OSCAR PISTORIUS MURDER TRIAL: the blade runner oscar pistorius shoots girlfriend

[Eat Shit And Die]

I knew it was recentish.

[OnBendedKnee]

Hang him by the legs until dead.

Does South Africa have the death penalty?

No, it was abolished 1995.

Just having to live in the country is punishment enough.

[HairOfTheDog]

The Defense (Attorney Rioux) definitely had a better day than the Prosecution/Police (Detective Botha) at the bail hearing today. The issue of bail wasn't decided today; the hearing will continue tomorrow.

Recap:
-Police (Botha) said that Pistorius didn't call them for help; they found two phones in the house and neither had been used for that purpose. But, Rioux said that Pistorius called the complex security guard at 3:19 am and then Netcare (like 911) a minute later on a phone that police didn't know about.

-Police said they found a couple of boxes of testosterone and syringes in the house, but Rioux said it's not testosterone but an herbal supplement that's perfectly legal.

-Police said they want Pistorius charged for having 38 caliber bullets in a home; a crime in that he doesn't have a license for the ammo and no 38, but Rioux said it was Pisotrius's dad's ammo.

-Police said that a witness heard a woman scream, saw light on, heard more shots; Rioux questioned how any neighbor could hear from so far away and pointed out the woman claimed to hear more shots than were fired.

-Police said Pisotrius's family were searching the house for docs and a memory stick related to offshore accounts and a house owned by Pistorius in Italy (increasing flight risk), but Rioux said there's no house in Italy and asked how Pistorius could be a flight risk given his physical condition and the fact that he is so easily recognized.

-Police said that Pisotrius had discharged a weapon in a South African restaurant in the past but had a friend take the fall; Rioux denied that it was Pistorius who fired that gun.

-Police said that Pistorius had been arrested before after a call from another girlfriend regarding domestic assault at the house; Rioux reminded them that no charges were filed and that Pistorius is suing for false allegations (Botha was the LE who responded to that call and believed Pistorius at the time).

-Rioux said that his forensics team had found a bullet in the toilet at Pistorius's house which was missed by police forensic investigators; Botha conceded that was true.

-When questioned, Botha admitted that while he believes the trajectory of bullets went downward so Pistorius had to be wearing his legs, he could be wrong.

-The cricket bat was used to bust open the bathroom door - both sides agree. (Looks like the story about crushed skull was false; autopsy showed no signs of a physical assault.)

-Autopsy showed empty bladder; Rioux claims that means Reeva had just used the toilet.

Based on today's hearing, looks like police haven't done their homework well. They really should have known that Pistorius called for help, but they say no one at the house volunteered info about another phone (that's dumb; they should have called the paramedic agency that came to the home and checked for all calls received related to the incident, imo). Also odd that they missed a bullet in the bathroom.

References:
http://www.citypress.co.za/news/state-vs...said-what/
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/feb...ase-police-
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/21/world/....html?_r=0

[Midwest Spy]

Does any of this mean you've changed your mind as to what happened, HotD?

[HairOfTheDog]

Does any of this mean you've changed your mind as to what happened, HotD?

I'm trying to stay open-minded, but I find the burglar/intruder mistaken identity defense very very hard to believe.

If you were sleeping and thought you heard a burglar in the toilet making noise (which is illogical itself), wouldn't you wake your lover if you thought she was right next to you and your main concern was her safety and your own, like he claims? I would. I think anyone under that belief would have first asked her if she was okay, maybe told her to get outta the house, called 911... not just start firing through the bathroom door. Also, if he yelled out before shooting like he claims, I think she would have responded.

He either shot her on purpose, or he was so wasted and paranoid that he acted wholly irresponsibly. At minimum, he's guilty of voluntary manslaughter, but it's much more likely he killed her intentionally, in my opinion.

Based on the testimony today, I do feel that the police need to up their game to get to the truth.

[Eat Shit And Die]

He's a jealous bastard, shes a selfish cunt who wouldn't donate him one of her good legs, so he tried to just take'em.

[NightOwl]

After to-day I think he is going to be granted bail, I am not happy how this bail hearing is going. I also think after he is bailed out he'll flee, yes good old daddy will want him to. He went to Seychelles with Samantha Taylor who was a former girlfriend before Reeva. Seychelles is predominately French in the Indian Ocean of the east coast of Africa continent, there seems to be no extradition there, possibly no extradition from Italy even.

I feel so sorry for Reeva Steenkamp's family, this is ridiculous laughing in the court about his legs and fleeing, suggesting our precious athlete would never run. I don't think this bail business is a laughing matter.
Reeva's family didn't deserve this!

I'd like to know if there was a message to Reeva on the Ipad or cell phone.

I agree with HotD, that by gosh if there is a burglar in your home the very first thing you do is get your loved one to safety, preferably out of the house. Burglar's just don't hide in bathrooms and lock doors.

He's guilty IMO.

[Eat Shit And Die]

if they bail him its a fucking joke.

[Eat Shit And Die]

biggest fastest half machine flight risk ever.

