

[Jimbone]

They rioted in LA after the Rodney King verdict, and looking back it didn't seem to change a damn thing. It did however devastate the community and make it that much more difficult for those living in it.

Riots won't change anything, because most of the rioters aren't in it for the cause. They are in it for the mayhem. And once the mob starts this sort of thing can get out of hand in a hurry; there are people on both sides who would pour gasoline on an already volatile situation.

Be very careful what you wish for.

[ZEROSPHERES]

This story The Missing 2:30 & DeeDee's Testimony gives a good breakdown of the time line and a plausible explanation of what might have happened.

There was a couple of minutes between when Z first reported Martin was running and the shooting. I wondered why a fit 17 year old couldn't have run the short distance to his destination if he was in fear of Z. It would have taken only about 30 seconds to get there. Why was he stilll in the common area?

Location F is where the fight/shooting happened.

Phone records indicate the girlfriend called after the 911 call was placed. I can envision a young guy wanting to impress a girl and confronting his follower. "Run" she tells him. Most hot blooded young men are going to try to play it cool "Fuck that, I'm gonna see what this dude wants". So he double backs and confronts Z as Z is headed back to his truck. Possible.

It's possible that 'Z' didn't follow right behind 'T' but assumed where 'T' was headed and took an alternate path thru two buildings and headed 'T' off at the pass. In this scenario 'T' did NOT double back and attack 'Z' but was surprised when 'Z' emerged from the darkness and appeared in front of him requiring a confrontation if 'T' continued onto his Father's girlfriend's house.

[Duchess]

They rioted in LA after the Rodney King verdict, and looking back it didn't seem to change a damn thing. It did however devastate the community and make it that much more difficult for those living in it.

Riots won't change anything, because most of the rioters aren't in it for the cause. They are in it for the mayhem. And once the mob starts this sort of thing can get out of hand in a hurry; there are people on both sides who would pour gasoline on an already volatile situation.

Be very careful what you wish for.

George needs to pay in some fashion for what HE created. I hold him responsible for this entire mess.

I'm a goddamn bitch. What happens down there won't affect me & while I don't live in a gated community I do live behind gates and I have security. The kind of bs that will happen there won't touch my life.

[shitstorm]

I lived in LA during the Rodney King riots. They got Reginald Denny's head bashed in and lots of stores looted and that's about it. Hoodrats got diapers and TVs though!