GUNS DON'T KILL PEOPLE, OR DO THEY?

[Duchess]

We need the ability to protect our families at all costs, when the shit hits the fan there will be no cops to protect you.

Michelle Obama feels the same way.

[HairOfTheDog]

We need the ability to protect our families at all costs, when the shit hits the fan there will be no cops to protect you. The LA riots can happen anywhere.

I understand what you're saying.

But, what guns you can legally buy and where you can carry them is something determined by the voters and legislators in California, not at the Federal level.

The only impact of the Executive Actions on law-abiding buyers is that there will be fewer options to purchase a gun legally without having to undergo a background check.

[username]

We need the ability to protect our families at all costs, when the shit hits the fan there will be no cops to protect you. The LA riots can happen anywhere.

What do gun owners "need"? A semi-automatic? A huge supply of ammo and high capacity magazines? That's what gets me. I don't mind gun ownership but when you're purchasing weapons that are designed for mass casualties...I don't want those types of weapons in my neighborhood. And where does it stop? Fully automatic weapons are illegal (I believe). I'd like to extend that down to what a person reasonably needs to defend themselves from an armed intruder or two plus what a hunter or sportsperson reasonably needs for his hobby.

*sigh* I'm sick of repeating myself on this topic. The second amendment is not clearly written and there are many arguments about what the founding fathers intended when they wrote that. There were at least one or two versions before they landed on what we read today. It's my personal belief that most of them, if they were alive today, would say "whoa...dude. This isn't what we had in mind. Different era and all that".

[BigMark]

They would end women's suffrage.

[HairOfTheDog]

Snip of the editorial by Barrack Obama featured last week in the New York Times (released the day after the Gun Violence Town Hall).



THE epidemic of gun violence in our country is a crisis. Gun deaths and injuries constitute one of the greatest threats to public health and to the safety of the American people. Every year, more than 30,000 Americans have their lives cut short by guns. Suicides. Domestic violence. Gang shootouts. Accidents. Hundreds of thousands of Americans have lost brothers and sisters, or buried their own children. We’re the only advanced nation on earth that sees this kind of mass violence with this frequency.

A national crisis like this demands a national response. Reducing gun violence will be hard. It’s clear that common-sense gun reform won’t happen during this Congress. It won’t happen during my presidency. Still, there are steps we can take now to save lives. And all of us — at every level of government, in the private sector and as citizens — have to do our part.

[HairOfTheDog]

(continued)

All of us have a role to play — including gun owners. We need the vast majority of responsible gun owners who grieve with us after every mass shooting, who support common-sense gun safety and who feel that their views are not being properly represented, to stand with us and demand that leaders heed the voices of the people they are supposed to represent.The gun industry also needs to do its part. And that starts with manufacturers.

As Americans, we hold consumer goods to high standards to keep our families and communities safe. Cars have to meet safety and emissions requirements. Food has to be clean and safe. We will not end the cycle of gun violence until we demand that the gun industry take simple actions to make its products safer as well. If a child can’t open a bottle of aspirin, we should also make sure she can’t pull the trigger of a gun.

Yet today, the gun industry is almost entirely unaccountable. Thanks to the gun lobby’s decades of efforts, Congress has blocked our consumer products safety experts from being able to require that firearms have even the most basic safety measures. They’ve made it harder for the government’s public health experts to conduct research on gun violence. They’ve guaranteed that manufacturers enjoy virtual immunity from lawsuits, which means that they can sell lethal products and rarely face consequences. As parents, we wouldn’t put up with this if we were talking about faulty car seats. Why should we tolerate it for products — guns — that kill so many children each year?

All of us need to demand leaders brave enough to stand up to the gun lobby’s lies. All of us need to stand up and protect our fellow citizens. All of us need to demand that governors, mayors and our representatives in Congress do their part.

Change will be hard. It won’t happen overnight. But securing a woman’s right to vote didn’t happen overnight. The liberation of African-Americans didn’t happen overnight. Advancing the rights of lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender Americans has taken decades’ worth of work.

Those moments represent American democracy, and the American people, at our best. Meeting this crisis of gun violence will require the same relentless focus, over many years, at every level. If we can meet this moment with that same audacity, we will achieve the change we seek. And we will leave a stronger, safer country to our children.

Full piece: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/08/opinio....html?_r=0

[sally]

That black son of a bitch! How dare he.

[SIXFOOTERsez]

You really want to make a dent in gun violence then open up some mental health resources to do something about suicides and do something about the gangs, that would remove 75% of the gun deaths

[HairOfTheDog]

You really want to make a dent in gun violence then open up some mental health resources to do something about suicides and do something about the gangs, that would remove 75% of the gun deaths

It's refreshing to see a gun owner in here agreeing with Obama's Executive Actions, Six. Addressing that 75% of annual gun deaths is a focus of his Executive Actions.

-$500 million is to be directed at addressing and preventing gun violence by mentally ill people, and helping the states to report the records of people who are deemed dangers to themselves and others to the FBI / NICS without fear of violating privacy protections.

-The ATF will have more resources and a greater focus on illegal gun trafficking, by gangs and other criminal elements, so that those laws can be more aggressively enforced.

And, with the expanded dealer licensing requirements, if LE determines who put the gun into the hands of the gang members (or any other criminals), the dealers can be pursued more aggressively too if they transferred/sold the guns without first getting a cleared background check on the buyers/recipients. Initiating more programs to help criminals (gang members and otherwise) focus on cleaning up their acts before release is also proposed.

