(12-03-2012, 07:42 PM)Duchess Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 07:32 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ]If he assaulted someone, and that person had a gun, and used it to kill him, well then, yes, I guess he 'deserved' to die.
If it can be proven that he didn't assault/jump Zimmerman, than no, he didn't deserve to die, and Z should do at least 25 yrs-life.
George instigated this entire thing, it's his fault. One cannot stealthy follow someone & then state he feared for his life to the extent he had to kill the person.
I'm stating now that Zimmerman will walk. No prison time. And it won't be because everyone thinks he's a 'great guy'.
HotD, evidence will show that he feared for his life after being assaulted and having T on top of him.
Sorry, ladies. Not sure why you side with T so fervently, but it is your right to do so.
(12-03-2012, 07:56 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ]HotD, evidence will show that he feared for his life after being assaulted and having T on top of him.
Zimmerman was explicitly told by the 911 operator to “NOT APPROACH THE SUBJECT”, and he completely disregarded that. It is not surprising that when he did confront the Martin that a altercation took place. Zimmerman was looking for a problem, where none had existed. There is no proof at all, that Martin had committed any crime whatsoever during this event. There is absolutely no justification as to what had occurred that night.
(12-03-2012, 08:03 PM)Sphincter Cop Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 07:56 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ]HotD, evidence will show that he feared for his life after being assaulted and having T on top of him.
Zimmerman was explicitly told by the 911 operator to “NOT APPROACH THE SUBJECT”, and he completely disregarded that. It is not surprising that when he did confront the Martin that a altercation took place. Zimmerman was looking for a problem, where none had existed. There is no proof at all, that Martin had committed any crime whatsoever during this event. There is absolutely no justification as to what had occurred that night.
The Facts:
It is not illegal to be on Neighborhood Watch.
It is not illegal to carry a firearm while on neighborhood watch with a valid Concealed Carry Weapons permit.
It is not illegal to observe and track the movements of unknown or suspicious persons in the neighborhood while on Neighborhood Watch.
It is not illegal to track a suspicious person even though a dispatcher has said "we don't NEED you to do that", since it is not an order from police to stop following. Police sources have already issued statements that Zimmerman was NOT ordered to stop following Trayvon, and was not legally required to do so.
It is not illegal to approach someone on foot to ask them their name and what they are doing in the neighborhood. While they are not required to answer, it is not illegal to ask. It is not known that Zimmerman even did this, but if he had, it was not illegal.
It IS illegal to physically assault someone, initiating violence just because you think they may be following you for some reason. Trayvon could have asked Zimmerman why he was following him or called the police to report being followed. Instead, all reports indicate that Trayvon chose to initiate violence against Zimmerman.
It is also generally considered illegal in most jurisdictions, even in cases of self-defense, to continue to attack a person you have knocked to the ground, rather than fleeing the scene, since a person on the ground can no longer block your escape. Yet Trayvon continued to assault Zimmerman who was on the ground (confirmed by one eyewitness so far) and in a manner which could have caused serious head injuries, brain trauma, or even death if the assault had continued.
George Zimmerman did not break the law. He did not initiate violence. He was violently attacked. Fearing for his life, he defended himself the only way he could.
(12-03-2012, 08:09 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 08:03 PM)Sphincter Cop Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 07:56 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ]HotD, evidence will show that he feared for his life after being assaulted and having T on top of him.
Zimmerman was explicitly told by the 911 operator to “NOT APPROACH THE SUBJECT”, and he completely disregarded that. It is not surprising that when he did confront the Martin that a altercation took place. Zimmerman was looking for a problem, where none had existed. There is no proof at all, that Martin had committed any crime whatsoever during this event. There is absolutely no justification as to what had occurred that night.
The Facts:
It is not illegal to be on Neighborhood Watch.
It is not illegal to carry a firearm while on neighborhood watch with a valid Concealed Carry Weapons permit.
It is not illegal to observe and track the movements of unknown or suspicious persons in the neighborhood while on Neighborhood Watch.
It is not illegal to track a suspicious person even though a dispatcher has said "we don't NEED you to do that", since it is not an order from police to stop following. Police sources have already issued statements that Zimmerman was NOT ordered to stop following Trayvon, and was not legally required to do so.
