walking while black - Trayvon Martin

[Midwest Spy]

George is a little dude who felt like a big man with a weapon in his possession. I don't condone fist fighting but a real man would have used his fists. George is a pussy who was on the verge of getting his ass handed to him until he pulled out a gun. He's a fuckin' coward.

Oh well (kinda reminds me of Indiana Jones pulling the gun on the big guy with the whip).

One less thug on the streets.

Probably saved someone's life (in the future) that Trayvon would've eventually snuffed out.

[Duchess]

Probably saved someone's life (in the future) that Trayvon would've eventually snuffed out.

Really? Why do you say that? Because of his FB page? If I went by your online comments I'd think you were the biggest manwhore that ever walked the streets of the mid-West, not to mention I'd think you would bang a snake if you could hold its head still. You are dead set on this kid being guilty of something. The fact is he's guilty of nothing other than taking a shortcut home.

[Midwest Spy]

Probably saved someone's life (in the future) that Trayvon would've eventually snuffed out.

Really? Why do you say that? Because of his FB page? If I went by your online comments I'd think you were the biggest manwhore that ever walked the streets of the mid-West, not to mention I'd think you would bang a snake if you could hold its head still. You are dead set on this kid being guilty of something. The fact is he's guilty of nothing other than taking a shortcut home.

If I wasn't here, you'd miss me.

Look, as far as T is concerned, he had all the makings of somebody who would eventually (if not already) become a criminal. Maybe not all his fault either. His dad apparently didn't care enough to know his whereabouts.

I look at Z's actions that night from the standpoint of a homeowner. Would I be happy someone went 'to bat' for my neighborhood, and would be more than happy to track a potential criminal? Sure would.

This is where I differ from you. I don't think Z did anything illegal that night, and, though I'm not positive, I don't believe he instigated the physical confrontation. Until it's proven differently, that's how I'll view this case.

BTW, I'm way too old and gray to be a manwhore anymore.

[ramseycat]

Probably saved someone's life (in the future) that Trayvon would've eventually snuffed out.

Really? Why do you say that? Because of his FB page? If I went by your online comments I'd think you were the biggest manwhore that ever walked the streets of the mid-West, not to mention I'd think you would bang a snake if you could hold its head still. You are dead set on this kid being guilty of something. The fact is he's guilty of nothing other than taking a shortcut home.

bang a snake if you could hold it's head still!

[Duchess]

I don't believe he instigated the physical confrontation.

Yes, he did, the simple act of following in a sneaky manner instigated this entire mess.

[Midwest Spy]

Probably saved someone's life (in the future) that Trayvon would've eventually snuffed out.

Really? Why do you say that? Because of his FB page? If I went by your online comments I'd think you were the biggest manwhore that ever walked the streets of the mid-West, not to mention I'd think you would bang a snake if you could hold its head still. You are dead set on this kid being guilty of something. The fact is he's guilty of nothing other than taking a shortcut home.

bang a snake if you could hold it's head still!

That's all you got?

If it was remotely funny I'd give you a little credit, but it's not.

Better get back to your Diet Dr. Pepper and Cheetos.

[username]

Zimmerman was a saint!

In 2005, Zimmerman was arrested and charged with "resisting officer with violence" and "battery of law enforcement officer." Both these felonies are considered third-degree. Due to his desperate attempts, the charges were reduced to "resisting officer without violence" and then the only remaining charge was also completely waived off when he entered an alcohol education program.
In the same year (2005), Zimmerman's ex-fiance, Veronica Zuazo, filed a civil motion for a restraining order, alleging domestic violence. In retaliation, Zimmerman filed for a retraining order against Zuazo and both these claims were resolved with both restraining orders granted.
The next year, in 2006, Zimmerman was charged with speeding. However, that case was dismissed because the officer who charged him failed to show up at the court.

[Jimbone]

I don't believe he instigated the physical confrontation.

Yes, he did, the simple act of following in a sneaky manner instigated this entire mess.

So let's say someone lives on a street that dead ends in a cul-de-sac. Living there, one gets to know the cars that come in and out of the street, and who is who. It's basically a nice quiet neighborhood.

Unfortunately, as of late someone has been dumping garbage bags of empty beer cans in a wooded area next to a neighbors house.

One night an unfamiliar car drives in, then slowly comes down the street. Then they turn off the headlights, and stop in front of a neighbors house.

So am I instigating confrontation by going outside and checking to see what they are doing?

[Duchess]

No.

[Midwest Spy]

Zimmerman was a saint!

In 2005, Zimmerman was arrested and charged with "resisting officer with violence" and "battery of law enforcement officer." Both these felonies are considered third-degree. Due to his desperate attempts, the charges were reduced to "resisting officer without violence" and then the only remaining charge was also completely waived off when he entered an alcohol education program.
In the same year (2005), Zimmerman's ex-fiance, Veronica Zuazo, filed a civil motion for a restraining order, alleging domestic violence. In retaliation, Zimmerman filed for a retraining order against Zuazo and both these claims were resolved with both restraining orders granted.
The next year, in 2006, Zimmerman was charged with speeding. However, that case was dismissed because the officer who charged him failed to show up at the court.

I believe I'd like my Neighborhood Watchman to have a little 'edge' to him.

[HairOfTheDog]

Here is the known scenario; it's not a mystery nor is it disputed.

-Zimmerman is doing his neighborhood watch patrol gig.

-He spots a tall young man in a hoodie whom he doesn't recognize.

