walking while black - Trayvon Martin

[HairOfTheDog]

Why didn't he choose to testify and give his version of events at the time? Because of a fear of further incriminating himself? Because he seems to be doing a good job of that himself in the period leading up to the trial.

Can't say for sure why the defense waived the immunity hearing.

IMO, it's most likely that the defense was not confident that the judge would have granted George immunity from prosecution under SYG.

If Zimmerman had chosen to testify at a SYG hearing and been denied immunity under the law, the Murder 2 case would have moved to trial anyway.

The state would then have had the benefit of seeing the defense's cards at the immunity hearing and could use that information in preparing its prosecution case.

Kinda like legal poker.

[Duchess]

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/hearing...?showAds=0

Will this link be the same place that I should look for trial coverage, Adub?

[HairOfTheDog]

^ That's a good link that Adub provided, Duchess. Here are a couple of more that are streaming live as well.

LIVE STREAM LINKS OF ZIMMERMAN PRE-TRIAL HEARINGS AND MURDER 2 TRIAL

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/hearing...?showAds=0

http://abcnews.go.com/US/video/george-zi...e-19331255

http://wildabouttrial.com/george-zimmerm...tream.html


Final pre-trial hearings scheduled for 6/6/13 and 6/7/13.

Trial begins (with jury selection process) on Monday 6/10/13.

[Duchess]

^ That's a good link that Adub provided, Duchess. Here are a couple of more that will be streaming live as well.

Thank you!

[Adub]

This frye hearing shit is boring. I'm out of here. If George was yelling help it was because he wanted help restraining Trayvon. Period.

[username]

It IS boring!

[HairOfTheDog]

There's a new thread at the top of the Cell Block forum index; it contains key references related to the shooting of Trayvon Martin and the George Zimmerman murder trial.

Many have been posted throughout this thread and are now centralized here:

GEORGE ZIMMERMAN:KEY DOCS/AUDIO/VIDEO
http://mockforums.net/thread-10140.html

[LytoMe]

If you watch the video of Zimmerman going through the events of that night, and really listen to his voice. There is no doubt it was him screaming for help.

[HairOfTheDog]

If you watch the video of Zimmerman going through the events of that night, and really listen to his voice. There is no doubt it was him screaming for help.

Hard for me to tell. I don't know what Trayvon's voice sounded like to compare.

The defense is trying to block the voice recognition experts from testifying at trial. During the Frye Hearing today, they called an FBI audio engineer to testify that it was impossible to determine who was screaming in the back of the witness 911 calls.

The defense argued that the voice recognition/analysis technology isn't generally accepted enough to be presented. Tomorrow, the prosecution will counter that point and likely call other experts who will explain why they think it's possible to identify or eliminate the source of the screams with an acceptable degree of confidence.

Here's what the Martin family attorney, Crump, had to say to the media today:
“It is ridiculous for the Zimmerman defense team to argue that expert voice analysts should not be permitted to testify at the trial when George Zimmerman himself stated the voice crying for help on the 911 recording “doesn't even sound like me,’".

I keep in mind that Trayvon Martin's dad said it wasn't his son when he heard to original version of the tape too.

Anyway, will be interesting to see if Nelson allows the technology and experts in, or if she rules them out and leaves the jury to analyze the screams themselves. The tape itself will definitely be presented as evidence at trial.

We should also learn tomorrow what, if any, terms/phrases will be banned from use by prosecutors and whether the final jury selected (6 jurors and 4 alternates) will be sequestered or not.

Rulings today:
-Judge Nelson denied a defense motion to keep some defense witnesses anonymous.
-Nelson also stopped the testimony related to defense's request for sanctions against the state for discovery violations; it was personal and ugly in that courtroom. She'll address the issue after trial.

[Adub]

If you watch the video of Zimmerman going through the events of that night, and really listen to his voice. There is no doubt it was him screaming for help.

I really do not care who was yelling for help. If it was George, well he was having trouble restraining Trayvon. As evidenced by his words to Witness 13, when W13 asked George if he needed to call 911. George did not want W13 to call 911, he wanted help in restraining the dead kid.

Dang, that is harsh. Tells me that George's mind was on one track. Making sure that Trayvon did not get away before LE arrived. He was dead for crying out loud. Trayvon just took a bullet right through the heart.


The reenactment is bunk.


But the wailing ended absolutely with the gunshot. That is powerful. And has GZ's guts all in a tangle, I bet. IBS.

[Adub]

Pictures: George Zimmerman back in court for pre-trial hearing


check out #20

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/nati...otogallery

[Adub]

I keep in mind that Trayvon Martin's dad said it wasn't his son when he heard to original version of the tape too.

How about keeping in mind that George's father had to listen to it a second time to recognize George's voice. Then he testified that he had heard George yelling like that many times in the past? George's father testified that he knew it was his son's voice because he had heard his son yelling like that many times in the past? The whole family is a bunch of friggin liars, GMAB!