It is not illegal to approach someone on foot to ask them their name and what they are doing in the neighborhood. While they are not required to answer, it is not illegal to ask. It is not known that Zimmerman even did this, but if he had, it was not illegal.
It IS illegal to physically assault someone, initiating violence just because you think they may be following you for some reason. Trayvon could have asked Zimmerman why he was following him or called the police to report being followed. Instead, all reports indicate that Trayvon chose to initiate violence against Zimmerman.
It is also generally considered illegal in most jurisdictions, even in cases of self-defense, to continue to attack a person you have knocked to the ground, rather than fleeing the scene, since a person on the ground can no longer block your escape. Yet Trayvon continued to assault Zimmerman who was on the ground (confirmed by one eyewitness so far) and in a manner which could have caused serious head injuries, brain trauma, or even death if the assault had continued.
George Zimmerman did not break the law. He did not initiate violence. He was violently attacked. Fearing for his life, he defended himself the only way he could.
Can you specifically cite in our Florida Statues; which title you have referenced this material from? Because I can quote you a specific title that negates your entire point.
He could have been attacked because he was stalking someone in a stealth manner. Some people would find that very scary, others would be pissed, some may even confront the person doing the stalking. I don't find that unreasonable at all.
Like I said earlier, he'll end up walking.
He's only in custody now for two reasons: to pacify the black community and to protect him.
He'll walk, but his life in Florida is over as he knows it.
(12-03-2012, 07:56 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 07:42 PM)Duchess Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 07:32 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ]If he assaulted someone, and that person had a gun, and used it to kill him, well then, yes, I guess he 'deserved' to die.
If it can be proven that he didn't assault/jump Zimmerman, than no, he didn't deserve to die, and Z should do at least 25 yrs-life.
George instigated this entire thing, it's his fault. One cannot stealthy follow someone & then state he feared for his life to the extent he had to kill the person.
I'm stating now that Zimmerman will walk. No prison time. And it won't be because everyone thinks he's a 'great guy'.
HotD, evidence will show that he feared for his life after being assaulted and having T on top of him.
Sorry, ladies. Not sure why you side with T so fervently, but it is your right to do so.
I'm not siding with anything other than the concept of sticking to the facts and waiting to hear the full evidence. The facts that we have available now don't support your theory as being an absolute truth. You may be right about some things or wrong about everything. I'm waiting for more information/evidence because I wasn't there that night.
Your painting Martin as having invited what he got and coming across (to me) as if the loss of his life is somewhat insignificant rubs me the wrong way; especially considering that it was Zimmerman who initiated the interaction against 911 dispatch's instruction.
We can agree to disagree, MS. I still like reading all of your posts.
(12-03-2012, 08:20 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ]Like I said earlier, he'll end up walking.
He's only in custody now for two reasons: to pacify the black community and to protect him.
He'll walk, but his life in Florida is over as he knows it.
I want to know what statute you were referencing here in Florida regarding post # 1343?
Pacify the "black community?" Are you kidding? You obviously pay attention to just the bullshit on the news. There were prosecutors, police agencies, and a number of political entities that took notice of this incident. But I guess they don't post all the FACTS in the news! Just the ones that will get racial divides going.
(12-03-2012, 08:29 PM)Sphincter Cop Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 08:20 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ]Like I said earlier, he'll end up walking.
He's only in custody now for two reasons: to pacify the black community and to protect him.
He'll walk, but his life in Florida is over as he knows it.
I want to know what statute you were referencing here in Florida regarding post # 1343?
Pacify the "black community?" Are you kidding? You obviously pay attention to just the bullshit on the news. There were prosecutors, police agencies, and a number of political entities that took notice of this incident. But I guess they don't post all the FACTS in the news! Just the ones that will get racial divides going.
Not kidding.
He'll walk.
When he does, it'll be Rodney King all over again.
(12-03-2012, 08:44 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 08:29 PM)Sphincter Cop Wrote: [ -> ] (12-03-2012, 08:20 PM)Midwest Spy Wrote: [ -> ]Like I said earlier, he'll end up walking.
He's only in custody now for two reasons: to pacify the black community and to protect him.
He'll walk, but his life in Florida is over as he knows it.
I want to know what statute you were referencing here in Florida regarding post # 1343?
