Mock

(03-24-2012, 10:30 PM)Kip Wrote: [ -> ]... or the Christian & Newsom kids who wandered a few miles off course. Ooops... sorry, you can't ask them, they're dead.

That was one of the most horrific crimes ever and the media silence on it was deafening...bastards!

(03-25-2012, 09:35 AM)Duchess Wrote: [ -> ]

I didn't take the time to go back and check who asked this but I read he was suspended for being tardy.

I read it was for being in an unauthorized area.

(03-24-2012, 11:30 AM)Cracker Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-24-2012, 11:15 AM)Duchess Wrote: [ -> ]

I don't bat an eye when druggies kill each other, I don't give a fuck. This story is different and can't be compared to street thugs & their murdering ways.

This is my point. All the kids who are killed every-fucking-day are not druggies. They are people going somewhere or on their way home from somewhere or just standing around...

Putting one tragedy in the spotlight, and getting off our collective asses to change it, is Maytee-like behavior.

I think what is fundamentally different about this story is the appearance of institutional racism or abuse of power from those entrusted to protect. That's a totally different animal than someone getting shot by a drive-by shooting.

(03-25-2012, 09:46 AM)Adub Wrote: [ -> ]I read it was for being in an unauthorized area.

I'm not saying you're wrong, Adub, I'm just backing up my claim with what I read.

Martin's parents kept a close eye on him, but they didn't have to be too strict, since he stayed out of trouble, Collins said. However, he had recently been suspended from school for five days for tardiness, his English teacher, Michelle Kypriss, told the Orlando Sentinel.

Story

(03-24-2012, 06:53 PM)Cracker Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-24-2012, 06:49 PM)sally Wrote: [ -> ]I don't have a neighborhood watch and don't want one. I don't feel the need to have some asshole going gung ho on every nigger that walks down the street.

I made sure I live in a neighborhood that is relatively crime-free. MF thinks it's racist that I want to live in a white neighborhood, but I can go away for a weekend and not have to worry about being robbed. Five miles down the road, if people leave for a weekend they come home and find their air conditioning units gone.

I don't think it's racist that you want to live in a white neighborhood. I want to live in a predominantly white neighborhood. Most of us want to live around people that share our appearances, with similar cultural practices, etc. It's a comfort many animals share. Racism traces back to tribes having good reason to fear other tribes.

(03-25-2012, 10:05 AM)Middle Finger Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-24-2012, 06:53 PM)Cracker Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-24-2012, 06:49 PM)sally Wrote: [ -> ]I don't have a neighborhood watch and don't want one. I don't feel the need to have some asshole going gung ho on every nigger that walks down the street.

I made sure I live in a neighborhood that is relatively crime-free. MF thinks it's racist that I want to live in a white neighborhood, but I can go away for a weekend and not have to worry about being robbed. Five miles down the road, if people leave for a weekend they come home and find their air conditioning units gone.

I don't think it's racist that you want to live in a white neighborhood. I want to live in a predominantly white neighborhood. Most of us want to live around people that share our appearances, with similar cultural practices, etc. It's a comfort many animals share. Racism traces back to tribes having good reason to fear other tribes.

You think she is racist because that is how she comes across on here. We ALL think she is racist.

(03-25-2012, 10:03 AM)Duchess Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-25-2012, 09:46 AM)Adub Wrote: [ -> ]I read it was for being in an unauthorized area.

I'm not saying you're wrong, Adub, I'm just backing up my claim with what I read.

Martin's parents kept a close eye on him, but they didn't have to be too strict, since he stayed out of trouble, Collins said. However, he had recently been suspended from school for five days for tardiness, his English teacher, Michelle Kypriss, told the Orlando Sentinel.

Story

Trayvon's dad evidently is telling a different story.

“Tray was a beautiful child. He was raised to have manners and be respectful. He was a teenager who still had a lot of kid in him,” his father, Tracy Martin, 45, said. “He still loved to go to Chuck E. Cheese with his cousins and would bake them chocolate chip cookies when he was babysitting them.”
Still, Trayvon had nonviolent behavioral issues in school, and on the day he was killed, he had been suspended for 10 days from Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School in North Miami-Dade. “He was not suspended for something dealing with violence or anything like that. It wasn’t a crime he committed, but he was in an unauthorized area [on school property],” Martin said, declining to offer more details.

(03-25-2012, 10:05 AM)Middle Finger Wrote: [ -> ]Racism traces back to tribes having good reason to fear other tribes.

I'm not sure this situation, or deciding where you live, goes back this far but it can easily be applied in common terms. People do make personal safety judgments based on their own experiences and what they see around them.

The comments about an "undercurrent" in this thread are almost funny. I stated plainly why people fear a certain stereotype. There is no way to undo what happened to that kid, but people can try to make sure it doesn't happen again by understanding what happened and why.

Should we take everybody's handguns away? Should we outlaw hoodies? Should we keep our young adults inside the house at night? Should we not patrol neighborhoods and take our chances on being a victim or a crime? Should the media stop reporting all the crimes involving black youth so the rest of us don't use that information? What should we do?

Calling the shooter "white" is as a blatant example of racism as Trayvon being profiled by the killer. There is still a huge problem with race in this country. You don't find the problems only in mixed race neighborhoods. I wouldn't live near an all-white trailer park, either. Or in a ganged-up Hispanic neighborhood.