The other 25%, or some 7,500 gun deaths per year in the U.S. (non-gang related murder, unintentional negligent shootings, small children pulling the trigger and killing themselves or others...) are, of course, no less important. More background checks, more mental health focus, more aggressive enforcement of laws on illegal sellers/buyers, smart gun technology investment, and requests for child safety features on guns are part of the Executive Action plan aimed at reducing such gun violence.

[F.U.]

No one wants to take your guns they said. . . A BILL to be entitled an Act to amend Article 4 of Chapter 11 of Title 16 of the O.C.G.A., relating to dangerous instrumentalities and practices, so as to prohibit the possession, sale, transport, distribution, or use of certain assault weapons, large capacity magazines, armor-piercing bullets, and incendiary .50 caliber bullets; to provide for crimes involving the possession, sale, transport, distribution, or use of certain assault weapons, large capacity magazines, armor-piercing bullets, and incendiary .50 caliber bullets; to provide for criminal penalties; to designate certain weaponry and ammunition as contraband and to require seizure of such by the Georgia Bureau of Investigation; to provide for related matters; to repeal conflicting laws; and for other purposes.

PROHIBIT THE POSSESSION ! Sounds like taking our guns to me!

http://www.legis.ga.gov/Legislation/en-U...016/HB/731

[HairOfTheDog]

That's a Georgia state bill, F.U., not a proposed federal law or regulation to take everybody's guns.

As you know, there are already a bunch of states that have long banned certain types of guns and ammo, and a couple of states that also require registration of guns. Carry laws also vary from state to state. State-specific gun control/law is nothing new.

If Georgia state passes that bill into law, it likely would not be ruled a violation of the Second Amendment by the Supreme Court if challenged, in my opinion, because the legislation doesn't propose banning all firearms used for sport and defense, just certain types of firearms and ammo.

[F.U.]

Yes I know all that, but that's how it starts. One state decides to take away our rights and gets away with it. Then another state does it and another and another until it is that way across the country. This is the reason we fight every little change, no matter how small it is. Once the snowball starts rolling down the hill it is almost impossible to stop. The phrase for the day class is . . . wait for it . . . Slippery slope. So like I said many times and was told that I was wrong, they want to take away our guns.

[HairOfTheDog]

I don't speak for everyone else, but I know there are some people who'd like to see certain types of guns and ammo banned from society. They're honest about it here at Mock, in the media, in Congress, throughout society...

But, I don't know if I've ever once come across a person who said that there should be no guns whatsoever legally available to qualified U.S. citizens. That would in fact be a violation of the Second Amendment and an extreme position that I can't see ever becoming a reality in the U.S. or most other developed countries.

Times and views and needs change. I don't see all changes related to gun control and gun safety as being a slippery slope to total disarmament and martial law or anything like that. But, I understand that you and others see it differently. So it goes.

Anyway, nothing in Obama's Executive Actions bans any guns or ammo. And, the Georgia bill is not unique; it's the elected officials of the states' right to decide, not the right of national gun enthusiasts or the gun lobby. But, I don't think the Georgia bill will be passed anyhow.

I saw that Georgia House Speaker Ralston made clear Friday that legislation calling for an all-out state ban on “assault weapons” will not be considered on his watch. I'll be very surprised if the bill garners enough support in gun-friendly Georgia to pass both the state's Senate and the House. We'll see.

[F.U.]

I don't believe any firearms should be restricted. We should be allowed to own anything we want and as many of them as we want. Its not the weapon that does the damage, its the person behind it. SO if someone is bad, slap their hand, but don't spank me because someone else MIGHT be bad.

[Duchess]

If HotD hadn't followed the link and read what it had to say and then posted about it I would have thought by your reaction of "I told you so" that they were enacting a new law in your state and were coming to take your guns like you have insisted all along will happen. It's not your state and it probably won't come to pass anyway. Why are you agitated?!

I hope I read that correctly.

[F.U.]

Because it is a attempt at gun grabbing and I don't like it. Just because it doesn't directly effect me don't mean I say nothing.



First they came for the assault rifles, and I did not speak out - because I had no assault rifles;
Then they came for the handguns, and I did not speak out - because I had no handguns;
Then they came for the pump shotguns, and I did not speak out - because I had no pump shotguns;
Then they came for all shotguns, and I did not speak out - because I had no shotguns;
Then they came for ALL guns and me- and there was no one left to speak out for guns and me.

[Duchess]

Ain't nobody gonna take yur guns, mister.

[F.U.]

Cant be sure of that Duch. That's why we fight every inch of the way.

[Duchess]

I don't see it as fighting, I see it as paranoia. I say that in general, it's not necessarily directed at you.

[blueberryhill]

I don't see it as fighting, I see it as paranoia. I say that in general, it's not necessarily directed at you.

Of course it is paranoia and I have suggested many times, that those with similar feelings, need to go on meds......

We all give up conveniences, sacrifice certain things, etc. for the good of the masses.....We can grumble, whine, and complain, but that is how the cookie crumbles.....I don't like to be patted down when I take one of my rare airline trips, but it is for good of the majority, and my own personal inconvenience is really meaningless, in the overall scheme of the World.
I say this also, in a general way, but if the shoe fits........