-The young man is walking (not trying break into a house, not disturbing others, not brandishing a weapon...). He is visiting the area with his father and taking a shortcut home after buying tea and candy and is not in the commission of any crime.
Speculating that Martin was possibly considering committing a crime is silly and irrelevant, imo. There is no evidence to suggest anything of the sort and reading a dead man's mind is impossible.

- Zimmerman calls 911 and reports that he's suspicious of the strange young man walking through the neighborhood and is tracking him.

- 911 operator informs Zimmerman that it's not necessary for him to track the young man and that they're sending PD out to take care of it.

-Zimmerman ignores the 911 dispatcher and follows the young man anyway, after mumbling during the call that "they always get away".

There are conflicting accounts from eye/ear witnesses (pretty standard; multiple eyewitness testimony is often inconsistent and conflicting) as to what happened next. The young man is dead and thus obviously unable to tell his story. The young man, who by the way, couldn't have been one of the "they who always get away" about whom Zimmerman expressed frustration because Martin had never visited the area before. Unless, Zimmerman's "they" was a reference to a type of person rather than individuals that had actually "gotten away" in the past.

The unknown details within the known scenario and what evidence reveals most likely happened during those minutes before, during and after the shooting is all that matters at this point. JMO...

Again, I like reading the opinions, theories and such; just re-iterating the confirmed scenario and facts.

[Midwest Spy]

The young man, who by the way, couldn't have been one of the "they who always get away" about whom Zimmerman expressed frustration because Martin had never visited the area before. Unless, Zimmerman's "they" was a reference to a type of person rather than individuals that had actually "gotten away" in the past.

I'm fairly comfortable with the scenario you've listed as fact, except for what I've highlighted.

How do you know he'd never cut through there before? I hadn't read that anywhere.

And, yes, I'm sure he was profiling.

[HairOfTheDog]

The young man, who by the way, couldn't have been one of the "they who always get away" about whom Zimmerman expressed frustration because Martin had never visited the area before. Unless, Zimmerman's "they" was a reference to a type of person rather than individuals that had actually "gotten away" in the past.

I'm fairly comfortable with the scenario you've listed as fact, except for what I've highlighted.

How do you know he'd never cut through there before? I hadn't read that anywhere.

And, yes, I'm sure he was profiling.

Trayvon had just arrived in the area to visit Mr. Martin's girlfriend.

Seems unlikely, but I guess it's possible that Trayvon had cut through there sometime before during the short time since he arrived in the area - though that's not been reported. I see your point.

However, if he had done so, Trayvon had never encountered Zimmerman before. Even in Zimmerman's version of events, Trayvon was a stranger to him and not someone he recognized as having eluded him in the past.

[Jimbone]

Trayvon was a stranger to him and not someone he recognized as having eluded him in the past.

Important note to take from this comment: there had been a recent rash of break-ins in this neighborhood, and that's why Zimmerman was helping do a neighborhood watch.

A Hooded person walking through a neighborhood experiencing a rash of thefts would be considered suspicious to me.

[Midwest Spy]

Trayvon was a stranger to him and not someone he recognized as having eluded him in the past.

Important note to take from this comment: there had been a recent rash of break-ins in this neighborhood, and that's why Zimmerman was helping do a neighborhood watch.

A Hooded person walking through a neighborhood experiencing a rash of thefts would be considered suspicious to me.

Careful, JimBone, you're gonna start being confused with me, and the L.O.M. will be on you like stink on shit.

[Duchess]

Now we are back to him being suspicious looking because he was wearing a hoodie?

[Jimbone]

His hoodie was really irrelevant, I just threw it in there to stir it up. Anyone unfamiliar walking around a neighborhood that is experiencing break-ins is suspicious.

Just like the unfamiliar car parked on the street experiencing garbage dumping being suspicious. Cars always have hoods, so I am not profiling them

[HairOfTheDog]

Trayvon was a stranger to him and not someone he recognized as having eluded him in the past.

Important note to take from this comment: there had been a recent rash of break-ins in this neighborhood, and that's why Zimmerman was helping do a neighborhood watch.

A Hooded person walking through a neighborhood experiencing a rash of thefts would be considered suspicious to me.

I don't think it's an issue that Zimmerman considered a stranger in the area to be suspicious under the circumstances. He rightly called 911 and they told them that PD would be coming to handle it. That's where it should have ended, imo. Zimmerman was a "watch" person, not a member of the PD.

[Jimbone]

I don't think it's an issue that Zimmerman considered a stranger in the area to be suspicious under the circumstances. He rightly called 911 and they told them that PD would be coming to handle it. That's where it should have ended, imo. Zimmerman was a "watch" person, not a member of the PD.

If I'm not mistaken, isn't Zimmerman claiming he was on his way back to his truck (after being told by 9-1-1 they didn't need him to follow) when the confrontation occurred? Isn't the narrative that he lost sight of Martin and Martin came up on him while walking through the apartments to his vehicle?

[Midwest Spy]

I don't think it's an issue that Zimmerman considered a stranger in the area to be suspicious under the circumstances. He rightly called 911 and they told them that PD would be coming to handle it. That's where it should have ended, imo. Zimmerman was a "watch" person, not a member of the PD.

If I'm not mistaken, isn't Zimmerman claiming he was on his way back to his truck (after being told by 9-1-1 they didn't need him to follow) when the confrontation occurred? Isn't the narrative that he lost sight of Martin and Martin came up on him while walking through the apartments to his vehicle?

Some folks don't like that narrative.