If people were marching with signs that say, "No Guns For Neighborhood Watch" or, "Detain People Who Kill Other People" I wouldn't have a problem with it and I would totally agree. Instead we get signs advertising race and asking not to be judged. Until the entire segment of our population who commit the most crime steps up and starts modeling good behavior and keeping a closer eye their own kids, nothing is going to change.

If I were there, I would be carrying a sign that says, "Send Them Back To Mexico!" hahahaha

be sure to see the animation video in post 178.

just for the record, zimmerman has a Peruvian mother, white father.

I'm not sure this story would have been reported much differently if both Zimmerman and Martin were white, or both were Hispanic... One of the main reasons this has become so high profile, in my opinion, is the fact that Zimmerman was essentially left to walk away after shooting and killing someone. He wasn't properly interrogated and it seems the "stand your ground" law and the fact that he was a neighbor watch patoller enabled him to claim self defense without law enforcement following up properly, even though they had the 911 calls. Law enforcement fucked this one up, imo.

Any family whose child was killed and saw nothing happening to the killer might reach out to the media. I'm glad they did; this story deserves to be told and might help prevent future abuse of the law and/or apathetic investigation. There is a reason the Chief stepped down. We wouldn't have seen Al Sharpton and maybe not Obama making comments on behalf of the family if this was a same-race killing, but likely other high profile persons would have jumped into the mix to support the victim's family and condemn law enforcement's handling of the case. Obviously, some segments of the black community believe strongly that racism cost Martin his life or speedy investigation and feel the need to protest on that basis. That probably woul not have played out the same if it was a same-race killing...
I don't know if Zimmerman was a racist and that's what cost Williams his life, or if law enforcement would have acted more responsibly if Martin had not been black. Waiting to hear more details. But, even if so, there's a lot more to this story than racism.

This guy sums it up pretty well:

Reading about Trayvon reminded me of the list of the “don’ts” I received after my sheltered existence in Hazlet, N.J., was replaced with the reality of Newark when my mother remarried in the 1980s.

“Don’t run in public.” Lest someone think you’re suspicious.
“Don’t run while carrying anything in your hands.” Lest someone think you stole something.
“Don’t talk back to the police.” Lest you give them a reason to take you to jail or worse

There was also being mindful that you are being watched in stores. Watched turned to followed as I got older. To this day, if a sales person is overly attentive to what I might be looking for I leave the store. Never to return. And then there was keeping a distance of deniability from white women when walking on the street. Lest you be accused of any number of offenses, from trying to snatch her purse to sexual assault.

In the early 1990s, I saw a T-shirt for sale on Canal Street in New York that neatly and bluntly summed up my frustration with this situation: “No white lady I don't want your purse.”


In order for things to change, to really change, we ALL have to be able to talk about this. Because it exists. It isn't racism to talk about it, it is the beginning of the end of racism. White people are afraid to talk about anything that might be offensive to people of another race so there is no real dialog happening.

What would it be like if we could say:

Whitey: You people are criminals.
POC: No, we aren't. Some of our boys can't get good jobs because the school systems aren't geared for them so they commit more crimes.
Whitey: You don't behave in school so you get in trouble and cause it yourself.
POC: We have behave differently due to cultural differences. But it isn't behaving badly, just differently.
Whitey: We want black youths to have good jobs and not be seen as criminals, too. What should we do?

Somebody give me the answer to that. Anybody.

I'm sad for Trayvon and his family, too, and for the other 30 or so black youths who were also killed during the same time period that nobody noticed. If we stop judging based on appearances will the crime stop? Because I can do that.

(03-25-2012, 12:32 PM)Cracker Wrote: [ -> ]I'm sad for Trayvon and his family, too, and for the other 30 or so black youths who were also killed during the same time period that nobody noticed. If we stop judging based on appearances will the crime stop? Because I can do that.

I agree that the issue of racism and prejudice in general needs to be spoken about if we are to better understand and hopefully minimize hate and crimes that are rooted in it. It's good that people are discussing it.

But, I'm not sure the other 30 or so black youths killed in the same period went unnoticed just because they didn't warrant the same level of media attention and protest. Martin's killing is different. It involves an ignored 911 instruction, no apparent crime committed by the victim, a legal clause that may have been exploited to shield his killer given the killer's civilian "watch" role at the time, and a sloppy investigation. It's a unique story.

Was he attacked walking toward Trayvon or on the way back to his truck? Because that makes a world of difference, especially in the eyes of the law.

I do agree he should have been arrested for instigating whatever happened. That part I understand. As to the other charges, I have no idea.

(03-25-2012, 01:01 PM)Cracker Wrote: [ -> ]Was he attacked walking toward Trayvon or on the way back to his truck? Because that makes a world of difference, especially in the eyes of the law.

I do agree he should have been arrested for instigating whatever happened. That part I understand. As to the other charges, I have no idea.

What makes you think Zimmerman was attacked?

(03-25-2012, 01:20 PM)username Wrote: [ -> ]

(03-25-2012, 01:01 PM)Cracker Wrote: [ -> ]Was he attacked walking toward Trayvon or on the way back to his truck? Because that makes a world of difference, especially in the eyes of the law.

I do agree he should have been arrested for instigating whatever happened. That part I understand. As to the other charges, I have no idea.

What makes you think Zimmerman was attacked?

"Attacked" might have been the wrong word. He got his ass kicked. How did that happen? And when?

(03-25-2012, 01:29 PM)Cracker Wrote: [ -> ]"Attacked" might have been the wrong word. He got his ass kicked. How did that happen? And when?

I see Trayvon as reacting viserally to a real threat on his life and had only one choice left and that was to fight.