[HairOfTheDog]

The 3^rd day of the bail hearing was strange.

I think the Prosecution made the strongest points today overall, but it seems like maybe Judge Nair is considering downgrading the charges to culpable homicide.

At the same time, Nair seems to take the possibility of flight risk very seriously with Pistorius, despite the defense trying to laugh it off as absurd. Nair also expressed concern about witness intimidation and lack of accountability.

Imo, the defense isn't really arguing that Pistorius didn't shoot the gun in the restaurant incident (and then influence his friend to take the blame) as police allege; Rioux claimed today that he didn't ask Pistorius about it - doubtful. If Pistorius hadn't shot the gun, I think the defense would be arguing hard about it and tearing into police. I don't think Rioux wants to open that can of worms because in that incident there were witnesses who could come forward and change their stories; Pistorius shot that gun and asked witnesses to lie about it. JMO. The allegation itself is really hurting Pistorius.

Bail hearing resumes tomorrow, the prosecution didn't get to finish its argument today.


Lead Investigator, Hilton Botha, to be dropped from case?
Detective Botha's flip-flop testimony and sloppy evidence in court yesterday really hurt the prosecution, imo. Turns out, Botha's under investigation for 7 counts of attempted murder (along with two other officers) related to an on-the-job shooting at a mini-bus back in 2011. I think he'll be removed from the case. I hope so anyway. Whether Botha is a great officer or otherwise, IDK, but he can be used by the defense and be a liability to the prosecution either way. Considering his poor performance thus far, the fact that he arrested Pistorius in the other assault case, and his pending trial, the prosecution should avoid opening the door to a Mark Fuhrman type scenario, in my opinion.

Flight Risk?
Of most interest to me today was Pistorius's immediate concern for finding the memory stick with the offshore account information. Also, the home in Italy. If the offshore accounts are really nothing, as the defense claimed yesterday, why would Pisotrius and his family be so focused on them right after the killing?

Regarding the home in Italy, the prosecution scored on that today. Pistorius is quoted in a magazine article interview last year as saying that he does in fact have a house there. He spent 4 months a year training in Italy and was gifted the house by a mayor.

The prosecution continued to use the fact that Pistorius is famous and recognizable as reasons that he's not a flight risk. Weak argument, imo. Those things also make him more able to use his money and connections to creatively flee. Roman Polanski was very recognizable when he fled to Europe to avoid trial in the US for statutory rape charges like 40 years ago. His alleged victim is probably a senior citizen by now and he's never seen the inside of the US courtroom to face those rape charges.

Ref:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/blog/201...e-coverage

Update:
Botha has officially been removed.
http://www.citypress.co.za/news/lead-inv...e-removed/

[Maggot]

biggest fastest half machine flight risk ever.

[Jimbone]

Unless they have video of him doing it, Pistorious is going to walk like he actually had legs.

This case is over.

[HairOfTheDog]

Unless they have video of him doing it, Pistorious is going to walk like he actually had legs.

This case is over.

I don't think so. He may face lesser charges, but he'll do some time. Nothing is going to justify shooting through the bathroom door without taking any other rational measures first, in my opinion.

Prosecution argued again today that even if Pistorius thought it was an intruder in the toilet, he planned to kill whoever was on the other side when there were other courses of action at his disposal. They also argued how illogical it was to assume that it was an intruder and not to check on Reeva first.

[Duchess]

Some of this is so disheartening.

[Eat Shit And Die]

I hope they confiscate his legs and smack his botty.

[Jimbone]

South Africa is rife with corruption. Trust me, he'll walk for a variety of reasons... money being the biggest one.

[HairOfTheDog]

South Africa is rife with corruption. Trust me, he'll walk for a variety of reasons... money being the biggest one.

I'd actually bet that you're wrong on this one, Jim.

I don't think there's any way in hell that Pistorius is gonna walk without jail time. Way too high-profile, the world is watching, Pistorius killed a famous woman who was also a public speaker working to minimize violence against women and children...

[Jimbone]

The world watched OJ too.

[HairOfTheDog]

The world watched OJ too.

Sure, but if he'd shot Nicole and Ron in his own home and neighbors had rushed over before he had time to get away or stage a scene, it would have been a completely different case.

Prosecutors didn't prove beyond reasonable doubt to the jury that OJ was at Nicole's house at all that night. And, unfortunately, DNA evidence was relatively new and not well understood by juries (or easily presented by experts). OJ didn't get off with the world watching as a result of corruption.

On the other hand, there's no doubt who shot and killed Reeva Steemkamp. I don't think Oscar can buy his way out of killing her with the world watching, and I don't think he'll be able to assassinate the character of Reeva like OJ did poor Nicole.

[Jimbone]

OJ got off by good lawyers making big issue out of police errors, character assassination of police investigators and methods, and taking advantage of prosecutor mistakes.

We're not even really into this case yet, and how many of those factors have already occurred in favor of the defense for Pistorious?

All of them.

I hope you are right however. If he killed her intentionally it'd be a shame for someone to get away with such a heinous crime.