Pacify the "black community?" Are you kidding? You obviously pay attention to just the bullshit on the news. There were prosecutors, police agencies, and a number of political entities that took notice of this incident. But I guess they don't post all the FACTS in the news! Just the ones that will get racial divides going.
Not kidding.
He'll walk.
When he does, it'll be Rodney King all over again.
Post conviction opinions are not a point of contention in my mind; until they actually occur.
You still haven't answered my question (x2). You have made a statement regarding law; now give us the statute in Florida that you referenced in the previous post. Or at least reference the material in which you attempt to solidify this “opinion” regarding Florida law that specifically deals with this case.
(12-03-2012, 09:59 PM)username Wrote: [ -> ]I'm confused SC. This article says that George will have a SYG hearing next year. Type s l o w l y for me. I don't understand when you say the law is off the table for Z.
http://mobile.globalpost.com/dispatch/ne...y-bookmark
You are correct; however there are steps in the process. The initial probable cause hearing (failed attempt #1) and then the trial itself; which will give the defense another shot at it again. However, the inclusion of the federal investigation will not help matters at all. Which a number of pages have been sensored to the "public." So it should make for an interesting case.
I am still waiting on my prior question regarding the idea of negating the directions of 911, and following a subject. Love it....can't wait to see the law or reference cited.
Zimmerman: “So I was walking back through to where my car was and he jumped out from the bushes and he said ‘What the f*ck’s your problem homey?’ And I got out my cellphone out to call 911 this time. And I say, ‘Hey man, I don’t have a problem,’ and he goes ‘Now you have a problem.’ And he punched me in the nose. At that point I fell down, I tried to defend myself. He just started punching me in the face. And, uh, I started screaming for help, I couldn’t see, I couldn’t breathe. Then he started taking my head…”
Investigator: “And you’re still standing at this point?”
Zimmerman: “No ma’am, I fell to the ground when he punched me the first time. It was dark, I didn’t even see him getting ready to punch me. As soon as he punched me I fell backwards into the grass. And then he grabbed me and he was whaling on my head, and then I started yelling help. when i started yelling help, He grabbed my head and he started to hit my head into the — I tried to sit up and yell for help and then he grabbed my head and started hitting it into the sidewalk. When he started doing that I, I slid into the grass to try and get out from under him, and so he would stop hitting my head into the sidewalk, I was still yelling for help. I could see people looking and some guy yells out ‘I’m calling 911′ and I said ‘help me, help me, he’s killing me,’ and he puts his hand on my nose and on my mouth and he says your going to die tonight and I, I don’t remember much after that. I just remember I couldn’t breathe and then he still kept trying to hit my head against the pavement, or, I don’t know if it was a sign or what it was, so I just… when I slid my jacket and my shirt came up and when he said your… I felt his hand go down on my side and I thought he was going for my firearm so I grabbed it immediately and as he banged my head again I just pulled out my firearm and shot him.”
George Zimmerman is a fucking liar.
Given that Casey Anthony walked, I suspect George walks too. No matter how it may have started or occurred, he's got injuries that are consistent with getting your ass beat. People saw him getting his ass beat. Martin's only injury was the bullet wound, so he was the aggressor in the physical confrontation. It's likely that will convince at least one juror Zimmerman was in fear for his life.
And whether it is fair or not, the defense is going to get to introduce Martin's social media activity... which curiously was scrubbed prior to this story breaking and becoming a media whorefest. Zimmerman's defense attorney will try to show the Martin was a post smoking thug who looked for trouble to prove he was a bad ass - classic legal character assassination.
What I find most interesting about this case is that there are very few people who believe Zimmerman, yet as more comes out the physical evidence seems to back up his version of events.
I'd like to pound the snot out of George myself.
JB, unfortunately, I think it could play out the way you described but that doesn't make it right. George was the aggressor at least up until the very last. It will be interesting to see what comes out at trial.
George is a little dude who felt like a big man with a weapon in his possession. I don't condone fist fighting but a real man would have used his fists. George is a pussy who was on the verge of getting his ass handed to him until he pulled out a gun. He's a fuckin' coward.
(12-03-2012, 10:45 PM)Adub Wrote: [ -> ]George Zimmerman is a fucking liar.
Really?
What's your version of what happened?