And please give Tracy Martin a friggin break, he heard the tape only days after his son was killed. Maybe the no meant, NO!!!!! this can't be real! Anyway , it will all come out in court, during the trial. Love to hear Mr Zimmerman Sr explain why he had heard George screaming bloody murder many times in the past. During George's formative years, I would assume.

[username]

Whatever happens, it's pretty clear to me that shooting Trayvon was a major over reaction and if the law allows Z to slide on that, the law is fucked up. I won't necessarily blame Z, I'll blame whatever laws make that type of shooting ok.

[username]

If you watch the video of Zimmerman going through the events of that night, and really listen to his voice. There is no doubt it was him screaming for help.

If it's that obvious, why does the defense want voice recognition excluded?

[HairOfTheDog]

How about keeping in mind that George's father had to listen to it a second time to recognize George's voice.

And please give Tracy Martin a friggin break, he heard the tape only days after his son was killed.

Keeping it all in mind, Adub.

It isn't a stellar quality audio tape.

I mentioned Trayvon's dad because he was the closest thing to a voice for Trayvon himself. Objectively, George said the voice didn't sound like his own and Tracy couldn't originally identify the voice as Trayvon's.

Those are the facts. There's nothing disparaging towards Tracy Martin involved in that statement.

Keep in mind, I've said for a long while that I disagree with the legal pundits who believe that the screams on the 911 tape are the pivotal evidence in this case. I think it will be the forensics and how they match up (or don't match up) to Zimmerman's version of events. That and George's believability in his statements and in his testimony, should he take the stand.

Assuming they're allowed to testify: unless the voice recognition experts are very confident and convincing about who they hear and what they hear, and each side's experts don't simply cancel each other out, my opinion on that will remain the same.

[HairOfTheDog]

Pre-trial hearings continue to today.

911 Screams - Voice Recognition Experts - Decision still pending

Attorneys in the George Zimmerman second-degree murder case will return to court this morning to continue a hearing on whether jurors will hear testimony about who was heard screaming in the background of a 911 call before Trayvon Martin was shot.

Circuit Judge Debra Nelson has been hearing testimony on the issue since Thursday, and the defense still has three more witnesses to call. Testimony will resume 9:30 a.m.

Yesterday, the judge heard lengthy testimony from two voice identification analysts the state hopes to call as experts in Zimmerman's trial, which starts Monday.

That included the most controversial state expert: Alan R. Reich, who says it was likely Trayvon screaming in the background of the call, and claims to be able to decipher what the teen and Zimmerman were saying.

Reich reiterated that "the words that were at a scream level were almost all" Trayvon, but also testified that his results shouldn't be treated as conclusive, due to the low quality of the audio.

In a report he prepared on the case, Reich said that he could hear Trayvon cry out "I'm begging you" in the background of the call, and shout "stop" just before the fatal shot was fired.

Before Reich, Nelson heard from Tom Owen, a New Jersey based voice expert who analyzed the 911 audio for the Orlando Sentinel last year, ruling out Zimmerman as the voice in the call.

Owen cautioned that his findings were only "probable," and also admitted on cross examination that he has a financial stake in the software he used to analyze the recording.

Nelson still has to rule on whether Owen and Reich and meet the burden to testify for the state in Zimmerman's trial, which starts with jury selection on Monday. The defense argues they're using unproven methods to reach their conclusions.

Full story:
http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/loca...4051.story

[Cynical Ninja]

In a report he prepared on the case, Reich said that he could hear Trayvon cry out "I'm begging you" in the background of the call, and shout "stop" just before the fatal shot was fired.

If that is in any way true that really is horrendous, shooting an unarmed teenager begging for his life?

Jesus.

[HairOfTheDog]

Time Line of the events / Feb. 26, 2012



Time line of key dates in the case (following the shooting) can be found here:
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-5...of-events/

(also added to the GEORGE ZIMMERMAN TRIAL reference thread)

[Adub]

I watched the Frye hearing today. It was funny. I laughed a lot. They didn't finish, so on it goes.

O'Mara has filed for a continuance, once again.

Jury selections starts Monday.

Judge Nelson's hair is looking better and better every time I see her. She nixed the bangs and it looks all shiny and silky.

West had to nudge George a few times, looked like he was falling asleep. But, I think maybe he had his cell phone down near his crotch. And George was bored. He sure was looking down there a lot.

The defense expert, George Doddington, had nothing to add. Except that he is not an expert, never testified in court before, and knows nothing about speech identification.

He is an electrical engineer. Once worked for Texas Instruments, and not sure where he works now. After hours and hours of watching him testify I had not a clue as to why.

His greatest contribution was to say that Reich and Owen (State experts) were ridiculous. And lacked common sense. But he never really explained why. After awhile I did not even care why.

[Adub]

The same guy who had the exclusive on W8, has Trayvon's voice from a cell phone video. He sure sounds black.

http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/video/exclusiv...n-19352398